Esa lwrca payment — Scope | Disability forum
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Esa lwrca payment

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shaybo
shaybo Community member Posts: 12 Connected
Hi I was placed in the support group of esa(contribution)and received a letter saying my money would be going up to 129 a week this is the only income I receive. what I would like to know is do you not get the extra 390 lwrca on esa is it just universal credit you get that payment on I'm not on universal credit so was just wondering if I don't get this extra amount on esa would I then have to claim universal credit to receive this ?.I.have no clue how this all works tia 
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  • bg844
    bg844 Community member Posts: 3,887 Disability Gamechanger
    edited July 2023
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    £129.50 a week is the Support Group rate of ESA, you don't need to claim UC to receive this. However, it might be beneficial to do a benefits calculation to see if there's any entitlement to UC (you will receive LCWRA automatically) although ESA is deducted £1 for £1.

    https://www.entitledto.co.uk/benefits-calculator/Intro/Home?cid=071bd5ed-e7ec-4843-ae1e-5b92a804b480

    Do you receive PIP?
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 54,122 Disability Gamechanger
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    bg844 said:
    £128.85 a week is the Support Group rate of ESA, you don't need to claim UC to receive this. However, it might be beneficial to do a benefits calculation to see if there's any entitlement to UC (you will receive LCWRA automatically) although ESA is deducted £1 for £1.

    https://www.entitledto.co.uk/benefits-calculator/Intro/Home?cid=071bd5ed-e7ec-4843-ae1e-5b92a804b480

    Do you receive PIP?
    Support Group rate for New style ESA is £129.50/week. Assessment rate is £84.80/week and Support Group component is £44.70/week. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/benefit-and-pension-rates-2023-to-2024/benefit-and-pension-rates-2023-to-2024#employment-and-support-allowance-esa

    I did check gov.uk website and the information on there is incorrect. I have tried to report the error on the website for incorrect information but keep receiving an error. https://www.gov.uk/employment-support-allowance/what-youll-get
    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • bg844
    bg844 Community member Posts: 3,887 Disability Gamechanger
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    poppy123456 said:
    Support Group rate for New style ESA is £129.50/week. Assessment rate is £84.80/week and Support Group component is £44.70/week. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/benefit-and-pension-rates-2023-to-2024/benefit-and-pension-rates-2023-to-2024#employment-and-support-allowance-esa

    I did check gov.uk website and the information on there is incorrect. I have tried to report the error on the website for incorrect information but keep receiving an error. https://www.gov.uk/employment-support-allowance/what-youll-get
    Apologies, edited. I was quickly looking for the figure without checking properly (too many amounts on the top of my head!)
  • shaybo
    shaybo Community member Posts: 12 Connected
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    Thank you yes .support group is 44 something a week extra  but on universal credit its 390 a month. so universal are paid more? Its all so confusing yes I receive high rate pip on daily living and high rate moblity 
  • calcotti
    calcotti Community member Posts: 10,010 Disability Gamechanger
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    shaybo said:
    Thank you yes .support group is 44 something a week extra  but on universal credit its 390 a month. so universal are paid more? Its all so confusing yes I receive high rate pip on daily living and high rate moblity 
    Yes UC pays more if eligible but there are many people who can get ESA but would  not be able to get UC.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • bg844
    bg844 Community member Posts: 3,887 Disability Gamechanger
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    Assuming you are over 25 with no housing costs, UC will be worked out as:

    Standard Allowance: £368.74
    LCWRA: £390.06
    Total: £758.60
    -ESA: £561.16
    UC Total: £197.64 a month.

    If you rent, you can claim this through UC too. Obviously these figures may vary dependant on whether or not you have savings (up to £6,000 is disregarded and over £16,000 you are excluded from claiming UC).

    You may also want to check entitlement out to Council Tax Support.
  • shaybo
    shaybo Community member Posts: 12 Connected
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    Thank you 🥰🥰
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 54,122 Disability Gamechanger
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    Entitlement to UC will also depend on your circumstances. If you live with a partner that works then the above figures would be different because you'll need to claim as a couple.
    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • shaybo
    shaybo Community member Posts: 12 Connected
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    No I live on my own and have been using my savings to pay my rent Thanks poppy
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 54,122 Disability Gamechanger
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    You can start a claim here. https://www.gov.uk/universal-credit/how-to-claim As advised above, if you have savings/capital of more than £16,000 you're excluded from claiming. There's a £4.35/month deduction for every £250 or part there of over £6,000.

    You'll be entitled to the LCWRA element from the start of your claim. If you're privately renting your home you'll be entitled to the 1 bedroom rate of local housing allowance. (assuming you're 35 and over or claiming either daily living PIP or mid/high rate care DLA) If not then you'll be entitled to the shared rate.

    Your UC will include housing element as well as the elements mentioned above. With the deduction for your ESA.
    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • pereto
    pereto Community member Posts: 8 Listener
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    bg844 said:
    Assuming you are over 25 with no housing costs, UC will be worked out as:

    Standard Allowance: £368.74
    LCWRA: £390.06
    Total: £758.60
    -ESA: £561.16
    UC Total: £197.64 a month.

    If you rent, you can claim this through UC too. Obviously these figures may vary dependant on whether or not you have savings (up to £6,000 is disregarded and over £16,000 you are excluded from claiming UC).

    You may also want to check entitlement out to Council Tax Support.

    I was reading this post but I still did not quite understand it. 
    Im over 25 with no housing costs, i applied for uc in december and got it and have been receiving the uc amount of £368.74 a month since then. At my first appointment in Jan I was advised by my helpul job centre advisor to apply for esa which I filled out the form and sent it off last month now just waiting. 

    Does mean if successful and into the support/lcwra group I will still get the £368.74 a month plus the extra increase to what the esa support group/lcwra would be a month £569.80 so basically an extra £201.06 a month?

  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 54,122 Disability Gamechanger
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    pereto said:

    I was reading this post but I still did not quite understand it. 
    Im over 25 with no housing costs, i applied for uc in december and got it and have been receiving the uc amount of £368.74 a month since then. At my first appointment in Jan I was advised by my helpul job centre advisor to apply for esa which I filled out the form and sent it off last month now just waiting. 

    Does mean if successful and into the support/lcwra group I will still get the £368.74 a month plus the extra increase to what the esa support group/lcwra would be a month £569.80 so basically an extra £201.06 a month?


    There's no financial gain to claiming New style ESA and UC together because the ESA is deducted in full from any UC entitlement. It does have some advantages because it's not means tested like UC is and you'll receive class 1 NI credits for ESA but only class 3 for UC.

    You will only be entitled to payments for ESA if you've worked at some point in the last 2 tax years and have the correct NI contributions.

    If entitled to ESA payments you will receive £84.80/week. (£169.60/fortnight)
    The amount deducted from your UC will be £367.46/month.
    Total UC payable £1.28 month.
    Total monthly amount for both = £368.74. The same as what it would be if you just claimed UC.

    If placed into the Support Group for ESA you will receive £129.50/week. (£259/fortnight) Payable from 14th week of your claim.

    You will also be entitled to LCWRA element for UC which is £390.06/month. Payable from the 4th month after you reported your health condition/sent your first fit note.

    Your UC would be as advised here.
    bg844 said:
    Assuming you are over 25 with no housing costs, UC will be worked out as:

    Standard Allowance: £368.74
    LCWRA: £390.06
    Total: £758.60
    -ESA: £561.16
    UC Total: £197.64 a month.



    Total monthly amount for both benefits £758.80.
    If found to have LCWRA and placed into the Support Group you will be £390.06 better off each month, with or without claiming ESA.
    Have you reported your health condition for UC and sent in fit notes?
    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • pereto
    pereto Community member Posts: 8 Listener
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    I have reported my condition yes and continually give fit notes as each one expires my doctor is doing 2 month ones now. I filled out and sent in the wca form and now im just waiting for the decision with the inevitable denied letter and having to go through the long process of reconsideration etc.   

    Ive resigned myslef to the fact they will say no especially to the support group as when i originally told the gp about the depression and anxiety he didnt discuss it with me much but referred to talking therapies cbt where I discussed lots with them.  ive put contact details down for both so hopefully the talking therapies cbt lady will be able to tell them everything.


  • A_CRUCE_SALUS
    A_CRUCE_SALUS Community member Posts: 19 Listener
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    Some great answers here guys thank you.
    If I may....I also have a similar issue.
    I am nearly 66 in a few months. Long term sick disabled and was in receipt of full benefits on Incapacity Benefits back in 2013.....they then stop incapacity and changed it to ESA at which point they cut me off completely for 6mths. CAB sorted it all out great. Then when UC came in it was shown if I volunteered to go over to UC I would be better off. I was. Long story short.
    I was getting UC+ESA=PIP for a long time. My ESA was £450.90 a fortnight. UC never quite took the full amount off....but in sept 2023 it was £561 etc - I was also getting LCWRA £390.06..their figures used to go up and down for some reason but the amount I got was always around £750uc which included rent....anyway, the £450 ESA has now gone down to £259 in the bank so for some reason there has been a change their end but not mine. The usual DWP statements just show the usual money you get but I copy and paste a response I gave in moneysaving forums

    "OK just looked at my most recent Jobcentre Plus statement for ESA showing annual rate changes for April. Its added a line which it has never said before.
    From Feb 17 2024 ESA £129
    Then it adds this unusual line (You are not getting any more income-related employment abd support allowance)
    then back to normal lines
    from 13 April 2024 it goes up to £138.
     
    A few pages on it then states how esa IS WORKED OUT
    Limited capability for work addition=£44
    Which gives you a total INCOME-RELATED AMOUNT- £44.70
     
    No income will be taken off your esa bla bla so still £44
    but then
    "However because you are entitled to contribution-based ESA we will pay you" £129
    from Feb 2024"

    I am not on contributions I should be on income as I havent worked in over a decade.

    So any ideas why the sudden changes? TIA
  • Kimmy87
    Kimmy87 Community member Posts: 315 Pioneering
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    Because you transferred from Incapacity Benefit, the ESA became CB based, with an IR top up if eligible. 

    On applying for UC your ESA switched to New Style ESA (current name for CB ESA) and the IR top up should have ended.

    You can't get IR ESA and UC at the same time, because UC is a replacement for IR ESA. 
  • A_CRUCE_SALUS
    A_CRUCE_SALUS Community member Posts: 19 Listener
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    There was a situation around 5yrs ago or so, might have been just after the changes from incapacity. In which I was found to be on contributory which was wrong and I was placed onto income related...and so I thought since then...I think I even got some back pay at the time due to their error.
    Hmmmmm the more I dig into this the less I want to contact DWP to find out lest they just cut me off again while they fix their mess. I just know it will all end in tears.
  • A_CRUCE_SALUS
    A_CRUCE_SALUS Community member Posts: 19 Listener
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    PS my UC changeover was in 2020.
  • Kimmy87
    Kimmy87 Community member Posts: 315 Pioneering
    edited March 31
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    Moving from Incapacity Benefit to CB ESA was correct, where the DWP messed up en masse was not assessing all transfers for the IR top up.

    When the error was discovered, everyone got a form to assess this, and those found eligible were given back pay & the IR top up going forward in addition to the base CB award. 
  • A_CRUCE_SALUS
    A_CRUCE_SALUS Community member Posts: 19 Listener
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    Thanks Kimmy87.  That must explain the issue a few years back then twixt Con/Inc related in my case.

    So can you see anything here to explain why my bank ESA suddenly dropped from £450per fortnight to £259?

    "OK just looked at my most recent Jobcentre Plus statement for ESA showing annual rate changes for April. Its added a line which it has never said before.
    From Feb 17 2024 ESA £129
    Then it adds this unusual line (You are not getting any more income-related employment abd support allowance)
    then back to normal lines
    from 13 April 2024 it goes up to £138.
     
    A few pages on it then states how esa IS WORKED OUT
    Limited capability for work addition=£44
    Which gives you a total INCOME-RELATED AMOUNT- £44.70
     
    No income will be taken off your esa bla bla so still £44
    but then
    "However because you are entitled to contribution-based ESA we will pay you" £129
    from Feb 2024"


  • Kimmy87
    Kimmy87 Community member Posts: 315 Pioneering
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    I think the help you've gotten on MSE indicates there might have been an issue with your IR ESA not ending when you claimed UC.
    And it's that correction which saw your ESA eventually reduce to the correct level. 
    I don't have anything I can add to that  :)

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