PIP, DLA and AA
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Will the DM ring the healthcare professionals I wrote down on my form for further proof?

tdotmelty27tdotmelty27 Member Posts: 22 Listener
edited February 2 in PIP, DLA and AA
Do the dwp DM always ring health care professions who i have wrote down on my fourm do they contact my gp and my mental health nurse or do they sometimes call them depending if they need any more proof?

Replies

  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,334 Disability Gamechanger
    They rarely contact any of them other than in very limited circumstances. It’s not something you can rely on at all. Far better to concentrate on a quality claim pack and get advice on that if you don’t feel able to do that yourself. 
  • janer1967janer1967 Community champion Posts: 7,305 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi 

    They sometimes send a form for them to complete 

    However it is your responsibility to provide medical evidence but only relevant if it states how your daily living or mobility is affected 

    Things like physio or ot report or mental health nurse someone who has witnessed you carrying out the activities 
  • MarkN88MarkN88 Member Posts: 401 Pioneering
    Mostly it’s down to you to provide the evidence. 

    Medical evidence is not needed for a successful claim as it’s not about diagnosis. 
  • woodbinewoodbine Member Posts: 2,893 Disability Gamechanger
    If you chose to send supporting evidence it's best to make sure its relevant and fairly recent, too much and they possibly won't read most of it.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,334 Disability Gamechanger
    MarkN88 said:
    Mostly it’s down to you to provide the evidence. 

    Medical evidence is not needed for a successful claim as it’s not about diagnosis. 
    Very much depends on the type of claim. Where a person lacks insight into their own condition medical evidence can be pivotal.
  • BrettWBrettW Member Posts: 607 Pioneering
    Im pretty sure that they got hold of my medical notes because I didn't send any medical evidence with my claim. The assessor actually mentioned to me things about my medical history that even I wasn't aware of. In the notes on the report she actually refers to elements of my medical history that weren't discussed on the day either. So its probably a random thing as to whether they do or not
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 434 Pioneering
    Even when they do contact GPs the response they get is often useless. Particular these days when most patients don’t see the same GP every time the GP filling out the form often has no idea how patients are impacted by their healthy condition.

    PIP is all about impact, not diagnosis - although letters confirming a diagnosis, if available, can be helpful in supporting what you say about impact.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • tdotmelty27tdotmelty27 Member Posts: 22 Listener
    Thank you so much for the replys just was worried as gps and that aint always the most helpful as i see different gps also other health professions are not always the easiest to contact and dont always see how i am on a daily basis so sometimes they can seek more evidence but sometimes not i guess.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,334 Disability Gamechanger
    calcotti said:
    Even when they do contact GPs the response they get is often useless. Particular these days when most patients don’t see the same GP every time the GP filling out the form often has no idea how patients are impacted by their healthy condition.

    PIP is all about impact, not diagnosis - although letters confirming a diagnosis, if available, can be helpful in supporting what you say about impact.
    Well that’s a novel take. I’ve yet to see any later confirming diagnosis make a contribution to a discussion on functional consequences. 
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 434 Pioneering
    mikehughescq said: Well that’s a novel take. I’ve yet to see any later confirming diagnosis make a contribution to a discussion on functional consequences. 
    That wasn’t what I meant to suggest - sorry you read it like that. What I meant was for example, if you say you can’t walk very far because of the pain you experience as a result of the tumour in your leg it is, in my opinion, helpful to have a letter that confirms you do indeed have a tumour in your leg. However not everyone with a tumour in their leg their leg will be affected in the same way so the diagnostic letter is not sufficient.

    Hope that makes more sense.

    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,334 Disability Gamechanger
    Yes and no. 

    The number of cases in which diagnosis is disputed are so low as to be negligible. Indeed I can’t remember the last time I came across one. Literally decades ago. The advice in such cases is that evidence of diagnosis is not needed unless in dispute so why bother. More is not better when it comes to evidence. Evidence focused on specific gaps is what matters. 

    If you make the assertion you have a tumour on your leg, that will be accepted unless you put something else in your claim pack which contradicts it. Once you’ve made the assertion and, assuming no contradictions, the only relevant evidence will be on its impact on functional ability which is best served by your detailed description of real world examples. A GP letter adds nothing to that. 

    I’m saying that from my perspective but also because we know that DMs give near zero weight to such things and I’ve never yet sat in a tribunal which turned on GP evidence.
  • woodbinewoodbine Member Posts: 2,893 Disability Gamechanger
    I think there is a good case for trying to make advice on benefits as simple and straight forward as possible, anything else is just confusing for many people who have little knowledge of a complicated system.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,334 Disability Gamechanger
    Indeed. 

    That’s why my line on PIP is zero medical evidence unless it’s mental health or leaning disability i.e. conditions where people might lack insight into their own condition.I think the closest I’ve come to a medical report in the past 5 years has been the odd CVI and maybe one audiology report. The rest is pulling out those detailed anecdotal incidents. 
  • woodbinewoodbine Member Posts: 2,893 Disability Gamechanger
    Would have to disagree I have always for my own claims included relevant and recent evidence successfully and would always advise others to do so where possible.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,334 Disability Gamechanger
    edited February 2
    I’ve not suggested leaving out relevant or recent medical evidence at any point but the reality is that very little is relevant. Any report containing diagnosis, symptoms and treatment is irrelevant for PIP unless those things are explicitly disputed. Prognosis is useful for the forward test but in most cases it’s self-evident anyway. I am happy to challenge anyone to demonstrate that their claim turned on a specific piece of medical evidence and why. Only in MH or LD cases. 

    Over the years I’ve had people give me detailed consultants reports from work or elsewhere running to pages. The level of detail is often truly impressive. Multiple reports too. If it doesn’t explicitly address your specific issue with an activity then it’s of little value. 

    I’ve said this before many times but a report talking in general terms about the symptoms you ought to be experiencing is worthless. A medical professional does not prepare food for you; eat with you; toilet with you; bathe with you; watch you managing many aspects of reading or budgeting and they certainly shouldn’t be staying overnight to watch you do any of those things. 

    If they repeat what you tell them about your ability to reliably perform those activities then that certainly adds credibility but that element is not medical evidence as it hasn’t involved any kind of direct assessment. It’s repetition and as such it’s weighted as less credible.than medical evidence. 

    A lot of people will put this stuff in simply because 
    - they have it and can’t imagine not using it.
    - they’re scared to not use it. 
    - it’s what they’ve always done.
    - their claim succeeded last time with that evidence so it must be that, right? 
    - everyone on forums tells them this is what they should do.
    - web sites almost without fail tell them that’s what they should do. 

    None of that makes a recent piece of evidence relevant or useful.
  • BrettWBrettW Member Posts: 607 Pioneering
    Don't know how relevant this is but in my recent assessment the assessor has directly referenced my medical notes as a basis for why she recommended the points she did.

    When I had a heart attack last year it killed part of my heart. During the interview when we were talking about my mobility and the problems therein she actually asked me if the hospital had mentioned a medical term to me (I've since found out the term she used is what described why part of my heart has died). I told her no because they hadn't.

    In the report she actually states that my breathing problems are consistant and backed up by my medical notes and history. So I suppose there are times when medical diagnosis and reports do help the assessor make a conclusion
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,334 Disability Gamechanger
    Those occasions when they seek that advice are laid out in the HCP guidance from DWP. They remain more breached than observed.
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