Hi! Question about LHA

brokenhalo

I'm just wondering if anyone can help, both me and my partner are in receipt of PIP and we receive UC. We have only ever received 2 bedroom LHA rate for our private rented 3 bedroomed flat. 
(20 year old son has one room) 
Recently on 30th Jan a "to do" popped up asking about needing an extra bedroom because of disability,  I replied with reasons and they have been accepted. I asked about backdating of the extra LHA amount and that's been rejected. I told them we had mentioned it on phone calls previously and we weren't aware that we could claim the extra. Also a "to do" was never created for this. So why now? And why are my reasons not acceptable? Could anyone shed some light please. Thank you 🤗

Adrian_Scope

Good morning @brokenhalo and a warm welcome to the community. 

If you disagree with the decision not to backdate, you can ask for a mandatory reconsideration of this. Did they give any reasons as to why it has been rejected?

Has anything recently changed with your claim to have meant they looked again at the LHA rate and additional bedroom? 

brokenhalo

Thank you for having me here  @Adrian_Scope it looks like this community will be very valuable to me. 
They just told me that the change had happened outside of the current assessment period and special circumstances didn't apply.
(It happened in 2020)

No change has happened which would make them look at it again. 

I would've thought if it was something that they ask everyone that has a disability, why wasn't it asked all that time ago? 

shellbell20

brokenhalo said:

Thank you for having me here  @Adrian_Scope it looks like this community will be very valuable to me. 
They just told me that the change had happened outside of the current assessment period and special circumstances didn't apply.
(It happened in 2020)

No change has happened which would make them look at it again. 

I would've thought if it was something that they ask everyone that has a disability, why wasn't it asked all that time ago? 

I think this is a very interesting topic and one I feel that is not discussed very often.  Can I ask if you received PIP did that change, did you perhaps go from standard to enhanced to warrant the change? I want to apply for a two bedroomed place as I need a full-time carer but  can find very limited information about the LHA rates and how they work when you have a spare room.

poppy123456

shellbell20 said:

brokenhalo said:

Thank you for having me here  @Adrian_Scope it looks like this community will be very valuable to me. 
They just told me that the change had happened outside of the current assessment period and special circumstances didn't apply.
(It happened in 2020)

No change has happened which would make them look at it again. 

I would've thought if it was something that they ask everyone that has a disability, why wasn't it asked all that time ago? 

I think this is a very interesting topic and one I feel that is not discussed very often.  Can I ask if you received PIP did that change, did you perhaps go from standard to enhanced to warrant the change? I want to apply for a two bedroomed place as I need a full-time carer but  can find very limited information about the LHA rates and how they work when you have a spare room.

Spare bedrooms refer to social housing and LHA doesn’t apply here. 

For LHA this applies to privately renting. It maybe possible to claim for an extra bedroom if you need regular overnight care. This means if you’re only entitled to 1 bedroom now, you would be entitled to 2 bedrooms. 

For this you would need to be claiming either daily living PIP/ADP or mid/high rate care DLA. See link https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/benefits/how_many_bedrooms_you_can_claim_benefits_for

brokenhalo

@shellbell20 as far as I can see, if you're in a private rented property you can ask on your UC journal for the extra bedroom rate to be applied and It will be looked at by a decision maker.
 I'm not sure how it would work as far as evidence goes for your circumstances but my situation was looked at pretty quickly with no evidence needed.
If you're in social housing ,you get bedroom taxed and I'm not sure about the ins and outs of how you go about getting that in place. 

My circumstances haven't changed as far as any changes to pip award etc. It's just out of the blue they've asked and I'm just wondering if it's something they ask at the beginning of a UC claim, in which case I've been missing out for years. 
I was in social housing prior to 2020 with an extra bedroom, so the bedroom tax was applied. Now I'm in private rented property and have only been receiving 2 bedroom LHA for 3 years.

shellbell20

brokenhalo said:

@shellbell20 as far as I can see, if you're in a private rented property you can ask on your UC journal for the extra bedroom rate to be applied and It will be looked at by a decision maker.
 I'm not sure how it would work as far as evidence goes for your circumstances but my situation was looked at pretty quickly with no evidence needed.
If you're in social housing ,you get bedroom taxed and I'm not sure about the ins and outs of how you go about getting that in place. 

My circumstances haven't changed as far as any changes to pip award etc. It's just out of the blue they've asked and I'm just wondering if it's something they ask at the beginning of a UC claim, in which case I've been missing out for years. 
I was in social housing prior to 2020 with an extra bedroom, so the bedroom tax was applied. Now I'm in private rented property and have only been receiving 2 bedroom LHA for 3 years.

I think you can also apply for an extra bedroom allowance with social housing. Strange, they have just asked you about the 2nd bedroom recently and not before. The trouble with the housing laws is that not many places offer free advice, you can't get through to Shelter as they are always busy and I honestly don't know anywhere else who can help. I rang CAB yesterday they gave me advice I was promptly told today that from a council it's the wrong advice, so I don't know who to believe and there's nowhere to get the correct information other than Shelter which is a non-starter.

shellbell20

poppy123456 said:

shellbell20 said:

brokenhalo said:

Thank you for having me here  @Adrian_Scope it looks like this community will be very valuable to me. 
They just told me that the change had happened outside of the current assessment period and special circumstances didn't apply.
(It happened in 2020)

No change has happened which would make them look at it again. 

I would've thought if it was something that they ask everyone that has a disability, why wasn't it asked all that time ago? 

I think this is a very interesting topic and one I feel that is not discussed very often.  Can I ask if you received PIP did that change, did you perhaps go from standard to enhanced to warrant the change? I want to apply for a two bedroomed place as I need a full-time carer but  can find very limited information about the LHA rates and how they work when you have a spare room.

Spare bedrooms refer to social housing and LHA doesn’t apply here. 

For LHA this applies to privately renting. It maybe possible to claim for an extra bedroom if you need regular overnight care. This means if you’re only entitled to 1 bedroom now, you would be entitled to 2 bedrooms. 

For this you would need to be claiming either daily living PIP/ADP or mid/high rate care DLA. See link https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/benefits/how_many_bedrooms_you_can_claim_benefits_for

Sorry didn't see this, I am a bit more confused about social housing and having a spare room, if LHA doesn't apply to social housing and you have a spare room for a carer how is the difference made up?

poppy123456

shellbell20 said:

poppy123456 said:

shellbell20 said:

brokenhalo said:

Thank you for having me here  @Adrian_Scope it looks like this community will be very valuable to me. 
They just told me that the change had happened outside of the current assessment period and special circumstances didn't apply.
(It happened in 2020)

No change has happened which would make them look at it again. 

I would've thought if it was something that they ask everyone that has a disability, why wasn't it asked all that time ago? 

I think this is a very interesting topic and one I feel that is not discussed very often.  Can I ask if you received PIP did that change, did you perhaps go from standard to enhanced to warrant the change? I want to apply for a two bedroomed place as I need a full-time carer but  can find very limited information about the LHA rates and how they work when you have a spare room.

Spare bedrooms refer to social housing and LHA doesn’t apply here. 

For LHA this applies to privately renting. It maybe possible to claim for an extra bedroom if you need regular overnight care. This means if you’re only entitled to 1 bedroom now, you would be entitled to 2 bedrooms. 

For this you would need to be claiming either daily living PIP/ADP or mid/high rate care DLA. See link https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/benefits/how_many_bedrooms_you_can_claim_benefits_for

Sorry didn't see this, I am a bit more confused about social housing and having a spare room, if LHA doesn't apply to social housing and you have a spare room for a carer how is the difference made up?

If you live social housing and you have a spare bedroom then there's a 14% deduction in your housing element or housing benefit for bedroom tax. If you need a carer then there will be no deduction for bedroom tax because you will no longer have that spare bedroom. 

shellbell20 said:

I think you can also apply for an extra bedroom allowance with social housing. 

That's not correct. You can claim an extra bedroom for a carer when either privately renting or social housing. 

VIX81

Hi there, I'm new here and hope it's ok to add to your post!

This exact same thing happened to me - a random box popped up in my UC account back in January and asked me if I needed an extra bedroom for overnight care and I answered yes immediately.  It also asked the date that I needed it from and I answered Feb 2021 which is accurate.
Going forward I've now been awarded an increased rate of LHA but when I requested it be backdated they declined and said I was out of the timescale to backdate.  I completed a mandatory reconsideration and they've again declined for the same reason, stating that they weren't advised nack in 2021 and the fact that I get PIP doesn't automatically qualify me.  They were informed at the time though as I was subsequently awarded LCWRA with my UC and in the support group with ESA.  They also said the information could be found online and it was my error in not applying sooner.  But surely if this was the case, why didn't they ask sooner?  Surely it isn't my fault that they neglected to ask the question until Jan 2024 and as soon as they asked I confirmed my needs?
It doesn't make any sense.

Has anyone had any success with appealing this as I now need to take it to upper tier tribunal and I'm really nervous and don't really know what I'm doing!  

Any advice or templates people can provide to help me complete the appeal form online would be so appreciated!

Thanks in advance xxx

Albus_Scope

Heya @VIX81 and welcome to the community.

I'm sorry to hear this has been dragging on for you, the DWP loves to make things as difficult as possible I think!  With the DWP, they function very much on a "Don't ask, don't get" system, so unless you specifically ask for something (even if you have no idea you can ask for it) they wont bring it up.  Unless it's to save them some money. 

Hopefully a regular will be able to offer some more advice soon.

brokenhalo

Hi @VIX81, that's sounds pretty much the same circumstances as me. And I also got almost the same reply when asked about mandatory reconsideration! 
I did mention to them about them asking now and why not then but they ignored that. 
I just don't understand why they are suddenly asking people if they need the room now but not when you apply for UC and live in a house with a "spare" room and receive PIP.
It's frustrating, I'm  just resigned to the fact I have it going and they won't budge on their reasoning. 

Fingers crossed you get more luck than me. 

wkd

brokenhalo said:

Hi @VIX81, that's sounds pretty much the same circumstances as me. And I also got almost the same reply when asked about mandatory reconsideration! 
I did mention to them about them asking now and why not then but they ignored that. 
I just don't understand why they are suddenly asking people if they need the room now but not when you apply for UC and live in a house with a "spare" room and receive PIP.
It's frustrating, I'm  just resigned to the fact I have it going and they won't budge on their reasoning. 

Fingers crossed you get more luck than me. 

I find it strange that they reply they can't backdate any payments as the information is online. I feel there is so little information about it online, it's a very grey area of whether or not you qualify. There seems to be no assessment or evidence required, it seems to be based solely on them asking if you need a spare room.  

My personal experience is I am stuck in the middle of nowhere with multiple disabilities, I need a carer to stay overnight regularly, however, if I decide to rent privately and move to an area near my relatives who can stay overnight as my carer there is no guarantee I would get the money for the additional room as there is no clear, defined information to see if I qualify or not.  Surely, that alone should enable people to ask for a MR?

VIX81

I think if you advise you need overnight care then you seem to qualify, I've qualified going forward but only from the date they asked me the question in the little pop up box on my UC account. 
The fact they neglected to ask me any earlier shouldn't be my fault and should mean I'm entitled to backdate but they're saying I can't. It's awful. I'm definitely going to appeal and will let you all know how I get on but it's just an added stress that no-one should have to go through, least of all someone with health problems and disabilities!

poppy123456

The extra bedroom for a carer when claiming housing element of UC is a lot easier to claim than it ever was for housing benefit. Though it's not automatically paid. Usually payment starts from the assessment period in which changes were reported. 

Rainbows

Hi

I'm new on here but in exact same position. I have my tribunal on Wednesday as I can't understand if you were entitled to the extra help why it can't be backdated. I was told as it was over the 13 months from the start of my claim it was outside the timescale to backdate. I asked why they can't just backdate for the 13 months then but was told no. Has anyone filled in the to do & back claimed for under 13 months & was this successful? My to do appeared in February what dates did anyone else's & why if this was an upgrade to the system is it not appearing on some people's accounts for weeks after others? Any help is really appreciated.

Thank you

VIX81

Hallo all, just a wee update.

I took it to the first tier tribunal and appealed and argued that DWP neglecting to ask me the question when I first applied meant it was an error on their part and this should be recalculated.

I also argued that this shouldn't be classed as "reporting a change" as it wasn't a change. This was the case when I first claimed my benefit, they just didn't ask me!

DWP said I was eligible since Feb 21 but as I hadn't applied for it/reported a change then, I wasn't due it. They said I couldn't blame my ignorance of the system for me missing out on what I was entitled to.

I also provided the tribunal with proof that the info wasn't available online in the places the DWP advised it was (actually it's not found anywhere on your claim at all) and argued that I couldn't possibly have known what I was entitled to when the info they provided isn't even accurate.

Tribunal ignored all of that and focused on the 13 month thing and said that my appeal was denied so I got absolutely nowhere with it.

Seems like it isn't worth anyone challenging as they're just sticking to the backdating rules, which make zero sense in this case.

Rainbows

Thank you for the information