Has anyone migrated from ESA to UC by keeping claim open? My savings are about to go over £16k — Scope | Disability forum
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Has anyone migrated from ESA to UC by keeping claim open? My savings are about to go over £16k

Bud18
Bud18 Community member Posts: 12 Connected
edited October 2021 in Universal Credit (UC)
Hi, I will be receiving a lump some of money in the near future that will take me over 16K savings. I have been told that I can keep my ESA claim open and migrate over to UC when it goes below 16K and my support group status will be retained. Has anyone got experience of this? Also I have been told that my ESA claim can be retained and then I can go back to it when I get below 16K in savings? Is this true? Impossible to find out this info online. Thanks 
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Comments

  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 53,320 Disability Gamechanger
    HI,
    I see you were given some advice regarding this on a previous thread, here. https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/80188/inheritance-and-benefits#latest
    Did you ever ring DWP to find out what exactly your ESA claim is made up of? If part of it is Contributions based then this will continue because savings/capital do not affect it.
    All means tested benefits will naturally end once the money goes into your account.
    If part of your ESA is contributions based then once your savings go below £16,000 you will be able to report the changes and they will assess circumstances for the income Related part to be added to your ESA.
    If you want to claim help with any rent then yes, you'll need to claim UC.
    If you have a read through the advice on that thread linked about calcotti has already given you some good advice.
    The main thing is, for you to find out exactly what your ESA claim consists of.

    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • Bud18
    Bud18 Community member Posts: 12 Connected
    Hi, I don’t phone the benefits, it’s too stressful. I’ve looked at my ESA letter and I’m income related only. I was looking for anyone who had actual experience from keeping an esa claim open  and keeping their NI credits, and then migrating to UC as Calcotti has mentioned. Finding it hard to find out more about that side of things. I have heard you can’t keep ESA claim open.
  • calcotti
    calcotti Community member Posts: 10,010 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi, I don’t phone the benefits, it’s too stressful. I’ve looked at my ESA letter and I’m income related only. I was looking for anyone who had actual experience from keeping an esa claim open  and keeping their NI credits, and then migrating to UC as Calcotti has mentioned. Finding it hard to find out more about that side of things. I have heard you can’t keep ESA claim open.
    As advised in your previous thread
    https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/80188/inheritance-and-benefits#latest
    calcotti said:..what you should do is inform ESA about your savings (when you have them). This will end your entitlement to any income based payment. However you can maintain a 'credits only' claim (technically there is no such thing but this is what it is usually referred to). This means you continue to get Class 1 NI credits and that you work capability status is preserved (subject to any health reassessment in the normal way). You would still need to declare your health condition when claiming UC and they would probably expect a Fit Note but you could inform them about the ESA credits only through a note in your journal. You should then be treated as LCWRA which means you don't have to look for work - but I think you would have to wait four months before getting the extra money.
    I should however correct the last sentence of that previous reply - I now think that if you are getting credits when you claim UC you will be entitled to the LCWRA element.

    As explained, although even DWP will refer to an ESA credits only claim, you are not actually keeping an ESA claim open, you would be claiming NI credits on the grounds of Limited Capability for Work.

    The situation would be different if any of your ESA was contribution based.


    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • Bud18
    Bud18 Community member Posts: 12 Connected
    Thanks, do you know if this happens automatically or do I have to ask for my NI credits to be continued and a credits only claim? 
  • calcotti
    calcotti Community member Posts: 10,010 Disability Gamechanger
    I think it should be automatic but I don't have experience of it. I suggest that when you report the capital you state clearly that you wish to continue to receive NI credits on the grounds that you meet the conditions for the ESA Support group.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • Bud18
    Bud18 Community member Posts: 12 Connected
    Ok thanks. Would be great to hear if anyone has had actual experience of having to do this. Have you actually seen this written in DWP legislation? Be great to have a copy of it .
  • calcotti
    calcotti Community member Posts: 10,010 Disability Gamechanger
    edited October 2021
    Have you actually seen this written in DWP legislation?
    Although administered by DWP the claiming of NI credits on the grounds of Limited Capability for Work isn't part of a benefits legislation. It comes under the Social Security (Credits) Regulations 1975.
    The Social Security (Credits) Regulations 1975 (legislation.gov.uk)
    Regulation 8B (2) (iv), (iva) and (v)

    I can't find a regulation in the Universal Credit Regulations 2013 which deals with whether or not the LCWRA element is payable from the start of the claim if the claimant is getting NI credits and I remain unsure about this. There was guidance about LCW element (for those eligible) starting from the start of the claim for claimants in receipt of credits on the grounds of LCW. See
    ADM Chapter F5: The LCWRA element (publishing.service.gov.uk)
    Appendix paragraph 14.
    By inference I would expect the LCWRA element to start from the beginning of the claim - but I can't confirm this.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • calcotti
    calcotti Community member Posts: 10,010 Disability Gamechanger
    edited October 2021
    Upon further investigation I have found this which confirms LCWRA would be payable from start of the claim
    ADM Chapter M6: Effects of transition to UC – Digital service area (publishing.service.gov.uk)
    paragraphs M6225 and M6226.
    M6225 Where
    1. an award of UC is made to a claimant who was not entitled to old style ESA on the relevant date (see M6221) and
    2. before the relevant date, it had been determined that the claimant would have LCWRA and
    3. the notional assessment phase had ended the claimant is treated as having LCWRA without the need for the WCA . ..

    M6226 Where M6225 applies, the LCWRA element is normally included in the amount of UC award to the claimant from the beginning of the first assessment period . The guidance about the relevant period before which the element is not included in the UC award in ADM Chapter F5 (LCWRA element) does not apply.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • Bud18
    Bud18 Community member Posts: 12 Connected
    That’s great, thank you so much. Much appreciated.
  • Bud18
    Bud18 Community member Posts: 12 Connected
    Hi, I realise this is from awhile ago, but was looking for some help. I have my UC interview soon and I'm so stressed about it. I have said in my journal about ESA credits only and being treated as LCWRA (no acknowledgement from them). The interview is to show ID but I wondered if I should mention to them the credits only thing? And also what else will they ask me at the interview? Will they make me look for work? really upsetting not knowing what will happen.
  • Bud18
    Bud18 Community member Posts: 12 Connected
    calcotti said:
    Hi, I don’t phone the benefits, it’s too stressful. I’ve looked at my ESA letter and I’m income related only. I was looking for anyone who had actual experience from keeping an esa claim open  and keeping their NI credits, and then migrating to UC as Calcotti has mentioned. Finding it hard to find out more about that side of things. I have heard you can’t keep ESA claim open.
    As advised in your previous thread
    https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/80188/inheritance-and-benefits#latest
    calcotti said:..what you should do is inform ESA about your savings (when you have them). This will end your entitlement to any income based payment. However you can maintain a 'credits only' claim (technically there is no such thing but this is what it is usually referred to). This means you continue to get Class 1 NI credits and that you work capability status is preserved (subject to any health reassessment in the normal way). You would still need to declare your health condition when claiming UC and they would probably expect a Fit Note but you could inform them about the ESA credits only through a note in your journal. You should then be treated as LCWRA which means you don't have to look for work - but I think you would have to wait four months before getting the extra money.
    I should however correct the last sentence of that previous reply - I now think that if you are getting credits when you claim UC you will be entitled to the LCWRA element.

    As explained, although even DWP will refer to an ESA credits only claim, you are not actually keeping an ESA claim open, you would be claiming NI credits on the grounds of Limited Capability for Work.

    The situation would be different if any of your ESA was contribution based.


    Hi, I realise this is from awhile ago, but was looking for some help. I have my UC interview soon and I'm so stressed about it. I have said in my journal about ESA credits only and being treated as LCWRA (no acknowledgement from them). The interview is to show ID but I wondered if I should mention to them the credits only thing? And also what else will they ask me at the interview? Will they make me look for work? really upsetting not knowing what will happen.
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 53,320 Disability Gamechanger
    If your ESA claim remained as a credits only claim then you will be treated as having LCWRA from the start of your claim. I have no idea if your ESA would have automatically been credits only or whether you should have asked for this. The only way of knowing for sure is to ring ESA and ask them. Yes, you should mention this during your appointment.

    Did you report your health condition when you first claimed UC? If you did then they may ask you to provide a fit note. (standard procedure) If your ESA remained as credits only then it often takes a few weeks to send your details from ESA to UC. Once this is done you'll then need to accept your new claimant commiments which will be just to agree to report any changes.

    Whether you'll need to attend any future appointments or be asked to look for work will depend on your ESA claim.



    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • Bud18
    Bud18 Community member Posts: 12 Connected
    If your ESA claim remained as a credits only claim then you will be treated as having LCWRA from the start of your claim. I have no idea if your ESA would have automatically been credits only or whether you should have asked for this. The only way of knowing for sure is to ring ESA and ask them. Yes, you should mention this during your appointment.

    Did you report your health condition when you first claimed UC? If you did then they may ask you to provide a fit note. (standard procedure) If your ESA remained as credits only then it often takes a few weeks to send your details from ESA to UC. Once this is done you'll then need to accept your new claimant commiments which will be just to agree to report any changes.

    Whether you'll need to attend any future appointments or be asked to look for work will depend on your ESA claim.



    They said on the phone my ESA claim would stay open for NI contributions only, and this would mean I would go straight into the LCWRA group once I started claiming UC. I never got it in writing, which I asked for, incase they claimed this wasn't the case.
    I reported my health conditions when I applied for UC, they haven't mentioned a fit note yet. 

  • Bud18
    Bud18 Community member Posts: 12 Connected
    Bud18 said:
    If your ESA claim remained as a credits only claim then you will be treated as having LCWRA from the start of your claim. I have no idea if your ESA would have automatically been credits only or whether you should have asked for this. The only way of knowing for sure is to ring ESA and ask them. Yes, you should mention this during your appointment.

    Did you report your health condition when you first claimed UC? If you did then they may ask you to provide a fit note. (standard procedure) If your ESA remained as credits only then it often takes a few weeks to send your details from ESA to UC. Once this is done you'll then need to accept your new claimant commiments which will be just to agree to report any changes.

    Whether you'll need to attend any future appointments or be asked to look for work will depend on your ESA claim.



    They said on the phone my ESA claim would stay open for NI contributions only, and this would mean I would go straight into the LCWRA group once I started claiming UC. I never got it in writing, which I asked for, incase they claimed this wasn't the case.
    I reported my health conditions when I applied for UC, they haven't mentioned a fit note yet. 

    Also in my to-list its asking me about work I can do. I can't work and I haven't worked my whole adult life. Should I tell them this in my journal and mention why they haven't asked for a fit note?
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 53,320 Disability Gamechanger
    That question is standard procedure when you first claim UC, just tell them you haven't worked and were claiming ESA until X date and that claim should have been credits only when payments ended because of too much savings.

    When you claimed if you reported your health condition, that should have prompted it to ask you to report a fit note.
    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • Bud18
    Bud18 Community member Posts: 12 Connected
    That question is standard procedure when you first claim UC, just tell them you haven't worked and were claiming ESA until X date and that claim should have been credits only when payments ended because of too much savings.

    When you claimed if you reported your health condition, that should have prompted it to ask you to report a fit note.
    should I get a fit note anyway? or ask in the journal about this? its all very confusing. 
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 53,320 Disability Gamechanger
    If they ask for a fit note then get one. It would be helpful if you could contact ESA just to check that your NI credits continued since your payments ended. 
    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • Bud18
    Bud18 Community member Posts: 12 Connected
    I told them about my circumstances and they said I need to mention it at a commitments interview. They have also asked for a fit note but that is dated from today. I'm so confused as to how this all works. I thought the ESA claim being kept as credits only would mean I wouldn't need to go through all this, and it would be automatic to go from that to LCWRA?
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 53,320 Disability Gamechanger
    It's normal for them to request a fit note when you first claim UC. Do you know for certain that your ESA claim remained as NI credits only?
    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • Bud18
    Bud18 Community member Posts: 12 Connected
    I haven't been able to phone them, but it was only a few weeks ago they said on the phone that they were. 

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