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Support needed - PIP form questions about getting out and about

This discussion was created from comments split from: New category - disability news.
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Also I can't risk showering on my own as it's over the bath and I fell 4 times last year and if I fell in the bath can't bear to think what would happen. I have neuropathy in both legs so very wobbly and can't feel my feet especially with my eyes closed for hair washing. I have described why I need help but they still say I only need aids. (one rail held with both hands so how do I wash?) Gov.are looking at the rules now about risk and reliability but I don't even know the old rules either. That is what my question was.
Senior online community officer
I'm not absolutely sure what the original question was but looking at your post above, 1d. in the mobility component is a tricky one. I'm assuming you made your claim before 16th March, so the old rules would apply (before the recent PIP amendments). However, the DWP are also appealing against the decision which said you could get those 10 points where you couldn't follow an unfamiliar journey without help due to psychological distress. So a decision maker could decide not to make a decision whilst they are waiting for that appeal decision (under what are called anti-test case rules).
What I would say is that the general principles of PIP, that you can't do an activity unless it is safe, still applies - so arguably, it isn't safe for you to undertake unfamiliar journeys without help, because of the risks of your vision going. You do not need to have a particular diagnosis by the way - but the problems you have do need to stem from your physical or mental condition. Evidence is really useful as I'm sure you know, which can be medical, or examples of when this particular risk (the vision going) occurred.
As for washing and bathing, you mention that it isn't safe to shower on your own. I'm not sure what you mean by the old rules, but a recent case has clarified what the DWP should be applying when they look at risk (which is part of the general principle that you should not be considered to do something if you can't do it reliably - that includes safely, to an acceptable standard, within a reasonable time period and repeatedly).
The case ([2017] UKUT 105 (AAC)) said that the risk only has to be something which could happen. There's a risk if taking steps to prevent the risk (such as having someone with you) is reasonable. The risk of an event doesn't have to be more likely than not. So going back to your question, you should mention that you are wobbly and can't feel your feet, that even with the aid you have you fell 4 times last year - that the aid is useless because you feel you have to hold on with both hands to be safe and therefore you can't wash yourself.
I'd point out though that it's the same number of points (2) for needing supervision as it is for needing an aid or appliance, and it's also only 2 points for needing assistance to wash below the waist. You can get 3 points if you need help getting in or out of the shower, and 4 if you need help to wash between shoulders and waist. If more than one descriptor applies for the same amount of time, the highest should be selected. However, if you need someone to be there for supervision, but not to actually help you wash, I'm afraid it is the same number of points (2) as you get for needing an aid.
Hope this clarifies.
Will
For showering I am a lot clearer about the criteria and I meet the need for help to wash all over. I need to hold on with both hands as one hand does not support me enough when I can't feel my feet. Especially with my eyes closed I feel as if I'm floating and moving about when I'm not. It's really scary. I fell in the garden last year when hubby was out and couldn't move. I did manage to get up with a struggle but was very shaken.
I'm just waiting for my 3rd decision and trying to tell the others on here that the MR can be repeated if you complain about the assessment and send in more evidence and another letter. I don't even have to appeal as I'll have another month from the 3rd "brown envelope if needs be.
I am just posting in regard to your comment that you had heard that the 'DWP were appealing against the new rules but were unlikely to win because of the authority of who made them'.
The original cases around PIP mobility were made by an Upper Tribunal. Unfortunately, the DWP are able to challenge these decisions to a higher court and as such there is no guarantee that they are unlikely to win, it will e up to this higher authority.
Good luck with your MR.
Regards
Maria