Would I qualify for PIP?

loz_

Hi everyone,

I was just wondering if anybody could advise me on if my conditions would enable me to qualify for PIP. The physical health condition I suffer with is joint hypermobility disorder diagnosed by a rheumatologist which affects my ability to do things and go out fairly often due to joint pain and frequent joint subluxations and I also suffer from fatigue due to this condition. There are other symptoms but I don’t think they would be relevant. I also suffer from three mental health conditions which are: schizoaffective disorder (basically schizophrenia and bipolar disorder), borderline personality disorder and body dysmorphic disorder all of which have been diagnosed by a psychiatrist. My schizoaffective disorder is much more manageable now due to new medication but has required six psychiatric hospital admissions and many referrals to the crisis team and trips to A&E due to severe episodes of psychosis. I still have some residual psychotic symptoms but I don’t believe they are real currently. My borderline personality disorder still affects my life massively and I am currently doing dialectical behavioural therapy to try and reduce my suffering. My body dysmorphia is bad too and stops me from going out sometimes. I am currently under the care of adult mental health services but have been been with mental health services since the age of 13 (I am 25 now). I was with childrens mental health services up until I was 14 and then I was with the early intervention in psychosis team until I was 18 and I have been with adult mental health services ever since. I have trialled at least 12 or 13 medications over the years (mainly different antipsychotics as the majority of my main issues with mental health have been with psychosis up until fairly recently). I am currently on a high dose of an antipsychotic, a mood stabiliser, an antidepressant and occasionally a prescription medication for insomnia but that is very infrequently. I also take prescription painkillers for my joint hypermobility syndrome and I am awaiting a prescription for medication for my GI issues caused by my JHS.

Thanks for any advice given!

calcotti

PIP is not based on particular health conditions. It is assessed on the impact your health has on your ability to carry out specific activities reliability.

See
https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/pip-points-system?rCH=-2

loz_

Thank you for the info @calcotti. I will have a read, my community mental health nurse wasn’t clear on what the requirements were.

L_Volunteer

It sounds frustrating that your community mental health nurse wasn't clear on what the requirements were @loz_

Please don't hesitate to let us know if we can clarify anything else for you 

AndyH64

There are some online tests that can give you an idea if you could go for PIP. Search online PIP points test. Answer those questions honestly and it will tell you potentially how many points you could get. I found that helpful before I first claimed PIP a few years ago.

poppy123456

AndyH64 said:

There are some online tests that can give you an idea if you could go for PIP. Search online PIP points test. Answer those questions honestly and it will tell you potentially how many points you could get. I found that helpful before I first claimed PIP a few years ago.

In my opinion that self test isn't helpful, especially if you don't fully understand the PIP descriptors and what they mean, many people don't. It's very easy to underscore yourself and over score yourself. Even if you answer them honestly.

Best thing for anyone to do before applying is to do some reasearch and to try to understand the PIP descriptors first. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-assessment-guide-for-assessment-providers/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria

loz_

Yes it was @L_Volunteer thank you for your help!

Thanks for the advice @AndyH64 and @poppy123456 I will have a look into it. Much appreciated!

AndyH64

Hi Loz,
So poppy is quite right to advise looking into descriptors. Once you have done so the online PIP test is a good guide. I have just taken it as a matter of interest and the points that came back are still identical to what I actually got. It could be worth ringing welfare rights if you do decide to apply for PIP.
They will arrange for somebody to help you fill out the form over the phone. They are trained and know what language to use. They won't rush you and can actually fill it out on the phone with your input and then post it to you. I consider myself reasonably articulate but still glad I took their help.

Cartini

Hi Loz_

I`m not qualified / experienced enough to give you PIP advice, so I will say how I approached my application.

Write down on a piece of paper all your "challenges" (ailments) and then try looking at yourself from "out of you" if that makes sense.  For each of your challenges, cover each room in your house (and be embarrassingly honest with your replies).

When you cook food, do you have to sit down to prepare food? If so, why?  Sitting down was classed as an aid for me because I get excruciating lower back pain when I stand to prepare food.

My food preparation knife skills are very good when I stand, but when I sit they aren`t.  In fact, I`ve taken off the tip of my right index finger when trying to use knives the way I do when I stand.  This falls under safety.

Think about the bathroom; do you need to hold on to the sink / towel rail when you clean your teeth?  I do, and this was accepted as an aid and safety.

When you have a shower or a bath, do you use grab bars for support? These are aids and assist with safety.

Do you take medication for your ailments?  A dosette box is classed as an aid. I`m going to assume you have a smartphone of some description; setting reminders to take your medication classes the phone as an aid.

Do you have problems getting in and out of chairs?  Do you have problems using stairs?  If so, be brutally honest. 

As you read more discussions on here, and receive advice from those in the know, you will see that a common theme is "provide evidence of something that has happened to you, how it affected you and who (if anyone) saw you".  Be brutally blunt.  By brutally blunt I mean don`t hold back.  Part of my evidence covered a period where I had a bad stomach but couldn`t get to the toilet in time.  I described the feeling of distress at the mess I had to clear up (carpet) and at how I had to shower to clean myself up (with the associated pain that showering brings).

I also have a grab bar in the toilet to aid my sitting and standing.

For dressing I use a litter grabber to pick my clothes off the floor then I have to lean against something while I "jiggle" my underwear (and then shorts / trousers / leggings) in an attempt to catch one foot then the other.

I kept a diary for a week; I was going to do 2 weeks but the days were repetitive so only did one week.  Some people will advise doing this, some will say not worth it.  I did, whether it helped or not I can`t say.

Poppy has provided you with a link to the descriptors; these will definitely help you.  I hope my slant helps you too.

Andy

loz_

Hi @poppy123456, @AndyH64 and @Cartini,

Thank you for your replies, they were very helpful after reading about PIP and looking into other benefits I am not entirely sure whether I would qualify for PIP even though some of it is relevant to me but I am pretty certain I would qualify for ESA due to my mental and physical health issues. I will speak to my mental health nurse and ask her for her opinion when I see her during the week. I will take into account everything you have all said.

Everybody’s help has been much appreciated

poppy123456

I wouldn't discount PIP without getting some expert advice. It took me quite a few years to gain the knowledge i have and to fully understand the descriptors and what they mean. I wouldn't expect anyone to understand them enough to decide whether there's any entitlement in such a short space of time.

With regards to ESA the only ESA you can claim is New style ESA and this will depend on your NI contributions in tax years 2020/21 and 2021/22, so you will need to have worked during that time. If you haven't then you won't be entitled to any payments.

There's Universal Credit, which is means tested. Whether you're entitled will depend on your circumstances. If you live with a partner you claim as a couple and your joint circumstances will be taken into consideration. If you have savings/capital of more than £16,000 you're excluded from claiming. Use a benefits calculator to check entitlement. https://www.entitledto.co.uk/benefits-calculator/Intro/Home?cid=3485c1c5-597c-4c28-9754-e183d3d6fe87

If you do qualify then when you claim you'll need to report your health condition and then send a fit note within 7 days of that. Providing you're not working and earnings more than 16xNMW per week then you will be referred for a work capability assessment. (same process as ESA).

Cartini

poppy123456 said:

I wouldn't discount PIP without getting some expert advice. It took me quite a few years to gain the knowledge i have and to fully understand the descriptors and what they mean. I wouldn't expect anyone to understand them enough to decide whether there's any entitlement in such a short space of time.

Good point Poppy,

I`ll refrain from guiding people towards the link; I`ll leave that to people who do understand it (yourself and Calcoti).

chiarieds

Hi @loz_ - I agree with poppy that PIP is still worth looking into, & you may find the following helpful as it relates to completing a PIP claim form if you have mental health problems: https://www.mentalhealthandmoneyadvice.org/en/welfare-benefits/pip-mental-health-guide/help-with-your-pip-claim/how-to-fill-in-the-pip-form/

As she advises, you can always get some expert advice, so you could look here: https://advicelocal.uk/  choosing 'Welfare benefits' from the drop down menu to see if there's a Welfare Rights office near you (or Citizens Advice).

I also agree with Cartini about keeping a diary for a week, this can serve as a reminder of any functional difficulties you face when coming to fill in a PIP claim form. I kept one for 8 days (must have forgotten how many days in a week there are!) & sent it off with my claim form to illustrate how I was affected; I kept it brief, but said how many subluxations I had had each day & when I was in pain & why; how this all affected my ability to attempt/do any applicable descriptor, & where I needed help even if that help wasn't available. Likewise I have no idea if this actually helped my claim.

PIP is how your disability affects you the majority of the time, which is helpful if your disability fluctuates.

If you decide to go ahead & claim, you'll find a lot of help on this forum.

P.S. your rheumy is a bit behind the times as far as naming your disorder; it should be Hypermobility Spectrum Disorder or hEDS (hypermobile type of Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome).

calcotti

The (long) read that does help to understand how PIP is assessed is here
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-assessment-guide-for-assessment-providers/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria

chiarieds

Which poppy has already given!

calcotti

chiarieds said:

Which poppy has already given!

Missed that! Reading on my phone which is never ideal.

loz_

Hi @chiarieds and @calcotti, 

I will have a look at the links you both and Poppy provided and have a chat with my MH team/rheumatologist to see whether they also think it may be worth giving applying for PIP a go. I will also take a look at the advice on this forum and ask any questions I have if needed. 

If I choose to go ahead with it after reading your links and speaking to my various teams I will definitely keep a diary. Would it be good to do this with an ESA application too if I apply? 

P.S. I have been told by a few people now that she is behind the times in terms of the name she used for my disorder. She also said that I don’t meet the criteria for hEDS as I don’t have any cardiac issues. Would this be accurate? I remember you saying you have the condition yourself @chiarieds and I think you said you are a retired physio too?

Thanks!

calcotti

In case you haven’t seen this information
https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/ehlers-danlos-syndromes/

poppy123456

Do you have the correct NI contributions for New style ESA? You can check here https://www.gov.uk/check-national-insurance-record
Are you currently working? 

loz_

Thank you for the link @calcotti,

I have all of the symptoms listed plus others associated with hypermobility disorders I was told other than internal issues (that I know of, they didn’t run any tests for anything like that) and incontinence.
I do have a lot of GI issues though which I understand is common with hypermobility connective tissue disorders. My rheumatologist is aware of all of my symptoms of course.

loz_

I will have a look at the link you have provided  @poppy123456 and check. 

I am not currently working because I have some mobility issues and a lot of pain/joint subluxations and other troublesome issues due to my physical health problems and ongoing MH issues which I have recently come out of hospital for. My MH team and my rheumatologist have suggested I am unfit to work currently so that is why they have suggested applying for some sort of benefit which I 100% agree with as I have very limited money at the moment and I am currently living with my parents and I do not want to take advantage of their kindness; I would like to make some sort of contribution until I am able to live alone.

Sorry for the massive load of information!