LCWRA question and ESA migration

SJM2023 · February 2023

Hi, new to the forums so looking for some advice.

Basically i have two separate questions:

I am currently in receipt of UC standard amount and awaiting an assessment for LCW/LCWRA.
If i am put into the LCWRA support group and awarded the monthly £354.28 is this an additional amount on top of the standard UC £334.91 amount and without any deductions made (I don't owe any amounts) so £689.19 monthly?
I also get an additional £247.41 in housing benefit with my standard UC amount.
I also get PIP daily living standard.
I'm single and live alone with no children.

Second question:
I have a friend who is considering changing over from contribution based ESA to UC.
He is currently in the ESA support group so he should be automatically moved into the LCWRA group of UC.
He was under the impression he would then receive the UC standard amount + the LCWRA amount.

Today he called scope as well as CAB and was was told that contribution based ESA runs alongside UC and so there would be a deduction and that he would only be marginally better off migrating to UC. CAB calculated this at around £50 each month.

He currently receives just over £400 ESA, he is in the ESA support group continuously since 2016. He also receives pip.

So, is there any specific reason why someone moving from contribution based ESA (support group) to UC and LCWRA would get significantly less monthly than say i could possibly get, as by our calculations and based on the advice he got today he would be getting £200 + less?

I'm possibly missing something obvious, but not sure.

A little confusing i know, sorry.

poppy123456 · February 2023

For your UC unless you're living in either supported or temporary housing then your rent will be paid as part of your UC known as housing element and not housing benefit. Housing benefit is a completely different benefit.

If you're privately renting and your PIP includes the daily living part then your housing element should be based on 1 bedroom rate of Local housing allowance.

If you're found to have LCWRA then yes your monthly amount will be as you stated. Don't forget about the annual increases of 10.1% in April.

Your friends ESA, you said they are claiming Contributions based and then mentioned they receive just over £400, i'm assuming that's a fortnightly amount? If so then their ESA includes the SDP because they live alone? and no one claims carers allowance or carers element of UC for looking after them. So their ESA would be known as Income Related and not contributions based. Though part of it maybe contributions based.

If your friend claimed UC then yes they would be worse off because there's no disability premiums payable with UC. They would be entitled to the SDP transitional protection but would still be worse off. For this reason i don't advise them to claim UC because they will be worse off.

calcotti · February 2023

I agree with everything Poppy has said. The only thing that would make a difference is if your friend rents their home but is not receiving Housing Benefit.

SJM2023 · February 2023

Thanks for that.

As for myself, i live alone in a 3 bedroom house, local council, and so i have the 2 room "bedroom tax" amout deducted from my housing element monthly.
You have clarified i would get the additional LCWRA (if awarded) as an additional amount to the standard UC so that's good.

As for my my friend, no he receives £235.20 every 2 weeks ESA (support group). He lives alone with nobody caring for him. PIP daily living too.

So from his calculations there is a shortfall of £218.79 every 4 weeks/monthly of what he would have expected to get. That's the £689.19 that i could be entitled to, compared to the £470.40 he currently receives every 4 weeks on ESA

I'm still confused why he wouldn't get a similar amount if migrating over?

calcotti · February 2023

SJM2023 said:I

As for my my friend, no he receives £235.20 every 2 weeks ESA (support group). He lives alone with nobody caring for him. PIP daily living too.

You confused us by referring to £400 of ESA. If he gets £117.60 it is indeed contribution based ESA. When did he claim ESA? It’s important to know if he gets old ESA or new style ESA. Does he rent his home and does he get any help?

SJM2023 · February 2023

Thanks for helping.

He made his claim for ESA in 2016 and he gets new style ESA.

He lives alone and owns his own home with his mortgage paid.
Get no additional help except pip

Obviously he was looking to migrate over to UC as he assumed he would significantly better off, based on someone getting UC standard amount + LCWRA amount.

poppy123456 · February 2023

SJM2023 said:

Obviously he was looking to migrate over to UC as he assumed he would significantly better off, based on someone getting UC standard amount + LCWRA amount.

He can claim UC providing he doesn't have savings/capital of more than £16,000. The home he lives in doesn't count as capital.

His ESA will continue as normal and be deducted in full from any UC entitlement. He will be entitled to the LCWRA element from the start of his claim.

calcotti · February 2023

He can certainly claim UC alongside the ESA - he will not switch over. If he has no other income then his UC will give hive some additional monthly payment as well as the fortnightly ESA. If he has any savings over £6,000 there will be a reduction of UC by £4.35/month for every £250 of savings, or part thereof, over £6,000.

SJM2023 · February 2023

Thanks.

So he would receive the monthly LCWRA amount of £354.28.

As his ESA amount is £470.40 every 4 weeks (£235.20 every 2 weeks)
What amount would he receive after deductions?

calcotti · February 2023

The ESA is equivalent to £509.60/month and that is the amount deducted from the UC.

The maximum UC is LCWRA element £354.28 and the standard allowance of £334.91. This makes a total maximum amount of £689.19/month. Deduct the ESA and this leaves ESA payable of £179.59/month.

SJM2023 said:
Today he called scope as well as CAB and was was told that contribution based ESA runs alongside UC and so there would be a deduction and that he would only be marginally better off migrating to UC. CAB calculated this at around £50 each month.

I have no idea why you were told the difference is about £50/month. As you can see it’s a bit over £41/week.

poppy123456 · February 2023

He would receive his ESA of £235.20/fortnight. Equivalent of £509.60/month. Remember there’s 4.3 weeks in a month and not 4 weeks.

There will be a deduction of £509.60/ month from his UC for the ESA. So his UC will be £179.59/month.

Therefore he will be £179.59/month better off.

SJM2023 · February 2023

Thanks for helping!
I understand the calculations now, and the deduction is from the UC standard amount + LCWRA amount, leaving £179.59/month in addition to his ESA monthly amount.

It's the same amount which I could get so I'm sure he will migrate over now.

One last question please, so there isn't any real change as regards to the support groups as he just continues in the ESA support group?
He was concerned that changing to the LCWRA group of UC (as he assumed would happen) could possibly cause a face to face assessment.

calcotti · February 2023

He will still be in the ESA Group and will have LCWRA status for UC. No further assessment is required for the latter.

SJM2023 · February 2023

That's all good news then!
Thanks for your time, both of you, and have a nice evening.

LCWRA question and ESA migration

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