Pip assessment report

courtjohns

Hello all,so I got my pip assessment report back today and I’m a tad confused,so there is sections where the boxes are ticked just like the assessment you fill out and then she’s wrote things down that contradicts it so the box ticked says “can cook and prepare meals” and there’s a tick next to it but on a different page it says “can’t cook meals gets mum to cook for her and doesn’t help with any preparation,the most she can do is a sandwitch” can anyone tell me what this means as I’m a tad confused 

Albus_Scope

Heya @courtjohns and welcome to the community.

I can understand your confusion with the reports. The assessors tend to use ticks and dots to signify things, so it can look confusing to us folk not in the know.  I believe one of the regulars has a calculator where you can put the ticks and dots in.  I'll see if I can find it for you.  

courtjohns

I thought they were lying I got so upset and then I found the page with everything I said written down and then I was like ummm now I’m confused one box says I can cook and prepare food and another says I can’t, one box says I don’t take mediation or have therapy and then what’s written down is a list of my medications and me mentioning I’ve been referred for therapy and the side effects from my medication so it’s all very confusing 

TheManFromLondon

@courtjohns

You are confusing what you said, with what the opinion of the assessor is. You may have said a few things, but ultimately the assessor decided you can. One area of your report is mostly what you said (hopefully), but there is another under each category where they put their own findings.

With all that being said, on the page with those ticks, down below, you should read why the assessor choose the tick ie "he said he cant cook", but said x so it is assumed he can cook.

Another is you are referred to therapy, so you don't receive therapy yet. So they say, he doesn't get therapy. etc.

Read it all, from start to end, this report has a magic way of things slipping under you eyes. but dont get too stuck with it and if you feel you should, start an MR.

courtjohns

Another thing I noticed was “she didn’t seem anxious and could tell me her date of birth and national insurance number from memory” “she has 6-7 bad days a month” when I clearly stated that I’m having more bad days than good and I clearly stated that 4/7 days A WEEK were bad not a month and you can clearly hear me mention in the voice recording that I had to take 80mg of propranolol because my anxiety was really bad and that I would be reading from written notes and a copy of my assessment that had my date of birth and national insurance number and also how can they tell if I’m anxious over the phone? she wasn’t there to feel my hands sweating,to see me actually sweating,she couldn’t feel or see my chest getting tight from anxiety,seeing all this lying is making me not want to bother with a MR because they are just gaslighting and lying I feel like giving up

woodbine

Just because they put it in a different way doesn't mean they are lying, was this a copy of the assessment or the decision makers report ? if the former you won't know anything for sure until you get the DM decision, link below outlines the points descriptors,

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/Global/Migrated_Documents/adviceguide/pip-9-table-of-activities-descriptors-and-points.pdf

honeyhoney

Unfortunately, until today I read these stories about the assessor's lies with a grain of salt.

Today I got my DM's decision.
I'm still waiting for the HP report but I know what to expect.

Reading this report is better than many fairy tales and it really made me laugh.
Example: Assessor's question: "do you go to your local shop?" My Answer: "no because... xyz."

DM report says: "You confirmed that you leave home to go to shops."

This is good, so what should we call it?

Or, "evidence shows you have no specialist input for you mental healt." Since I clearly stated and even sent a letter confirming that I was undergoing CBT Therapy

...etc etc if you can't call it a lie then what should you call it ?  

courtjohns

They lied,I have the recording of the assessment and I have the assessment report,she said that I can cook and prepare a simple meal when I clearly stated that my mum does all the cooking and preparing because of my intrusive thoughts,she said that I have 6-7 bad days a month when I said I have 4/7 bad days a week,she said I’m not on medication or doing therapy when I listed my medications AND side effects and I said I’m on a referral list for therapy,she stated that I can leave the house and go out 5 days a week but forgot to mention that its to take my son to school WITH MY MUM that’s it and I stay in other than that,it’s all on the recording but your right I’ll wait for the reward letter,I’ve already started writing up my MR 

courtjohns

And then she tried to trick me at the end and was like “you going anywhere nice today” after I had just sat there for over an hour explaining why I can’t leave the house and how it makes me physically sick 

honeyhoney

Yes... but the fact that he is 100% lying, for example in our case, does not change anything.
Now we need to focus on the MR and possibly the tribunal.
I think it's good that people write about their experiences, it's useful for others, what they can expect.
This was the case in this case. 

I was approved for the LCWRA based on "anecdotal" evidence and only a "list of repeat medications". However, the assessor's report contained exactly what I said.

In this case, despite presenting at least 2 real-life examples in my form for each descriptor that applies to me, I received the standard "copy and paste": "there is no specialist input" or did not “sound breathless” during a telephone assessment. 

See the 2021 thread https://www.rightsnet.org.uk/forums/viewthread/17337/

They didn't even change it in 2023. My report contains the exact same "copy and paste" 

AndrewHall

The Tribunal is well aware of the unreliability of the assessment report and that is why they have specialists on their panel. 

TheManFromLondon

AndrewHall said:

The Tribunal is well aware of the unreliability of the assessment report and that is why they have specialists on their panel. 

Absolutely agree. 

As said here from others, put the report aside. Its a black hole that will take your time and energy trying to deal with it. Trying to counter all inaccuracies and lies will take up so much space in your tribunal submission, that your real points will not stand out enough.

Treat it as your claim in the first place. Tell the tribunal why you believe you should be awarded that or the other descriptor. Forget there was an assessment before and state your case from the beginning with the tribunal panel.

With all that said, once you have all done, you can make some notes on the report, just in case DWP say  "you said that", so you be emotionally prepared to say "i never said that" or "what i said was this".

honeyhoney

TheManFromLondon said:

Treat it as your claim in the first place. Tell the tribunal why you believe you should be awarded that or the other descriptor. Forget there was an assessment before and state your case from the beginning with the tribunal panel.

With all that said, once you have all done, you can make some notes on the report, just in case DWP say  "you said that", so you be emotionally prepared to say "i never said that" or "what i said was this".

yeap... that's what I'm going to do, thanks to this forum and the people who give advice I learned a lot and honestly I was prepared for it 

honestjon

honeyhoney said:

Unfortunately, until today I read these stories about the assessor's lies with a grain of salt.

Today I got my DM's decision.
I'm still waiting for the HP report but I know what to expect.

Reading this report is better than many fairy tales and it really made me laugh.
Example: Assessor's question: "do you go to your local shop?" My Answer: "no because... xyz."

DM report says: "You confirmed that you leave home to go to shops."

This is good, so what should we call it?

Or, "evidence shows you have no specialist input for you mental healt." Since I clearly stated and even sent a letter confirming that I was undergoing CBT Therapy

...etc etc if you can't call it a lie then what should you call it ?  

They tell lies and they do it quite often.
I wonder how they are allowed to tell so many lies without losing there jobs. Anyone else would be sacked for lying 

honestjon

AndrewHall said:

The Tribunal is well aware of the unreliability of the assessment report and that is why they have specialists on their panel. 

The tribunal seems to try to be fair. It would be better if they could punish the dwp for lies and harassing unwell people 

courtjohns

I had a text on Thursday at 8am to say I have been awarded yayyyyy!!! I am now going to ring on Monday morning and ask what I’ve been awarded and if needed to be I’m going to finish my MR and I have treated it as if I in doing the assessment again,I’ve gone through all the questions and wrote a very detailed response to the questions and I have based the answers to my questions on real life events and described when these things have/are happening 

honeyhoney

Great news 

honeyhoney

honestjon said:

AndrewHall said:

The Tribunal is well aware of the unreliability of the assessment report and that is why they have specialists on their panel. 

The tribunal seems to try to be fair. It would be better if they could punish the dwp for lies and harassing unwell people 

exactly... since you are an assessor, do your job conscientiously.
Question my "evidence" if you think I don't qualify for PIP, but don't write "you said it" when I didn't say  so. 

The worst thing in all this is cynicism, since at the end she tells you: "I wish you a quick recovery."
Why do you say that when you will write in a moment that I am fully healthy and therefore no disability affects my daily activities.

There is one conclusion: the target simply has to match. 

And if your application is selected for rejection, you are unlucky and
no "anecdotal" or factual evidence will help. It's as if they didn't exist.
Then, unfortunately, you are left with the MR and the tribunal. 

Wilf60

honestjon said:

honeyhoney said:

Unfortunately, until today I read these stories about the assessor's lies with a grain of salt.

Today I got my DM's decision.
I'm still waiting for the HP report but I know what to expect.

Reading this report is better than many fairy tales and it really made me laugh.
Example: Assessor's question: "do you go to your local shop?" My Answer: "no because... xyz."

DM report says: "You confirmed that you leave home to go to shops."

This is good, so what should we call it?

Or, "evidence shows you have no specialist input for you mental healt." Since I clearly stated and even sent a letter confirming that I was undergoing CBT Therapy

...etc etc if you can't call it a lie then what should you call it ?  

They tell lies and they do it quite often.
I wonder how they are allowed to tell so many lies without losing there jobs. Anyone else would be sacked for lying 

Lets look at this from the perspective of the assessor. They assess hundreds of people and it is very probable that they assess many cases where the applicant is not entitled to PIP. When the main evidence is statement stating that the applicant can't do an activity then what else can the assessor do but come to the conclusion that the applicant does not fit the criteria for PIP. In fact the assessor would probably state that the claimant is the liar. They can only make assessments on the evidence in front of them.

That said I totally agree that there are assessors who are very poor at their job and refuse claims even when the evidence is to the contrary but that does not apply to all assessors. Personally I have had a good experience with them in the past, but my claim was well sourced with evidence to prove my case. On the flip side a friend of mine had a great assessment with PIP and scored 8 points but scored 0 points with ESA even though he used the same evidence on both!

As stated above it is better to ignore the comments of the assessment if it is badly wrong. However, it will be the claimants responsibility to prove to the tribunal that the decision was wrong based on the evidence available.

honeyhoney

Wilf60 said:

As stated above it is better to ignore the comments of the assessment if it is badly wrong. However, it will be the claimants responsibility to prove to the tribunal that the decision was wrong based on the evidence available.

I fully agree. My intention is not to complain about HP's report and comments, but rather to make others aware of what they can expect.

Let me give you one example: I was approved for the LCWRA group based on "mobility"

I used the same "evidence" in my PIP application, but in terms of mobility I received 0 points

Wilf60

honeyhoney said:

Wilf60 said:

As stated above it is better to ignore the comments of the assessment if it is badly wrong. However, it will be the claimants responsibility to prove to the tribunal that the decision was wrong based on the evidence available.

I fully agree. My intention is not to complain about HP's report and comments, but rather to make others aware of what they can expect.

Let me give you one example: I was approved for the LCWRA group based on "mobility"

I used the same "evidence" in my PIP application, but in terms of mobility I received 0 points

That is strange but not usual. Just recently I have noticed that the DWP are starting to do the opposite i.e. they are willing to award PIP mobility but refuse ESA mobility because they state the 50m can be covered using a self propelled wheelchair. Not sure why but there are people speculating it is to do with getting more disabled people back to work