Issues with my work couch - Disability.

Northener

Dear Friends,

My name is Maria, and I am reaching out for your help regarding an issue I am facing with my work coach. I am 66 years old, disabled woman, and was assessed as having enhanced disability with 12 points from PIP. I have multiple health issues, with several diagnoses from NHS doctors. When I completed the WCA (Work Capability Assessment) in April, before the pip assessment, through the DWP, the decision was that I could do some types of work. I have challenged this decision twice, and now my case is at the tribunal stage.

Every time I have visited the Jobcentre with the assistance of a relative who acts as my carer, the staff have been understanding and supportive—except for my current work coach, who was assigned to me after I received the DWP's decision. From our first meeting, he has been cold, rude, and dismissive of my condition, repeatedly insisting that I am capable of working and comparing my situation to others who he claims have worse health issues than mine. For example, he has sent me work advertisements as a security guard or cleaner.

Two weeks ago, we had a phone appointment during which I explained my situation again and mentioned additional medical evidence from NHS doctors and my PIP assessment, which clearly shows that I am unable to care for myself, let alone work. He asked if I could get a sick note, and the call ended abruptly after less than five minutes. Even before I got a note, he sent me an invitation to a face-to-face work search. After obtaining a three-month sick note, which one of his colleagues approved, my coach changed our next appointment from a "work search" to a "commitments review."

I feel like this work coach is bullying me, treating me as if I am a fraud, and disregarding my legitimate health issues. His behaviour has left me feeling unwell, constantly in tears, and worthless. I have written a detailed letter requesting to speak with his manager, but despite multiple follow-up messages, I have received only vague responses and no contact from the manager. I feel terrified about my upcoming appointment with this person tomorrow.

I am not asking for mercy—only for my rights. What can I do tomorrow? Should I insist on meeting the manager directly? What are my legal options if this bullying and discrimination continue?

I appreciate your support.

Many thanks,

Maria

Rosie_Scope

Hi @Northener. Sorry to hear you're having troubles with your work coach. It makes all the difference to have supportive people around you, and I'm sorry your coach has been so dismissive.

It's worth asking to speak to a manager tomorrow if you can manage it. You shouldn't have to stay with a coach that you feel is treating you badly. Did you keep any copies of the letters you wrote in case you might need them later? Sometimes it's good to have some written evidence to show what's been going on.

If you feel up to it, it might be time to start thinking about making a complaint about how you've been treated:

Complaints procedure - Department for Work and Pensions - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

Hope you can get things sorted soon, it must be really stressful ❤️

Needhelpandadvice

@Northener At 66 you should be close to retirement age. When is your retirement age?

The DWP are obviously being over zealous in relation to a person of your age.

I personally would make a complaint on your journal, even though I am not on UC so my advise in relation to it, is not really valid.

However, it is disgusting that a so called work coach should be able to treat you like this.

WhatThe

Oh Maria!

Your coach is probably hoping you will not turn up to the appointment so he can issue a sanction. I've met several like that at JCP, young men who know nothing about older women or ill health and care even less.

Ask your relative to record the interview tomorrow but don't tell them or the appointment may be brought to an end. Ask for the manager's name and have the coach write it down - he may refuse so keep asking and he'll probably and talk to his manager or find a colleague to take over 🤨 . Ask for a copy of your 'action plan' or 'work plan' or whatever they want to call it. If there isn't one then they're making it up as they go along. Insist on telephone appointments as a reasonable adjustment.

I have nothing good to say about DWP. While the front line - job coach - pretends to know nothing about you or your circumstances, the system and the decision makers in the back offices certainly do. There is usually an agent on a nearby desk trying to look busy so these 'interviews' are deliberately not discrete. I had a joint interview once and wept for the entire hour without one of them saying a word to me. I've had to be strong for so long and have a few more years of this treatment to endure before I can retire. Nothing I say to them matters. We do not deserve this!

You're a senior citizen so this is a complete waste of their resources and your time. Both applications are in the hands of DWP via JCP agents. Contact your MP and ask them to investigate and do the hard work for you.

The Tribunal is very likely to overturn DWP decision(s) so trust in that process while you keep JCP at bay.

vikki66

@Northerner

Hi Maria, sorry that you’re feeling this way, and I agree with the poster who mentioned your age and closeness to retirement. I know that they have an agenda to ‘help’ people back to work, but it seems pointless to try to force you when you’re so close to receiving your pension. Congratulations on getting PIP before you reached pension age, hopefully that will make a difference to your future.

Is it possible do you think to keep getting 3 month sick notes, in order to avoid these appointments? My thoughts, after reading your message a couple of times, is that this might be the best, least stressful, option for you.

You mention you’ve taken a relative to the appts - have they challenged anything at the times when you’ve thought you were being discriminated against? If so what was the outcome? How many meetings have there actually been with this guy (I think, from what you’ve said, that you’d have started meeting him c.May)? When you say he was comparing you to other people, do you mean that he named other people and directly compared you to them? That, rightfully, would not be permitted. Do you mean that he said that the jobs he was suggesting were considered suitable jobs for the work category you’re currently in? Eg saying he had other clients with LCW who had taken such jobs?

I don’t mean this in any cold way, but with most bureaucracies, you get nowhere trying to complain, which is not to say that you shouldn’t do it, if you feel you have a strong, provable, case. Institutions will meld, so that your complaint can be deemed not to be upheld. As you say you were switched to this guy after the dwp decision, I would guess that the coach will claim that he’s suggesting jobs in accordance with what he’s been told you’ve been deemed capable of (which is very possibly true, until he’s shown an LCWRA). The fact that you’re awaiting a tribunal won’t matter to them, unfortunately. And PIP won’t matter either - many people on PIP can, and do, work. Even though you’ve started receiving PIP it doesn’t mean that you’ve been deemed to be incapable of work, so this won’t matter to the job centre either. Being awarded PIP doesn’t mean that a person is deemed to lack capacity in general. I’m only saying this in case you think that the guy shouldn’t be asking you to find work solely based on your having been awarded PIP.

I feel for you, as I can tell that you’re very distressed, but I think it sounds like you’d have a hard case to prove that you’ve been bullied and discriminated against, unless there’s more that you didn’t mention. Eg, you say he was cold, rude, and dismissive of your health concerns. Do you mean that he’s tried to talk to you about work, that you’ve become upset and told him about your disability / PIP, and he’s proceeded with telling you that you need to apply for work, leading you to become more upset? Or do you mean he’s shouted at you, or overtly accused you of being a fraud, or anything like that? You say he made you feel like a fraud, but that’s a very different thing from him calling you a fraud, in the eyes of the law.

I’m totally not saying that I don’t believe how you say you’re feeling btw - as I said I can hear the struggle in your letter.

There’s a good chance that the coach will likely say he was only trying to his job, and that you were a tricky customer. The manager won’t want complaints against the job centre, and is possibly likely to support his colleague. You say you sent a letter, did you post it, and if so, did you retain proof of postage? If it was an email did you receive a response? People always say leave a paper-trail - if you phoned it’s most likely there’s no trace of that.

Where you mention the recent phone-call, it will have been recorded, and if it’s short, and there’s only something like him asking you some questions, you saying you can’t work due to ill-health, and him asking you for a sick-note, unless the coach has outright said discriminatory, or overtly-bullying things, they won’t be able to find against him. I guess after asking for the sick note there would’ve been nothing else for him to say, so no reason to stay on the phone? And, when the call ended, he would’ve been obliged to send you the invitation to the face-to-face meeting if he hadn’t received a sick-note, so that wouldn’t be seen as bullying or discrimination. The fact that he sent you work adverts, while you’re still deemed capable of work, won’t be seen as discriminatory either, regardless of how it made you feel. Unless, of course, there was more that you haven’t mentioned.

Officially accusing people of bullying and discrimination is a pretty serious charge, against which they’re rightly allowed to defend themselves, and you really need to be sure you have some sort of proof other than just your feelings. I’m only saying this as it will cause you a lot of distress to go through a whole legal process, so for your own wellbeing please consider if it’s worth it.

This coach will most likely not want to deal with you any more than you want to deal with him, but he’ll have no choice either. If you’ve been making phone calls complaining about him, though he should, of course, always be polite and helpful, he’s definitely not going to feel any warmth towards you. Nobody would under those circumstances.

As far as legal options, if you want to you can make a complaint, as per the link in a post above. You would need to follow their process to the end before you could then take it any further.

You can always ask tomorrow if it’s possible to be switched to another coach, though that doesn’t guarantee that you would be, and getting a new coach doesn’t guarantee that you won’t still be asked to apply for jobs (until such times as a tribunal finds in your favour).

Maybe if you ask to speak to the manager, without making any accusations, and calmly ask if it would be possible to be seen by another coach, only going into any detail if asked, you might be successfully changed? I hope so.

Hoping it works out for you quickly.

WhatThe

I left a comment a couple of hours ago which must be queueing somewhere 😶

vikki66

@WhatThe

Have you accidentally saved it as draft? I did that before then couldn’t see how to send later.

WhatThe

No, I highlighted and pasted but it was seized by the software again. It should appear in the morning. Nothing controversial.

Dear Maria 💜

vikki66

@WhatThe

Is there a reason why some posts don’t appear? Also, any ideas why, if I saved a draft, I’m not able to find it? Is it because I’m using a phone?

WhatThe

You're asking the wrong person 😄 techphobe here

chiarieds

Sometimes messages get caught in Scope's spam filter, & Admin will sort it in the morning, as mentioned.

About drafts, I use a desktop computer, but the answer to your query I hope can be found by looking here if you scroll down to the 'MeBox' :

https://forum.scope.org.uk/kb/articles/8-mobile-device-or-tablet-a-guide-to-using-the-online-community

vikki66

@WhatThe - there was a time when I was a proud technophobe, then, by the time I realised I’d like to learn, it was too late. My brain’s too fogged now.

@chiarieds - can’t get your name to highlight. Thanks will have a look.

WhatThe

Oh Maria!

Your coach is probably hoping you will not turn up to the appointment so he can issue a sanction. I've met several like that at JCP, young men who know nothing about older women or ill health and care even less.

Ask your relative to record the interview tomorrow but don't tell them or the appointment may be brought to an end. Ask for the manager's name and have the coach write it down - he may refuse so keep asking and he'll probably and talk to his manager or find a colleague to take over 🤨 . Ask for a copy of your 'action plan' or 'work plan' or whatever they want to call it. If there isn't one then they're making it up as they go along. Insist on telephone appointments as a reasonable adjustment.

I have nothing good to say about DWP. While the front line - job coach - pretends to know nothing about you or your circumstances, the system and the decision makers in the back offices certainly do. There is usually an agent on a nearby desk trying to look busy so these 'interviews' are deliberately not discrete. I had a joint interview once and wept for the entire hour without one of them saying a word to me. I've had to be strong for so long and have a few more years of this treatment to endure before I can retire. Nothing I say to them matters. We do not deserve this!

You're a senior citizen so this is a complete waste of their resources and your time. Both applications are in the hands of DWP via JCP agents. Contact your MP and ask them to investigate and do the hard work for you.

The Tribunal is very likely to overturn DWP decision(s) so trust in that process while you keep JCP at bay.