Baffled?!

white1989

Hi All, I’m new here but I thought I’d ask your opinions

My MR decision came through the post yesterday and as expected no change!

I currently get standard living rate and I believe the struggles I face on a daily basis still isn’t being taken into consideration in the points they have given me!

I had a stroke a number of years ago and every time I have a shower my partner has to wash my back and the entire length of my right arm as my left arm is practically useless! They have awarded me 2 points… even though I need physical assistance?

Toilet needs -

I can’t wipe myself properly after a no.2 and if anything gets on my right arm I can’t clean it off without his physical assistance… again they gave me 2 points!

im one point off higher rate and im sure they are just doing this to not give me any extra money!!

Should I go to tribunal or am I just wrong thinking physical assistance should be more than 2 points as 2 points is described as “needs supervision or prompting”

OverlyAnxious

Hi,

This isn't a clear case as far as I can see, we'll have to look at the descriptors a bit more deeply.

Showering:

3 points would be awarded for needing assistance to get in & out of the shower - that doesn't sound applicable to your situation, so I think we can forget that one.

However, 4 points is awarded for needing assistance to wash the body between the shoulders and waist. I don't think anyone can wash their own back without some form of aid or assistance so I doubt that's included in this descriptor. But the question is whether an arm counts as 'between shoulders and waist' or not. I think that's the point you should be focussing on for the tribunal, if you go ahead with that.

Toilet needs:

I suspect you could be awarded 4 points for needing assistance with this, however you will need to detail the reasons for that. Saying you can't wipe yourself 'properly' gives the PIP assessor some discretion, and also makes it sound like you are wiping without assistance for most of the time. You would need to explain that, for the majority of days (over 50%) you are unable to wipe adequately or reliably, and therefore need assistance with this task.

Accidentally getting mess on your arm is not applicable to this section, as that is covered by the washing descriptor, although there's no harm in mentioning it again.

Hope that helps, other members may also be able to offer further advice.

Albus_Scope

Heya @white1989 and welcome to the community.

As Overlyanxious has already said, PIP is more about showing how your disability affects each descriptor. If you cant do something 51% of the time, you're classed as being unable to do it.

white1989

thank you both.

I only need assistance for a number 2 not 1 so are they going to say well u go for a number 1 more than 2 so u can wipe without an assistance for majority of the time?

Albus_Scope

Because you need assistance for number twos, the previous answer wouldn't be good enough, so it would then go to the next tier, so you would be classed as needing assistance. I hope that makes sense?

white1989

I can go fine by myself for both no 1 and no 2 but it’s the cleaning part that I need assistance with, without help I wouldn’t be clean if that makes sense… I just don’t think that have taken that into account with the points awarded at 2

OverlyAnxious

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/874216#Comment_874216

It's your responsibility to provide them with enough evidence to prove that you meet the assistance criteria for 4 points.

Currently they may only have enough evidence for supervision, rather than assistance. The wording and explanation will be key here.

It needs to show that you cannot clean reliably and effectively without assistance for the majority of the time. No 1&2 should be considered separately so I wouldn't worry about that.