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DWP calling tomorrow-I might qualify for extra ESA

0ptimistic

Apologies in advance for the long post.

I claim wholly contributions based ESA, I receive, from my ex-employer a monthly occupational pension of £611, so a little bit of ESA is deducted.

In 2021 I was clearing out my paperwork, and I discovered a half completed form ESA(IBR), asking for income from Jan 2014 to July 2018.

I was really scared because I had nearly £7000 worth of charitable funding, between Jan 2014 to July 2018, I had not declared at the time, but I immediately took the bull by the horns and phoned the DWP, I spoke to a call handler who said someone would call back in 3 days. I was expecting them to give me some penalty for not notifying them of the funding at the time. Nobody called back.

I lost my courage until today, when I did some research on Bard, google's AI chatbot, which said to phone them. It said that while charitable funding does not affect ESA I should have rang the DWP, they may penalise me, but they will help as much as possible, so I plucked up the courage to ring them again.

It turns out that they had sent me the ESA(IBR) to see what extra money I would be entitled to, but as I did not take it further, investigations were not made to see if I was entitled to some income related ESA.
She said it was an exercise carried out in 2018 to see who was losing out on benefits they could claim.

The lady was extremely helpful, and made my day as I do not owe them any.

She took my autism into account and was really patient.

She is getting the right department to phone me back today or tomorrow, to see if I want to go ahead and see if I am entitled to income related ESA.

What would the consequences be?
Would this mean that I would need to pay some money back for the charitable funding I received back then?
Would my existing contributions based ESA carry on?
What about universal credit if I do get income related ESA?

Many thanks

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poppy123456

I can’t advise about the charity funding. However a pension will reduce any Income Related ESA £1 for £1. With your pension being £611/month this will most definitely reduce any Income Related entitlement to zero going forward.

Whether you were entitled to any Income Related ESA in the past will depend on how long you’ve been receiving your pension for.

Universal Credit is irrelevant here.

0ptimistic

poppy123456 said:

I can’t advise about the charity funding. However a pension will reduce any Income Related ESA £1 for £1. With your pension being £611/month this will most definitely reduce any Income Related entitlement to zero going forward.

Whether you were entitled to any Income Related ESA in the past will depend on how long you’ve been receiving your pension for.

Universal Credit is irrelevant here.

Hello can I ask you some more questions before tomorrow's phone call, as I don't trust the DWP.
I fear them saying one thing and doing another.
They put me on all income based ESA and then they could pay me less when universal credit is applied.
Meaning, they could change my contributions based ESA to income based, which I don't want, as it's safe as CB related.
If it's true that the income based is extra, over and above the £190 CB related ESA I currently receive, then I would be of course happy to receive extra money on top of the CB related ESA even if it does go £1 for £1 with UC.
The lady at the DWP said my Contributions benefit would stay the same, and the possible income related benefit would be extra, is that right?
The lady said, the charitable funding does not matter, as I am currently on CB related, but could not tell me if it would be relevant to any income based ESA extra I might get as she does not work for that team.
I trust this charity more than the DWP.

poppy123456

Once you’re on Contributions based you’ll remain on it as long as you’re in the Support Group.

Income Related would be the top up which would be the Enhanced Disability Premium which is £19.55/week on top of contributions based.

However because your pension works out as £141/week then any Income Related top up will reduce to zero and there would be no entitlement.

This means you’ll remain on contributions based but a reduced amount because of your pension being more than £85/week.

Universal Credit is irrelevant here because no one is automatically placed into it. Even if you did claim it your ESA would continue as normal but be deducted in full. Your pension will also be deducted in full from any UC entitlement. This means if you don’t need to claim for help with any rent then there would be no entitlement to UC anyway.

0ptimistic

poppy123456 said:

Once you’re on Contributions based you’ll remain on it as long as you’re in the Support Group.

Income Related would be the top up which would be the Enhanced Disability Premium which is £19.55/week on top of contributions based.

However because your pension works out as £141/week then any Income Related top up will reduce to zero and there would be no entitlement.

This means you’ll remain on contributions based but a reduced amount because of your pension being more than £85/week.

Universal Credit is irrelevant here because no one is automatically placed into it. Even if you did claim it your ESA would continue as normal but be deducted in full. Your pension will also be deducted in full from any UC entitlement. This means if you don’t need to claim for help with any rent then there would be no entitlement to UC anyway.

Hi Poppy, sorry to be a pest.

My latest ESA letter says this
Your living expenses - £84.50
Limited capability for work addition
Extra Money because you are in the Support Group £44.70
Which gives a total income related amount - £129.50
Income and benefits
Personal health insurance or work related pension for you - £25.96
Your total income - £25.96
Your income related amount is £129.50 less £35.96 so you would have been entitled to - £103.54
However because you are entitled to contribution based Employment and Support Allowance we will pay you £103.54
The amounts on the page apply from 13 April 2023 to 29 November 2023
I am on a reduced amount because of my pension.

Am I right to be doubtful of changing anything over the phone with the DWP?

poppy123456

I know your ESA is reduced because of your pension being more than £85 per week. My calculations say that it’s not being reduced enough.

Your pension is £611/month, which is £141/week. This is £56/week more than £85. For every £1 over £85 your ESA is reduced by 50p, which means your ESA should be reduced by £28/week.

0ptimistic said:
Am I right to be doubtful of changing anything over the phone with the DWP?

Changing what over the phone? Going forward there’s nothing to change because you’re not entitled to any Income Related top up because of your pension.

How long have you been receiving your pension? And how long have you claimed ESA? Do you live alone or with a partner? Are you claiming any disability benefits such as PIP or DLA?

You can certainly be assessed for the income related top up but they will send you the ESA113 form for this. You will need to fill it out and return it with all your information. Going forward there’s no entitlement to the top up.

Please note, this is not a work capability assessment!!

0ptimistic

poppy123456 said:

I know your ESA is reduced because of your pension being more than £85 per week. My calculations say that it’s not being reduced enough.

Your pension is £611/month, which is £141/week. This is £56/week more than £85. For every £1 over £85 your ESA is reduced by 50p, which means your ESA should be reduced by £28/week.

0ptimistic said:
Am I right to be doubtful of changing anything over the phone with the DWP?

Changing what over the phone? Going forward there’s nothing to change because you’re not entitled to any Income Related top up because of your pension.

How long have you been receiving your pension? And how long have you claimed ESA? Do you live alone or with a partner? Are you claiming any disability benefits such as PIP or DLA?

You can certainly be assessed for the income related top up but they will send you the ESA113 form for this. You will need to fill it out and return it with all your information. Going forward there’s no entitlement to the top up.
Please note, this is not a work capability assessment!!

Oh no, does that mean I will have a massive debt, as it's always been reduced by that much?
Have the DWP made an error?

How much have they been reducing it by a week?
Sorry I am confused with all the numbers.

I get £190.94 a fortnight, how much should I be getting?

I'm worried I will have to pay a big debt.

I've been receiving my pension since 2006
I have been claiming ESA since 2014, before that incapacity benefit since 2004
I am on DLA middle rate care
I am now worried they will take off a massive debt because they have not been reducing my ESA enough to accommodate my pension, YIKES!

poppy123456

Looking through your figures again you mention a Personal health insurance or work related pension of £25.96, what’s that for please?

You also mention a Occupational Pension of £611/month do DWP know about this pension?

0ptimistic

poppy123456 said:

Looking through your figures again you mention a Personal health insurance or work related pension of £25.96, what’s that for please?

You also mention a Occupational Pension of £611/month do DWP know about this pension?

I don't know what the personal health insurance is, it sounds like jargon.
I don't know what they mean by £25.96 work related pension.
I just get the pension of £611 a month. Now I am really worried.
The DWP do know about the pension. They said today they do.
It looks like they are giving me under 25 year old rate of 190.94
How much should I be getting?
I'm scare stiff of debt.
I'm really panicking now.

poppy123456

ESA letters are well known for making no sense at all and are often very difficult to understand. Your new rate because of the April Increase will be £103.54/week, which is the reduced Support Group rate because of deductions. It's nothing to do with under age.

You shouldn't owe them anything especially because they know about your pension. I've given all the advice i can give for now and i'm afraid you'll need to wait for the phone call.

0ptimistic

poppy123456 said:

ESA letters are well known for making no sense at all and are often very difficult to understand. Your new rate because of the April Increase will be £103.54/week, which is the reduced Support Group rate because of deductions. It's nothing to do with under age.

You shouldn't owe them anything especially because they know about your pension. I've given all the advice i can give for now and i'm afraid you'll need to wait for the phone call.

Thanks, I will ask them if they are reducing my ESA enough to accommodate my pension and I will ask them what the £25.96 is as I don't have insurance.
I remember a couple of years ago when I was getting a new mortgage as my deal had come to an end, I was worried the mortgage man would tear his hair out as I was so bad with figures but he explained it well.