Transitional protection and lcwra

kmmk11

hi, I’m hoping someone can help me. I was told in may with the migration letter that I had to move to UC from legacy benefits. May 27th I submitted my UC claim and as I have a few health concerns myself was told I had to put in a fit note and go for lcwra. I have never put in for anything such as pip for myself as I’m a carer for my daughter who has epilepsy and autism. My assessment was in August and was accepted 2 days ago for lcrwa, I checked my statement for my payment and they added the lcrwa payment and taken the carer element and transitional protection payments saying the amount would be greater before deductions? My deductions haven’t changed at all and my payment is worked out as £200 less a month now I’m on lcwra than before? How is it okay for the them to put you in a worse off financial position? It says that if I receive back payment then debts will be taken from it which is fine but even after they come out of it then I’ll receive hardly any back payment if anything and will still be just over £100 worse off a month? I have read today that there are some cases that are going through court because of it but I just don’t know what to do or what to think. My anxiety is sky high with all of this and I’m not getting anywhere with it. Hope someone can help.

poppy123456

For your Transitional Protection, If you become entitled to other elements or other elements increase the TP decreases, so that's correct.

The same person can't claim both carers element and LCWRA element at the same time. In this case the higher element is paid, which is the LCWRA element.

There was a thread here very recently where a member was found to have LCWRA and was also a carer claiming carers element. They posted a screenshot of their UC before the LCWRA element was included and a screenshot of after it was awarded and it was clear on there exactly what they did and shouldn't have done. I'm thinking they've done the same thing for you.

I'll explain… It sounds like they've included the LCWRA element and reduced your TP by the full amount of the LCWRA element. However, they've also removed the carers element, which has made you worse off by the carers element amount, which is incorrect.

Instead what they should have done is removed the carers element, added the LCWRA element and reduced the TP by the difference between the carers element and LCWRA element which is £217.88.

I'd advise you to put a message onto your journal and tell them that they've reduced the TP by the full amount of the LCWRA element and then removed the carers element. Tell them that this is incorrect, they should have reduced the TP by the difference between the Carers and LCWRA element.

You will not be owed any money in this case unfortunately, due to the TP being eroded by the additional LCWRA element, even at the lower amount.

You won't be any better off by the additional LCWRA element but you shouldn't have been worse off!

I hope I've explained this enough for you to understand because it's complicated.

kmmk11

I’ve only been on UC since may so I have no idea what’s going on and have spent majority of the day trying to research and get hold of people. The transitional protection hasn’t just been reduced it has been completely taken off of me. Whenever I point out that surely I shouldn’t be made worse off the same answer is used, it’s already been calculated on the statement and is correct. I was thinking of going to citizens advice but don’t know if they would be able to help me. I didn’t even want to go for lcwra but was told that I have to because I have health concerns. Thank you for replying

poppy123456

Can you please tell me how much your Transitional Protection was before the LCWRA element was added?

Emilee

This is happening a lot.

If you can look at a previous statement and say how much your TP was before you were changed to LCWRA we should be able to give you an answer to respond on your journal with.

kmmk11

£331.56 was my TP. I’m so confused because they replied today saying that my amount before deductions was more last month than this month but I’ve just checked and it isn’t? If it’s correct then that’s fine, I just don’t want to let it lie if it’s incorrect. Thanks for all the help

poppy123456

Thank you. That means it should be as follows…

LCWRA element £416.19 - carers element £198.31 = £217.88.

TP before the LCWRA was included £331.56 - £217.88 = £113.68 TP remaining after the addition of the LCWRA and removal of the carers element.

You will not be better off or worse off due to that addition.

What deductions are you referring to? Could you please post details of your statement before the LCWRA element was included and one with details of after it was included.

If you post a screenshot of your statements, please make sure that all of your personal details such as names, NI numbers, addresses etc are covered or removed.

kmmk11

this is my statement for September

kmmk11

this is my statement for October

kmmk11

I have deductions totalling £1028.26 as I have my rent taken from my UC and sent straight to my landlord and other things I have to pay back but the deduction amount is the same for both statements

poppy123456

Thanks. This is exactly what I thought it would be and how I advised in a previous comment. I'll copy and paste it below…

They've included the LCWRA element and reduced your TP by the full amount of the LCWRA element. However, they've also removed the carers element, which has made you worse off by the carers element amount, which is incorrect.

Instead what they should have done is removed the carers element, added the LCWRA element and reduced the TP by the difference between the carers element and LCWRA element which is £217.88.

I'd advise you to put a message onto your journal and tell them that they've reduced the TP by the full amount of the LCWRA element and then removed the carers element. Tell them that this is incorrect, they should have reduced the TP by the difference between the Carers and LCWRA element.

kmmk11

thank you, I’ve added a message to my journal saying exactly how you broke it down for me including the figures, I’m hoping they’ll reply and rectify it. I’m new to all this and it’s all confusing. Thank you everyone for your help!

Meg24

I hope you get it sorted, even if you do, may I ask that you send a copy of all this to your MP? They are unaware that these things happen and the DWP just deny they do. Imagine how many people have this happen and don't realise it's wrong? There must be so many. Thanks.

poppy123456

You're welcome. Yes, please do come back and let me know the outcome.

Emilee

It isn't wrong. They have applied the regulations correctly, it is just grossly unfair and one of the situations that was not properly accounted for in legislation.

I have been hugely impressed with your knowledge Poppy123456, but unfortunately you are incorrect with regards to this issue.

They have applied the regulations correctly, it is just terribly unfair in law and is being challenged currently.

This exact situation is currently at an upper tier tribunal and is set to be heard on 30th October. In the mean time, claimants who have had their TP eroded by the full amount of LCWRA are advised to appeal and ask for their case to be 'stayed behind the case at the UT'.

Adrian_Scope

Thank you @Emilee, I've just been doing some more reading on this. It does seem very unfair.

Hopefully the challenge will find in the claimants' favour.

poppy123456

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/915389#Comment_915389

Thank you. I must admit that when I looked at TP regulations a little more early this morning I did doubt myself so thank you for confirming that I was wrong. It doesn't happen often but I'm always happy to corrected.

I did know there was a case but didn't realise it was this situation that was waiting to be heard.

Thanks again.

KAM07

@Emilee I found this site through googling after this exact situation happened to me. I hope you don’t mind me asking, but I’m autistic and don’t know how to appeal. Do I just write in my journal “I would like to appeal the decision and have my case stayed behind the case at the UT” or is there more to it than that?

quail

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/915389#Comment_915389

How do ask for appeal on this ? do I just add a journal entry or is there more to it ?

I would really appreciate your advice as I have just had my statement and found that I am now £198 worse off because of removal of carers ellement and adding of lcwra ellement. I am really annoyed and worried how I am going to manage with the drop in payment, as I had been advised that this would not happen and that although my uc entitlement would increase my payment would stay the same as to would only be reduced by the difference in the 2 ellements.

Is it possible to get uc to cancel this change(go back to ce and full tp) or is it too late now? I am still a carer despite my own health issues.

Migrated from is and was advised to submit fit notes straight away so I did.

I was going to cancel the lcwra application but was told not too as it would not affect my overall payment amount but would increase uc entitlement for the future and now been told I was given wrong information.

poppy123456

@quail I don't know if emilee will respond because I haven't see them active on the forum for quite a few weeks.

Unfortunately, you will not be able to cancel the LCWRA element and go back the CE and full TP.

To challenge the decision you request the Mandatory Reconsideration, first then (you can do that on your journal) then Tribunal after that.

quail

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/955116#Comment_955116

As well as disputing the reduction of tp by ce and lcwra ellement and only lcwra ellement now being paid Is it worth arguing that the 'relevant period for lcwra' started the day of migration so not a new change.

Ive even looked on the government website about migration and tp and it states that tp is eroded over time as uc entitlement increases, and they give a few examples (which is what i was advised) so they have not been transparent about this as this is the place where it should give an example of the ce and lcwra change. It even gives examples of what ends tp but nothing about this.