A bolt from the blue

GettinOlde

This is a message I just posted to my UC work coach ...

I had a phone call (number withheld) at 9:39 this morning from a lady claiming to be from Worthing(?) DRT.

(The lady had a strong  foreign accent which was difficult to hear/understand - my interpretation follows)

She said as they were unable to contact my CAB representative, they were calling me directly to inform that they have reversed their decision and are going to reinstate my original claim for ESA WRAG.

She asked if it was ok for them to cancel the tribunal hearing, to which I agreed, but she couldn't advise me about my current UC claim and the new UC50 that is ongoing

Do you have any advice, please?

Forgot to say I believe she mentioned backdated payment, but I'm not sure I should have agreed to cancel the tribunal hearing.

So, not as difficult for some as it is for some others, considering my MR and appeal for tribunal had no supporting evidence from any medical professionals.

Prior to starting this post, I made a call to CAB regarding the lack of communication with my representative - no one was available to take my call so left details for a callback.

CAB just called back, it just happened to be my representative, offering no explanation for being incommunicado but (long-story-short) doesn't have a clue what happens next regarding my current claim for UC credit.

I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall. ?

Adrian_Scope

That’s good news about your ESA.

Can you remind me what stage you’re at with your UC50 on Universal Credit? Are you awaiting assessment or awaiting decision? 

Also, when did your claim for ESA begin?

GettinOlde

@Adrian_Scope

As soon as I was informed of DWPs decision that found me fit for work, I made an immediate claim for UC as I would have had no other means of financial support. I also started providing fit notes which triggered a new WCA for which I am waiting on the decision for the UC50 that was hand delivered on 17/6/2019.

GettinOlde

@Adrian_Scope Actually, is there any difference between ESA50 and UC50 forms? I've only heard reference to UC50.

Adrian_Scope

Hi @GettinOlde. What I’m trying to establish is when your claim for ESA originally began? It needs to have been in place before April 2017 for there to be any additional money for you on UC. As you are in the LCW/WRA group not LCWRA/Support group there is no premium for this unless your claim began before April 2017. 

Your ESA decision will transfer over to Universal Credit, however as a new WCA has been triggered you will need to continue with this and any decision they make will supersede the ESA decision. 

With regards to the forms, they are both work capability assessment forms, just one is for ESA and the other for Universal Credit. 

GettinOlde

@Adrian_Scope My initial claim for ESA was about 7 years ago I think, I remember the tribunal's decision was that it should not be reviewed for 2 years but it came up for revision at the beginning of this year.

GettinOlde

Just called the 0800 328 5644 UC helpline, they didn't have a clue how to advise me and just referred me back to my work coach.

poppy123456

HI,

That's great news. For the ESA decision you'll be backdated any money owed from the date you were found fit for work, which will include the extra money for the WRAG because your claim started before April 2017.

As Adrian has advised, your WCA assessment for UC will continue.

Adrian_Scope

GettinOlde said:

@Adrian_Scope My initial claim for ESA was about 7 years ago I think, I remember the tribunal's decision was that it should not be reviewed for 2 years but it came up for revision at the beginning of this year.

That’s good news. As Poppy said it means that you will receive the additional money for the LCW group. As you claimed UC as soon as your ESA ended, any backdated money should come from UC. It will take a while to be put into action though and you will still have to continue with the UC50 WCA. 

GettinOlde

@Adrian_Scope @poppy123456

Could this retraction by DRT be used in support / in evidence for the ongoing process if necessary?

poppy123456

Absolutely no reason why it can't be used as evidence for your current WCA.

GettinOlde

Progress at last.

I called the UC helpline (reference this post) and eventually spoke to someone called Danielle.

After several "I don't know, let me put you on hold while I speak to a colleague who has access to more of your files than I do.", I was informed that my claim for ESA has now been transferred to my UC account and that I would be put on LCWRA; Danielle even had the UC50 process, triggered by submitting Fit Notes, cancelled. It is now just a matter of playing the waiting game for everything to take effect.

I feel a little more at ease now.

poppy123456

GettinOlde said:

Progress at last.

I called the UC helpline (reference this post) and eventually spoke to someone called Danielle.

After several "I don't know, let me put you on hold while I speak to a colleague who has access to more of your files than I do.", I was informed that my claim for ESA has now been transferred to my UC account and that I would be put on LCWRA; Danielle even had the UC50 process, triggered by submitting Fit Notes, cancelled. It is now just a matter of playing the waiting game for everything to take effect.

I feel a little more at ease now.

Are you sure it's LCWRA? This is equivalent to ESA Support Group and i thought you said you were given WRAG for the ESA which is LCW for UC.

Adrian_Scope

Hi @GettinOlde, it does sound like some positive progress is being made at last! Have they added any notes to your journal yet? It's great if they have managed to cancel the UC50 and transfer your decision from ESA. 
Please do check the groupings though, if you were WRAG on ESA it should be LCW on UC, if Support Group, it should be LCWRA. I'd hate for them to place you in the wrong group and down the line ask for the money back. 

GettinOlde

I don't know for sure but I recorded the telephone conversation and the advisor mentioned the figure '336' and LCW WRA.

Here's a 4-minute audio clip of the conversation - the figure '336' and LCW WRA mentioned at around 1 minute.

(Excuse the West Country accent ?)

https://youtu.be/BqZx_clPtAs

Adrian_Scope

You’re right she definitely does say that but sadly it doesn’t mean that she’s not mistaken.

Do you have your ESA decision letter? Can you confirm what group they put you in? Was it definitely WRAG (where you are expected to undertake work related activities) or was it the Support Group? 

GettinOlde

Adrian_Scope said:

You’re right she definitely does say that but sadly it doesn’t mean that she’s not mistaken.

Do you have your ESA decision letter? Can you confirm what group they put you in? Was it definitely WRAG (where you are expected to undertake work related activities) or was it the Support Group? 

The recent ESA decision, 29th March 2019, was that they found me fit for work until DWP heard that it was going to tribual and then the Disputes Resolution Team informed me that my previous claim would be reinstated -  I had been on ESA WRAG, not Support Group, since 2012.

The terminology gets confusing ...

1. ESA Work Related Activity Group
2. ESA Support Group
3. UC LCW (Limited Capability for Work)
   
4. UC LCW WRA (Limited Capability for Work - Work Related Activity)
   

Are 1&3 similar and 2&4 similar - or ist it the other way around - 1&4 and 2&3?

April2018mom

My only piece of advice is to call them to politely ask for clarification. 

GettinOlde

@April2018mom This is what I mean, I don't seem to be able to get a straight answer from anyone, UC advisor or work coach, about anything, and the reason why I wanted to speak directly with my Case Manager.

poppy123456

It’s 1&3 and 2&4.

I agree the Adrian you need to find out because if they pay you the extra LCWRA element instead of just the LCW and this is an error then you will end up owing DWP money.
Unfortunately for UC if DWP make an error then this is recoverable, unlike it was with the old legacy benefits. 

Adrian_Scope

The terminology is definitely confusing @GettinOlde! It’s because they use the work related activities part to mean opposite things depending on the benefit.

The Work Related Activities group (WRAG) on ESA is the same as Limited Capacity for Work (LCW) on Universal Credit.

The Limited Capacity for Work and Work Related Activities (LCWRA) is the same as Support Group on ESA. 

What was the decision from your ESA offer? And have you had any changes to your Universal Credit statements or journal yet? This should clear up which groupings you’ve been placed in.