Employment Grievance question

Feenixrocks

Hey all, hope you are all good!

I am going through an employee grievance at present, some of which is disability related but not all. Its also about harassment of multiple people not just me (its a sorry tale!)

The question I do have, and apologies if its not really for here but I would think somebody on here would likely know. If an employer takes ages to respond to a grievance, would that mean that the employee subsequently loses any right to go to a tribunal?

So ACAS says there is a 3 month limit to moving forward to a tribunal - so if an employer takes 3 months +2 days, say to respond after a grievance investigation does that mean the employee is just stuck? that is where I am at present, am just under 3 months and they have told me they are "writing it up"

thanks.

Littlefatfriend

Hi Feenicksrocks,

I'm not an expert but my reading of those regulations is that you have three months to inform ACAS that you want to make a claim to an employment tribunal.

That regulation relates to your making the claim, not your employer responding to it. How long your employer is allowed to respond is for ACAS and your employer to work out.

I don't think the three months is a limit on the process after that.

Good luck

Feenixrocks

https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/1041158#Comment_1041158

Thanks, the employer response time I referred to was to the grievance that I have already raised (with the intention of resolving the issues without having to go to a tribunal) - this is generally advised as a step prior to going that far (if resolving informally has failed).

I think my point was is it possible for a bad employer to basically shaft an employee by making the grievance stage take as long as possible thus ensuring they cannot take it any further?

Littlefatfriend

Thanks Feenixrocks, I apologise for misspelling your name!

No, I don't believe an employer can just wait ACAS out, otherwise they'd all probably do that. ACAS aims to hasten the (notoriously litigious) tribunal process.

Whilst their doesn't seem to be a strict limit on how long an employer can twiddle their thumbs before responding to a complaint, they certainly risk harm to their case and it could potentially result in a default judgment or a less favorable outcome in a tribunal.

"Acas offers early conciliation to help resolve disputes before they reach a tribunal, and engaging with this process is crucial for employers."

You're employer is shooting themselves in the foot, as it were.

Good luck

MW123

@Feenixrocks

Firstly, welcome to the community.

To answer your question, the important thing to know is that the time limit for making an employment tribunal claim usually runs from the date of the last incident you are complaining about. This limit is generally three months minus one day. Unfortunately, this clock does not stop just because your employer is slow in replying to your grievance.

However, if you contact Acas to start Early Conciliation before your deadline expires, the clock will pause while Acas attempts to help you and your employer resolve the issue. This means you will not lose your right to go to a tribunal simply because you are waiting for your employers response. The Acas service is free, you will not be charged.

Also, before you can submit a claim to an employment tribunal, you must complete the Acas Early Conciliation process and obtain an Acas certificate. You will need this certificate and its reference number to make your claim, without it, the tribunal won’t accept your application.

If I were in your position, I would contact Acas now, even if your employer has not finished investigating your grievance, to start the early conciliation process. It also sends a strong message to your employer that you are serious about your grievance once Acas gets in touch with them. If you are in a union, it's also a good idea to speak to your union rep for advice.

Wishing you the very best of luck with your claim, and I hope everything is resolved in your favour.

figraspberry41

#Feenixrocks,

Hi and welcome! From my own personal experience you would do better to (as previous contributor suggests) to commence an ACAS Early Conciliation Process now, even though you employer is taking time for a response. As I recall, it is correct that the process stops (or rather puts on hold while the employer responds). However, do not make the same mistake that I did. I applied after seeking CAB advise , since my Union Representative was inefficient and clearly not on my side! (He is employed by the Union but had to report to the Branch Secretary, who was a direct employee of my employers, effectively making that individual with essentially a conflict of interests!)

In my case, there had been a failed Grievance and although time had elapsed another incident occurred soon afterwards. I had been to a meeting with Management, H.R. my line Manager and Union Rep. I waited to see what happened but nothing did for ages, so I applied with support from CAB and having asked directly via ACAS ( who have to remain impartial but are supposed to advise you without prejudice if you have a case and are with in the time limit of three months less a day! Because my employer kept dragging their feet, I waited and resigned to enable me to take up the Tribunal. This took fifteen months to process and on the third day for the Tribunal, I received a telephone call from my representative (CAB as Union was not really supporting me at all). I was told that I had to withdraw from the complaint as I had not applied initially the day after the incident / meeting took place! Whilst I had been well within the time limit (as I thought) and had been lead to believe by my representative. Also, ACAS did not say that I would be out of time when I sought their advise that I had fulfilled the criterion it emerged that a judgement had been made and upheld previously (2017) in favour of the employer as the time had been longer that the initial incident and therefore my case was no longer eligible to reach Tribunal!

I complained to the Court because I had indeed followed procedure / guidelines etc.. However, the Judge had thrown the case out on that detail. I was advised via the Judge's Clerk (the Judge had instructed the clerk to inform me) that due to this earlier Judgement, I had not filed my ACAS Early Conciliation until weeks later, for the same reason you are doing waiting on a response from the employer! The Judge also said that I could in effect start from scratch again but the same 'deadline' would apply and therefore would invalidate my claim. I had waited for 15 months for this to reach Tribunal stage only to be thwarted just three days prior to the actual Tribunal Date.

I do not have much 'faith' in the system and in my case should never had trusted the (independent) Union Rep at all! Neither do I have any confidence in the employers response because (despite another contributing saying it is not in their interest to delay investigation, equally, knowing that if they drag their feet (as it were), you would ultimately runout of time or drop the whole thing; either way it is a win win for them!

I can only suggest that you carefully check the dates of occurrence and make sure that you are will within the three months less a day of the original Grievance. I don't really know much about it, neither do I understand the process/ procedure (neuro diverse condition) but I have had the above experience and not only had I been manoeuvred into retiring four years early loosing four years Pension effectively; but have with the knowledge I now have made sure that I had registered with ACAS much sooner and definitely within the time frame. I hope that it is not too late for you!

Good luck with it, try not to be too despondent with the length of time it all takes and hope you are successful.

MW123

@figraspberry41

Thank you for sharing your experience. I am really sorry to hear how things turned out for you, especially losing part of your pension and not getting proper support from your union. That must have been incredibly frustrating. Sharing your story will no doubt help others understand the risks and what to look out for to avoid the same pitfalls.

For others reading this who may be going through similar problems or are worried about the stress of going to Tribunal, I would like to point out that many cases are settled through ACAS Early Conciliation without needing to go that far. It depends on both the employer and employee being willing to reach an agreement, but it can save a lot of time, stress and uncertainty.

Cash settlements are quite common in this process. If a settlement is reached, it becomes legally binding through a COT3 agreement, and the employer must pay the agreed amount by a specific date. If they do not, it can be enforced through a free government scheme or by applying to the court.

As figraspberry41highlights, it is important to start the ACAS process within the time limit even if you are still waiting for your employer to respond to make sure you keep your legal options open.

I really hope things are better for you now figraspberry41. Sharing your experience could genuinely help another member avoid the same situation.

Feenixrocks

@figraspberry41 again thank you for sharing that, it sounds dreadful but it is really helpful and as MW123 said I really hope things are better for you now.

It sounds like a bit of a con to me, like an employer could deliberately delay things thus negating a complaining employers right to a tribunal? that sounds so wrong.

I may well go ahead with the ACAS conciliation in that case, tbh I would be happy with a payout - I would be happy if they just made me redundant to be honest, it would keep me going for a fair while while I focused on finding something more positive!

figraspberry41

#Feenixrocks, #MW123,

Thank you both for your comments and support. I'm a fully fledged State Pensioner now, so no more worries about finding a job; although it was very unpleasant and disconcerting at the time.

I wish you a successful outcome whether it ends up with a settlement or goes the whole way to Tribunal. I would be interested to know how it goes, just be prepared for a long wait. Good Luck!