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Is there a difference between ESA and UC in terms of taxation?

ESABenefitsUK123

I see on my printed tax slip that I get sent each year from the inland revenue that part of my ESA must be taxable, as an amount written on the slip says that £6835 out of the allowed personal tax allowance was used up. I guess that this amount was the income related part of ESA, and counts as taxable income.

But what happens when I get moved over to UC? Are the tax rules identical in this area, or will I get a "better rate", in terms of the amount deducted from the allowed personal tax allowance? In other words, when on UC, might I get less deducted from my personal tax allowance each year?

Thanks a lot for any comments.

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Comments

OverlyAnxious

Hi,

It is the Contributions Based ESA that is taxable. That will be changed over to New Style ESA, which is also taxable.

Means tested benefits such as income related ESA and UC are not taxable.

WhatThe

I received a P60u in the tax year 2011/12 after "conversion" to ESA and every year after that.

I only received Income-Related ESA but forum members told me that only Contribution-Based ESA is taxable so this is all still a mystery to me.

Kimi87

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/960493#Comment_960493

Did you convert from the old Incapacity Benefit?

If so that converted to CB ESA, with IR ESA top up where applicable.

WhatThe

IB/IS to ESA.

I've checked and been told it was all IR. Not just told - ESA printed and sent me statements showing it was all IR.

ESABenefitsUK123

Thanks for all comments. Reading these comments, I must be in the following category then -

I was converted from the old Incapacity Benefit (circa 2012), to CB ESA, with IR ESA top up where applicable - applicable to me, as I have under £6000 in savings.

So, I now realise that when I get the UC migration letter, that I will be converted to UC plus New Style ESA. Is it just me, or is this confusing?

Kimi87

The IR ESA top ups aren't to do with income, but extra money the law says you need due to disability.

It is confusing, many only find out after migration what type of ESA they were on.

When someone is on both CB & IR ESA, upon migration to UC the IR ESA ends and is replaced by UC, the CB ESA converts automatically into New Style ESA.

You will still be in the Support Group for NS ESA & automatically receive the UC equivalent (LCWRA).

NS ESA will be paid separately from UC, fortnightly at a rate of £276.40.

This will be deducted in full (598.68) from each UC payment.

As UC is a monthly benefit and ESA weekly, the numbers may look wrong- but are correct because there are 4.3 weeks in a month.

You will probably get a letter mentioning work coach, medical evidence. Don't panic.

The letter is a generic letter, assuming the claim is a brand new one and not a transfer from the old ESA. Most of it won't apply to your claim.

You will need a commitments interview for NS ESA this is just a formality, the only commitment will be to keep them updated with any changes. If a face to face is booked, you can ask for a phone call instead as a reasonable adjustment.

WhatThe

Hi Kimmy, what do you make of the puzzle I described above? Thanks

Kimi87

I'm not familiar with a mixed Incapacity Benefit/Income Support claim, but in my opinion it would have converted to CB ESA with an IR top up if applicable.

I realise you've been sent documents stating all your ESA is IR.

But if that was the case you wouldn't get the P60.

WhatThe

But I did. I have a little pile of them.

poppy123456

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/960556#Comment_960556

Back in the days where it was IB, some people claimed IS as a top up to their IB. When you migrated to ESA if you were in the Support Group part of your ESA should have been CB, assuming you remained in the Support Group for your whole claim.

If at anytime you were placed in the WRAG then your ESA would have become all Income Related after 1 year had passed because CB ESA is only paid for 1 year unless in the Support Group.

WhatThe

Hi poppy, that doesn't explain why I continued to receive a P60u every year for IR ESA…

Or am I still missing something here?

poppy123456

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/960589#Comment_960589

If part of your ESA was CB then yes you would have received the P60u. ESA letters are well known for being extremely difficult to understand and very often it will tell you that your ESA is Income Related, even if part of it is CB.

I've known people that claim New Style ESA and receive the annual uprating letter for it to tell them that they are receiving Income Related ESA but NsESA is a contributions based only benefit.

WhatThe

My Class 1 NIC's stopped being awarded that year too - it doesn't make sense for an ESA award does it?

JSA however is taxable and would not qualify for Class 1 NIC's..

poppy123456

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/960602#Comment_960602

No idea why you didn't receive NI credits when you were claiming ESA but you should have been.

Income Related JSA is not taxable income. Only New style JSA is taxable or the old contributions based but it's no longer possible to claim this one.

Both ESA and JSA also includes class 1 NI credits. For your UC it's class 3.

You can see all the NI credits criteria here.

https://www.gov.uk/national-insurance-credits/eligibility

WhatThe

Thank you poppy. So even IR JSA wouldn't explain the P60u's I received then.

This is baffling. How did my IR ESA ever become a taxable income?

poppy123456

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/960628#Comment_960628

No problem. If you were in the Support Group then as I advised it could have been part contributions based. IR ESA isn't and never has been taxable income.

WhatThe

The P60u is issued by the Benefits Agency which is the DWP.

I do not understand why the Benefits Agency began sending them to me when I only received IR ESA.

I accept that they should not have been issued but they were..

Kimi87

To recap:

You were receiving the old Incapacity Benefit.

This would have converted into CB ESA. With an IR ESA top up where applicable.

Since the conversion you have been getting P60's which are issued only when the claimant gets a taxable benefit (CB ESA).

ESA letters are generally very difficult to understand with unclear language.

Everything points to a misunderstanding, I believe you are mistaken in thinking all of your ESA is IR.

I don't know how else to explain, so that's all the advice I can offer.

poppy123456

You keep saying that your ESA was Income Related and you're misunderstanding what I'm trying to say here.

I'll explain again.. you were claiming IB and migrated to ESA so part of your ESA would have been contributions based. This would have continued past a year if you were in the Support Group because it wasn't time limited. The Income Related part was topping up your income.

I remember trying to advise you a few times in the past with the confusion with your benefits and I didn't succeed. I don't know what else to advise at this point so will leave it at that now.

ESABenefitsUK123

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/960585#Comment_960585

Regarding the last paragraph above, quoted, where it says: "If at anytime…..and ends with…..Support Group." That's exactly what happened to me. I don't know if this is odd, or not, but I have since been advised by the DWP that my ESA is CB. (I am now in the Support Group, having not been in this group when I was switched over from IB to ESA, circa 2012.) I hope I haven't confused things any further!