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Motability advance payment hikes for automatic vehicles

leecool1

Hi all my name is lee,
As a disabled person I am so grateful that there is this fantastic oportunity to be able to drive a reliable car every 3 years.
However I have a real nasty taste in my mouth when it comes down to the advance payment. Why does the advance payment for an automatic Ford Focus cost nearly £2000 and the same car but manual is free lets say. Now Im no expert but I would hazzard a guess that most of the people wanting a Motability vehicle, would need an automatic car. Now heres the thing, the most cars required are automatics and they are nearly 3 times the advance payment over a manual car.
I put this information to my local MP and I got the pittyful answer saying that autos are more expensive to make, service repair etc. Here' s the thing, most manfacturers offer a five or more years warraty or even a hundred thousand mile warranty, some manfacturers even longer.
Motability users only have the car for 3 years, so that argument holds no water.
We are being exploited for needing the more expensive automatic cars.
I would like to hear what others may think.
Thanks for reading.

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Comments

leecool1

Hi, thanks for the reply.
I only used the focus as an example, all automatic advance payments are approx double / treble the price of a manual car.
We only have the vehicle for 3 years before changing, so we are covered under the warranty for faults etc, so being more expensive to repair etc shouldn't be our burden to bare!
It not fair to drivers that can only drive automatic vehicles!
Electric or Hybrids are out of the question too! It would be the perfect platform to advertise electric and advanced eco technology to the country, you think the government would dip a finger in the pot to promote their promise to clean up our country.

BrettW

I ordered my Mokka back in December. Its the top trim and automatic and at the time was £0 AP which was a bonus. In the January update it has now risen to a £349 AP.

Automatics are more expensive to make and I suppose when Motability negotiate their prices with each manufacturer the manufacturers naturally ask more for the automatic version than the manual.

This is not a case of Motability ripping off disabled people it just a case of basic economics. They cost more to make and the manufacturers charge Motability more to buy them.

poppy123456

Yes, automatics are always more expensive than manuals. There are some autos that don't have such high AP with motability.

Ford Focus £2,000 AP? I've just looked and they start at £995.

Why is a hybrid out of the question? Self charging hybrids do not need to be charged through electric. MPG is a lot higher too, especially in the warmer months. There's some of those on motability with zero AP and some that are less than £500.

I have one and during the warmer months i acheive 65+ MPG. I've had mine for almost 2 years now and would definitely have another for my next one.

66Mustang

It's not really a fair metric to compare the advance payments in percentage terms because what the advance payment does is fund the difference in the price that Motability have to pay to acquire the car for you.

The retail price of an automatic is often £1,000 to £2,000 more than the manual version of the same car.

If the Advance Payment of a manual version of whatever car is £499 and Motability have to pay £1,000 more to purchase the automatic version, they have to pass that cost to the customer so the advance payment would be £1,499. You could say it's triple, which is true, but sort of not fair to compare the two numbers. Really you are just paying the difference between the retail price of a manual and that of an automatic.

I hope this explains it a little bit.

OverlyAnxious

I don't understand which Focus you're looking at? The Active, Active X and ST Line X all cost exactly the same for both manual and automatic.

The Titanium & Titanium X cost just £100 more for the automatic version compared to the manual.

It's also worth noting that the automatic gearbox on the Focus is now only an option with the 155bhp mild hybrid engine. Some of the manuals are the 125bhp non-hybrid engine which is a cheaper engine to produce.

leecool1

The Ford Focus was just a blind example not fact I was just trying to iterate that most of the cars needed are automatic and they are the most expensive when the only difference is between the two cars is a gearbox why should that be priced at three times a normal car which more people probably don't need a manual car

BrettW

You are only looking at it from the viewpoint of the needs of a disabled person though @leecool1.

You have to remember these cars aren't manufactured specifically for Motability but for the whole driving population in general.

The fact of the matter remains that automatic vehicles do cost more to manufacture and that these extra costs have to be passed along to the consumer and its just unfortunate that a lot of disabled people require a vehicle that costs more to manufacture. There is nothing underhanded going on here by Motability and Motability cannot force the manufacturers to sell them automatics for the same price or cheaper than manuals just because a lot of scheme members would need one.

It's just basic economics at work

poppy123456

I still don’t understand your example because the ford focus auto isn’t priced at what you said it was.

It’s not just disabled people that drive autos, they are more popular now than they ever were.

Some disabled people still drive manuals too.

Jimm_Alumni

For me it is quite an interesting topic. My partner only drives automatics because she learnt to drive in the States. Where a manual is far rarer than automatics are in the UK! Automatics are generally easier to drive, but they cost more to make and for Motability to procure. I understand why the scheme has to put that added cost onto the person getting the car. I can also see there being a number of people who can drive an automatic fine, but would have trouble with a manual. So they are paying out more for something they see as needed/mandatory for them. It isn't a perfect system, but few systems are.

leecool1

I"m not knocking the motability scheme directly it is an observation. It seems to be a lot more to pay out on a car with just a different gearbox, modern manufacturing should make it a lot cheaper to make automatic gearboxes than they used to, especially when a high quantity of cars have DSG gears now. Manual and auto in one car.
The manufactures could help too with their billions!

OverlyAnxious

Have you seen inside a DSG gearbox? It's far more complicated than a manual box, full of electronics to control the clutches and select the gears. They also require their own module (ECU) to control all of those electronics which can cost £1000+ on it's own. The engine ECU also has to be programmed differently to work efficiently with the gear ratios in the automatic. The centre console has to be designed and built differently to house the automatic gearchange, the driveshafts are often different, and as fewer auto's are built, the manufacturers can't get the same level of bulk discount on those parts that they can with the manual parts. Modern manufacturing simply cannot make an auto box cheaply.

Personally I'd gladly have paid the AP to get the type of car I needed back in 2019. I was never allowed on the scheme because I didn't fit perfectly into the PIP descriptors. IMO either the descriptors need to be broadened or Motability need to allow manual applications for those of us that don't fit the PIP descriptors.

Wibbles

The resale value of the automatic vehicle is also more than a manual - so when you've had your 3 years use - it should be worth more than a manual.

Also an Automatic tends to be less thrashed than a manual - so makes a good second hand buy !

mightyelvis

How can an all electric Skoda Enyaq that costs at least £36,000 be nil advance payment, when a Hybrid Dascia Jogger that costs around £24,000 is about £1000 advance payment as well as taking all your allowance and any increase

Wibbles

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/916824#Comment_916824

Ask Motability

But I guess that it is something to do with "availability"..

Motability do not charge - based on value / price of vehicle !

They charge based on how many of a specific vehicle they can get their hands on/supply

Peckhamboy

I'm just about to receive a new car and with my rough calculations my monthly charge is very similar to leasing a car outside of motability apart from the free servicing and parts.

leecool1

This is where I belive I have a point? Elec cars are hugely expensive, more than an autos are for sure! My point is the elec vehicle is 0 AP against an equivelent auto £2000 or more, that trumps the more exspensive to make argument. October last year I went to Cupra for a Formentor plug in hybrid the AP was £99, we looked on the laptop in Cupra to order the car and missed the last 1 by 6 minutes, gutted! We were told theyre stuck in customs and to call back in a fortnight, but by the way the Ap goes up to £28000 tomorrow.I Was far from happy let me tell you. It wast a kick in the teeth for me!

Justify that!

poppy123456

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/970483#Comment_970483

Are you sure the AP increases tomorrow? Price changes for Motability change on 1st Jan, 1st April, 1st July and 1st Oct.

https://www.motability.co.uk/get-support/faqs/what-happens-when-prices-change/

If you've already placed an order for a vehicle, that AP you pay is the price it is when you order the vehicle.

leecool1

Gh couldnt order because they hadnt been cleared by customs.

And this was in October, not recent.

Annamieka

No, we're certainly not being ripped off. It's just autos are more expensive and Ford is one of the more expensive marc's. As we move to EVs (which are all auto of course) the advance payments are likely to go up further, as these vehicles are dearer.