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Evidence for a Tribunal

saraleighuksaraleighuk Member Posts: 4 Listener
edited November 2017 in PIP, DLA and AA

Following my PiP assessment I was downgraded to a standard award and don’t agree with the reasoning for this. For example I cannot stand up from sitting on a chair or toilet but they won’t include this in the toiletting score as first the assessor said that because I have good dexterity in my hands I can get up from the toilet, and when appealed I was told that as I can get out my car I can get off the toilet or a seat (please tell my muscles that, also my car is a high up car and I did state I do need help out the car at the end of the day as I’m tired) 

It didn’t help the situation that I ensured my assessment was at a location that had 2 Disabled bays outside so I could walk in and show how it affects me, but on the morning they had a skip delivered and parked it over both bays and meant I had to park some distance away so had to use my mobility scooter and although I offered to get out to show I can’t stand up unassisted I was told it was fine. Grr and did mention about the skips too to both them and PiP as if I was alone I wouldn’t have been able to attend.

Anyway, I heard it mentioned somewhere that people have used their previous DWP reports for PiP evidence. I was much more mobile and capable then and got the higher award. I will be getting a report from my hospitals for the appeals, but just wanted to check the previous reports are available from the PiP information line (I don’t want to call for them to tell me they aren’t as the person doesn’t know what they’re doing)

Also, I have Muscular Dystrophy and it won’t get any better (unless there’s a miracle cure) but I’ve been told I’ll be reassessed again in 2022. Am I able to ask them to consider a decision for life if they find I am at the highest award? I will only stay the same or get worse. 

Thank you



  • MarkmywordsMarkmywords Member Posts: 421 Pioneering
    Hello @saraleighuk ,

    The Tribunal will want to focus on the evidence you gave for the recent assessment. They will decide if the DWP acted properly in reaching their decision on it.

    However, since DWP decisions are based on contradicting the evidence you should concentrate there.

    Go through the PIP descriptors and explain how your statements and evidence should have given an "x" points award. You can introduce new medical evidence that supports the truth of your statements and medical conditions.

    Yes, you can ask for the term to be reviewed in the hope of the "it is not appropriate to set a term." award (or whatever the wording is.)
    However, the DWP will still assess you in 10 years "for your own good" and "to make sure you are receiving the correct support."
    It has been said that the DWP will claim "new evidence" means the court award can be superseded. So you might have another fight then.
  • Pippa_AlumniPippa_Alumni Scope alumni Posts: 5,851 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @saraleighuk, and welcome to the community!

    So sorry to hear about your recent experiences, and particularly about the skips blocking the disabled bays: that's appalling! Markmywords has given some good advice above, but let us know if you need any further clarification or if there's anything else we can assist you with. You might also be interested in Scope's advice on appealing a DWP decision.
  • saraleighuksaraleighuk Member Posts: 4 Listener
    Thank you both, that’s great to hear. 

    I’m just worried I’ll have to go through this all again in a few years if it is agreed, but hopefully I’ll be able to base anything on this decision. (I plan too far in advance!)

    I’ve got my reasoning behind why I believe I should be entitled to each score so I’ll concentrate on getting the medical evidence now. Thank you :)
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,987 Disability Gamechanger
    You can use DLA evidence medical reports for PIP but you will still need up to date evidence. A tribunal faced with nothing but 5 year old evidence will either be one you lose at worst or at best they adjourn for medical records from your GP. 

    Medical in itself is of little use unless it fills a gap or resolves a specific area of dispute. Far better to concentrate on your own descriptions. So, for example, getting up from a chair isn’t relevant to any daily living descriptors. Getting up from a toilet is. However, you need to say way more. If you can’t get up without assistance then why, for example, are rails not installed? If they were then that’s 2 points straightaway. You need to tell recent stories shout about exactly what has happened when you try to do each activity and not just assert “I can’t do it because I have”. 
  • saraleighuksaraleighuk Member Posts: 4 Listener
    Thank you. Unfortunately I can’t get up even with handrails and even explained to the assessor that an occupational therapist put in a report for a toilet riser lift which I’m currently trying to fund as the council won’t pay the £3500, and currently have to rely on being physically lifted up. The reason I said getting up from a chair was just so they can see how I have to be lifted etc in the assessment as an example as first she said as I have good dexterity I could get up myself, but I don’t have the muscle strength in my back, legs or arms to get up 

    they don’t seem to be able to take my word for it - I wish I could just film my whole day to show everything lol 
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,987 Disability Gamechanger

    There is nothing in theory to stop you filming excerpts of your day and submitting it as evidence. In practice you can just imagine the DWP countering with "how do we know she's not acting?" etc.

    DWP decision making ought to be on the balance of probabilities i.e. that something is more likely than not. If you say something and they have no contrary evidence and the statement itself is not inherently contradictory then it should be accepted. In practice they've always been culturally resistant to such an idea. Tribunals, much less so.

    The type of stuff you're putting in this thread is exactly the sort of thing which needs to be said. Full explanations and anecdotes.

    Finally, note that if you get an ongoing award with no end in practice that means 10 to 20 years but AR1 short review forms are being sent out at the 3 year point regardless and you will need advice at that point as just filling in "no change" will trigger a further face to face assessment.

  • saraleighuksaraleighuk Member Posts: 4 Listener
    Thank you. It’s so frustrating as I used all the above and more as evidence to appeal to DWP and it’s like they didn’t even read it but at least at a face to face tribunal it will definately be reviewed and I can answer their questions to further explain.

    Thank you 
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,987 Disability Gamechanger
    Yup. People live in fear of appeal hearings but, to some extent with PIP and HCP reports, you're kicking at an open door. There can undoubtedly be bad experiences but the majority are positive. It's often the case that people are so used to being on guard and at battle stations that they misread the questions of a tribunal as being aggressive and adversarial whereas they may just be trying to pull out the right answers. The key is to go in knowing exactly which points you should score and why but to go beyond that and have at least a couple of examples for each one. Anecdotal evidence is what wins the day in most cases.
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