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Desperate, can someone please help? LCW problems.

Kerris

HI,

I am posting hoping that someone can please help me and give me advice on the best thing to do. I suffer from severe anxiety for which I am prescribed sertraline and lorazepam and have been on these meds for over two years. I was living off savings until they ran out so I applied for contribution based ESA.

I had my assessment six weeks ago and have been found LCW and not been placed in the support group. My issue is that I got the ESA85 report back and it is complete fiction. I actually recorded the assessment which was by telephone, and it lasted just 13 minutes. I cannot cope with any change nor can I engage at all with anyone, either face to face or in any other way. I live alone and I never go out unless I absolutely have to and then I have to medicate with Lorazepam, which is not ideal as I have been instructed by my doctor to try to use it sparingly as it's been linked to cancer and dementia and is highly addictive. I also get very bad rebound anxiety which incapacitates me even more. I put most of this in the descriptors for the original application along with other details and the assessor didn't ask any questions about these things at all. Instead he has invented a lot of nonsense that he never asked and which I never uttered.

There are 29 statements attributed to me which are completely false, don't make sense and go against what I put in my descriptors. He says I have one panic attack a week which lasts for fifteen minutes and then I am ok. I told him that it's two or three a week at best and if stressed every day, and in my descriptors I write that it puts me in bed afterwards. He says I phone people to catch up with things every day, watch TV for hours, can cope with change if given notice with no problem and go out once a week with my adult son shopping etc. All these things are complete lies that he has fabricated.

I wrote in my descriptors that I cannot watch anything unless I know what it is because it sets off my terrors and so I rarely watch anything at all unless pre-recorded and vetted. I said I don't socialise in any way, shape or form, don't speak on the phone and never even answer the door. My son is not an adult, he is seventeen and lives with his mother and he goes shopping for me etc. The assessor say my adult son and I regularly meet up to chat and catch up and I can cope with changes in our arrangement if given adequate notice with no problem. Again, complete fiction.

He writes that there is no substantial risk if found fit for LCW, even though I can only ever engage with anyone or anything if I heavily medicate myself with Lorazepam, which is surely a risk factor given the aforementioned side effects and the fact that it incapacitates me to the extent that I couldn't drive and am unsteady on my legs. A normal day sees me never venturing out or seeing or speaking to anyone and I might take half a Lorazepam if I get a mild attack or to help me sleep if I get wound up and sleep deprived over a few days. If I have to do anything out of the ordinary I need to take more than that and surely that's not a safe sustainable thing for the DWP to force me to do. I told him I was not suicidal on the Lorazepam and then he cut me off and asked me something else. I was going to go on to say that without it I am and suffer terrible thoughts etc, but allowed him to interrupt me because I assumed we would be coming back to that and I'd brought it up in the wrong part of his assessment process. I did say that without the Lorazepam I would have thrown myself off of a cliff back in 2022. I also wrote in the descriptors that I am seeing a clinical psychologist because of suicidal thoughts due to shame etc.

I can prove absolutely that this report is false and provide a transcript of the call or indeed an mp3 of the call itself, if needed I didn't tell the assessor I was recording it, but made the tape because my memory is terrible when I take Lorazepam which I had to take it for the assessment, of course.

I am doing a Mandatory Consideration. How on earth do I sum all this up in a way that won't be a wall of text which might not get read or fully appreciated. Do I send them the tape or do just I say that I have it and the report is completely wrong, and I will be sending it and a transcript to any tribunal that I might need to attend.

I don't want to be too heavy handed and call the assessor a liar, though he clearly is.

My head is pulsing as I am typing this. I can't stand listening to myself on the tape and I can't stand having to think about all of this again, but I have to. I feel stressed beyond belief and also ashamed as I have to spell out how pathetic I am when I assumed the process was over. On the tape I am surprised when he says he has all he needs, I ask if he's sure and say I thought he'd be asking me lots more details. I never even started to express myself properly as I assumed I'd be on the phone for an hour and all these questions were to come.

Sorry for typing so much. I only have two and a half weeks to sort this out as the decision letter only just arrived, but is dated ten days ago. Please can somebody give me some advice.

Many thanks,

Kerris

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Comments

poppy123456

As you didn't make them aware that you were recording the assessment then you will not be able to use that recording for the MR or Tribunal. It can only be used for your purpose. Recording your assessment is permitted but you must tell them.

For the MR you should put this in writing stating the reasons why you should have been placed into the Support Group. (LCWRA) You have 1 month from the date of the decision to request this.

Keep it relevant and straight to the point because they don't need to know your life story. Less is often more.

The stats for the decision being changed in your favour at this stage are quite high so hopefully you will be one of them.

poppy123456

Just to add further, have a look at the actual descriptors for LCWRA because based on what you've said here I will be very surprised if at least one of those doesn't apply, in fact I'm going to say descriptors 11 (potentially) 12,13 and 14. You only need at least one of them.

I know you mentioned substantial risk but I'd also advise you to mention the actual descriptors and point out which one you think applies and give your reasons why. https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/universal-credit-uc/uc-faq/limited-capability-for-work-related-activity#:~:text=LCWRA%20descriptors,reasonably%2C%20be%20worn%20or%20used.&text=(ii)%20repeatedly%20mobilise%2050%20metres,of%20significant%20discomfort%20or%20exhaustion.

Albus_Alumni

Hi @Kerris and welcome to the community.

I can see Poppy is helping you already, but I wanted to pop in and say hi quickly. Please don't feel like you're pathetic, the benefits process is a very stressful process and we're all here to support you.

Kerris

Hi Poppy,

Thank you very much for your reply. I will mention the descriptors and all the points you have raised. I feel that I have to mention that I have the recording though, as obviously I am using this to refute the innaccuracies of the report and I am telling the complete truth and happy to prove it. I realise that it doesn't carry any legal weight but morally, I myself feel better and more confident knowing that I have it.

I have one queston please. If I can do something only when taking a large dose of tranquilizers, does that qualify as being able to perform the descriptor? That is why I haven't emphasised them too much as, if I medicate myself enough, then some things are possible. I could probably face a firing squad if I took enough Lorazepam, but it doesn't seem reasonable or safe for them to expect me to take benzodiaeipines to perform work tasks etc.

Again, so many thanks for your help and thank you to Albus for the kind words.

Kerris

Albus_Alumni

hi @Kerris. If you can do something more than 50% of the time safely, repeatedly and in a timely fashion, then they class it as you being able to do that thing. But if you are having to take a lot of tranquilizers to do something, I'd not say that is doing that thing safely.

Kerris

Hi Albus,

Thank you. That is what I've not been sure about - I wouldn't think it is safe, in fact I know it isn't. But I don't know whether it qualifies in their eyes as general medication like sertraline which you can reasonably take to help you perform such tasks.

Anyway, if I took it in those quantities I would probably get my prescription revoked. I am on it long term, precisely because I have proven I can use it relatively sparingly and responsably.

Many thanks for your reply.

Kerris

Meg24

As others have said, try to stick to why the descriptors apply rather than addressing what the assessor has said directly, although if they said something that is wrong (eg saying your son in an adult when he's still a child) it might be worth presenting that as a misunderstanding. So, you can say that they misunderstood or have made an incorrect assumption which has directly led them to apply the wrong points for a descriptor etc. Do you have any medical evidence you can send from your GP or MH worker?

poppy123456

As I advised because you didn't tell them you were recording the assessment you will not be able to use that as evidence.

You should always tell them everything about how your conditions affect you. If you miss things out then how are they supposed to make the correct decision. As it's not awarded based on any diagnosis, then it's your responsibility to prove you qualify and you can't do this without telling them everything.

Kerris

Meg24 said:

As others have said, try to stick to why the descriptors apply rather than addressing what the assessor has said directly, although if they said something that is wrong (eg saying your son in an adult when he's still a child) it might be worth presenting that as a misunderstanding. So, you can say that they misunderstood or have made an incorrect assumption which has directly led them to apply the wrong points for a descriptor etc. Do you have any medical evidence you can send from your GP or MH worker?

Hi meg,

Yes they already have my Gp report and I sent them one from my psychiatrist too. It will be very difficult to present these things as misunderstandings when they are clear statements attributed to me which are completely wrong, for example I apparently said that I can cope with change with no problem when that was something that I stated to the contrary in the descriptor.

thank you for replying,

Kerris

poppy123456 said:

As I advised because you didn't tell them you were recording the assessment you will not be able to use that as evidence.

You should always tell them everything about how your conditions affect you. If you miss things out then how are they supposed to make the correct decision. As it's not awarded based on any diagnosis, then it's your responsibility to prove you qualify and you can't do this without telling them everything.

Hi Poppy,

thank you for replying,

I didn't say that I missed things out. I said that because I can do certain things if medicated enough, I probably didn't empasise things enough either. I did write in the descriptors that I never and cannot engage with anyone in any way shape or form and gave details about the stress it causes me. I also wrote how I have to plan my day meticulously etc and cannot deal with it changing in any way. The assessor never asked me any questions about these descriptors at all, just made up a story of his own.

On the one hand I feel that I should be clear and concise etc, but on the other risk not "telling them everything" - it is a balancing act that is very difficult when you cannot focus properly,

thanks again,

Kerris

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