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DWP want another PIP assessment as not happy with their first assessors report!

ingu1ingu1 Member Posts: 1 Listener
edited September 2018 in PIP, DLA and AA

My husband has been in receipt of PIP since he was medically retired in 2014.  He had an assessment at home in early 2016 and another just last month which I also attended.  We got a call today from the DWP telling us that they weren't happy with the report the assessor provided, they said it didn't have enough detail and they've given him another time and date in 12 days time to meet with a different assessor.  This seems odd to me.  Not only to call out of the blue, but the assessor stopped several times during the interview to apologise and said he needed to type up his notes.

I'm going to call DWP to note this discrepancy and ask for a copy of his report too see how little information he supposedly gave.  Is it usual to get a call back like this? I can't seem to find anything on the DWP website or other guidance boards as to whether this genuinely happens or if DWP are just ignoring the first report, hoping for one more in their favour ?  Will we be in trouble if he doesn't go again - it's really inconvenient to get him there; we tried for a home visit last month and was told no.   What if hubby says something different from last time, will they hold any discrepancies in answers against us? The more I read about DWP, Atos and the whole PIP process, the more anxious I feel about getting a fair assessment!   Grateful for any advice. 

Replies

  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,257 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi and welcome

    Until the DWP have an assessment report your claim cannot progress so you must attend the appointment or risk having your claim ended.

    It is unusual but not un heard of for a second assessment to be required. It sometimes happens that a report is lost or that an assessor leaves without submitting one up to standard

    Hopefully you still have a copy of your PIP2 form, review what was said on that and if you haven't done so, take a look at the self test on the B&W site

    http://www.mybenefitsandwork.co.uk/pip/indexxx.php

    This will give you some idea of the points system, descriptors and criteria for an award .

    Please come back with any questions

    CR


    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • wildlifewildlife Member Posts: 1,314 Pioneering
    The DWP do have an assessment report and I agree with @ingu1 that they shouldn't have to just accept a further assessment with all the inconvenience and stress that entails. Not without finding out for themselves whether that is completely necessary. By asking to see the report they will be in a much better situation to decide whether to agree to another assessment or not. Also they'll find out whether it was lost or it's not even available. I don't agree they should just accept the situation and feel they have to go to another assessment without finding out more about why it's been requested.
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering
    Hi ingu1,

    One of my clients recently had a second assessment and scored much higher than the first one. It is difficult to say whether your second assessment is a good thing or not until you have seen how many points the first one had recommended.
    If your husband requires a home appointment you need his GP to send them a letter stating that he can't travel and why, and then hopefully they will change the appointment to a home one.
    I can understand how stressful these assessments can be so you definitely deserve more of an explanation about why another one is necessary.

    Lee
    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • lesleyb62lesleyb62 Member Posts: 15 Listener
    Hi 
    I hope you get it sorted out and good luck with if 
     ps. 
    if the dwp can request a second face to face appointment  why cant we !!!! When the report that Attos  sent to dwp was full of lies of things that didn’t even happen such as excersises that were never carried out !! We should be able to demand a second face to face , they put people through enough stress and anxiety make out that we tell lies etc ,,,,, we should’ve sble to switch the boot around

  • wildlifewildlife Member Posts: 1,314 Pioneering
    @lesleyb62 Yes but why should people have to go through that just to get a fair assessment. Also there's no guarantee that another assessor won't do exactly the same as the first. Even more likely if they don't want to make out that the 1st assessor was lying. Then there are those who want to complaint but can't face another assessment like on another discussion. Why should they be forced to have this when they've done nothing wrong. Someone has to start taking responsibility for this mess they still have the claimants written medical evidence and their claim form so believing that would be a start. GP's and Specialists don't lie, they have no reason to and every reason not to. IAS/Capita are going to be very busy not to mention the cost reassessing everyone who complains about their assessor. In the meantime complaints are rejected and the guilty party are left to carry on conning people out of benefits.    
  • lesleyb62lesleyb62 Member Posts: 15 Listener
    @wildlife exactly what I meant by saying what I did ! I recently gone through it my self my report was disgusting full of lies I complained and got a reply that if I wanted to complain to take it up with dwp which I did it and of course they said to take it up with Attos which I did again , I got a reply stating that they will look into it and will write again in 20 days with the out come , so I do know how everyone feeling 
  • wildlifewildlife Member Posts: 1,314 Pioneering
    @lesleyb62 20 days with an outcome? Don't be surprised if this doesn't happen. It took ATOS 5 months last year to investigate my complaint if you call a total rejection that anything was wrong an investigation but you have to do this and get a final reply before going to ICE the Independent Complaints Examiner. My complaint is now in a year long queue awaiting further action as ICE are so snowed under (excuse the pun) with rejected ATOS/Capita complaints. It is better to focus your complaint on what is written in your report and then only if you have strong supporting evidence that it is wrong otherwise they'll just say it can't be proved. 
  • lesleyb62lesleyb62 Member Posts: 15 Listener
    @wildlife  yes I can remember reading that on the post so many of the post about these reports, the paragraphs are the same as if they have been copied and then pasted in i giggles the nurse that did mine actually found him on face book but couldn’t find him on the nurses register , he works for medacs a recruiting company that supplies nurses for Atos and and capita , and what makes me angry is that they forget you have someone with you and basically call then a liar ?? To me it’s deformation of chatacter , the person who went with me wanted to write in and complain too , so I am wondering now if it’s a waste of time !! 
  • wildlifewildlife Member Posts: 1,314 Pioneering
    @lesleyb62 Doing nothing is a waste of time but complaining isn't a waste as even if they reject it you're adding to the number of people who aren't happy with how their assessment was done. The government need to cancel their contracts and will only do that if they have figures to show the system is not working as it should. You may have read that I also contacted ICO the regulators of the Data Protection Act. This act clearly states that companies cannot record incorrect data about people. They rejected my case but if enough people report a problem they will look at the overall situation and should force ATOS to change their ways and handle data in a lawful and responsible manner. They also want you to have approached ATOS first with a final outcome to show you didn't get anywhere. My hubby was with me throughout and wrote several letters but all were ignored but again not a waste of time. It all helps to change the system for the future.
  • lesleyb62lesleyb62 Member Posts: 15 Listener
    @wildlife
    i have complained to Attos and dwp on the second stage with Atos who have said they are liking in to it and have 20 days to resolve and in the mean time would ask me to be patient , dwp said if I have a complaint take it up with Atos ? Now at a loss who to write to now , dwp have said I can apeal but they don’t relise it costs money to get you medical records my GP can charge up to £80 to write a letter , I have one month to apeal and get my evidence ready one of which as already been submitted along with my repeat prescriptions list and of course the dwp ignored it except to say there where no pain killers listed obviously they didn’t take time to read about isamatic heart trouble etc but I will apeal if I have time to get all together 
  • wildlifewildlife Member Posts: 1,314 Pioneering
    @lesleyb62 You can get medical evidence in other ways that don't cost as much. If you attend regular appointments at your Doctors and even see Specialists then the surgery have a record of all that. Ask the admin dept. at your surgery to print off relevant parts of your medical record. Everyone has the right to see this anyway. They may charge you a small admin fee so check first. Ask for any letters from Specialists if you've seen any and don't worry how old the evidence is, it all counts. Have you done a diary of your daily problems and the help you need? Friends and family can also write supporting letters but these are not always seen as strong evidence next to medical evidence. Your Mandatory Reconsideration letter should be sent to DWP and this is to tell DWP what points you should have got and why. Don't mention lies except to let them know you've complained to ATOS. If you need more time you can either send your MR letter and say that more evidence will follow later or you can ring DWP and ask for more time but if you do this make sure you get the new date and record the name of who you speak to and the time and date of the call, just to cover yourself. I did this and got a new date of 4 weeks from the date of the call. Hope that helps...
  • lesleyb62lesleyb62 Member Posts: 15 Listener
    @wildlife
    i did all that and MR wasn’t changed in their letter it states that’s cardiologist specialist letter wasn’t satisfactory and my list of medications it was their thinking that they weren’t relievant to my condition ?? It’s gone to the stage where I can appeal now 
  • wildlifewildlife Member Posts: 1,314 Pioneering
    Oh sorry I didn't realize what stage you were at. They haven't a clue about medication and shouldn't be making judgements about it. I don't know a lot about going to Appeal as I didn't do that. I'm sure someone will be able to help you better than I can.. 
  • lesleyb62lesleyb62 Member Posts: 15 Listener
    @wildlife
    its ok and thank you for your advise it’s really appreciated 
  • MatildaMatilda Member Posts: 2,616 Disability Gamechanger
    Disabilty Rights (DR) site have a good guide to PIP appeals and there is their Handbook priced £15 available from DR site
  • lesleyb62lesleyb62 Member Posts: 15 Listener
    @Matilda
    thsnk you so much I will have a look at that
  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,257 Disability Gamechanger
    Often, the problem is not with your evidence but the way in which it is read
    (or not ) Newer evidence does carry more weight but many people with long term conditions only have older stuff.

    It is important to understand the points system, descriptors and the criteria for an award. A good starting place ids the B&W self test

    http://www.mybenefitsandwork.co.uk/pip/indexxx.php

    Have you requested a copy of the assessment report ?

    Don't get sucked into trying to argue with the assessors point of view, that will not get you an award, only by showing that you meet the criteria will you win.

    The first stage of a tribunal appeal is to submit form SSCS1
    At this stage you only need to give your basic reasons for your appeal,
    Once the tribunal have accepted your request, the DWP will prepare their case and send you a copy of all the evidence used, known as the bundle.
    When you receive this you should first check to make sure that all your evidence is included

    Now, using the bundle you should prepare your own submission

    If you have any new evidence you should attach it to the back of your submission with your name and NI on each page

    A simple formula that I use is as follows

    Write a brief history of your claim. State which descriptors you agree with and the points awarded

    Take each disputed descriptor in turn state the points awarded and what you consider should have been awarded.
    Reference each descriptor to the page and paragraph of the bundle, Lead the reader to the exact place in your evidence that shows that you meet the criteria.

    Make good use of the reliability factors of safety, repeatedly, in a timely manner and to an acceptable standard. These are often ovwerlooked by assessors but can have a big affect on an award

    Do this for each descriptor in turn, some of the tasks are interlinked so difficulty  washing can also have an impact on dressing and preparing food if you have poor grip. Don't expect the reader to make the assumption. It may seem like you are repeating yourself but make it as clear as possilble in each section, make it idiot proof

    Finally, write a brief summary of your case, what points you should have received and the award that this represents

    best of luck

    CR
    Read more at https://community.scope.org.uk/discussion/38035/pip-appeal-help#vuLivAYSJlKvwgzf.99

    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • lesleyb62lesleyb62 Member Posts: 15 Listener
    @CockneyRebel
    thank you so very much 
  • vicr52vicr52 Member Posts: 2 Listener
    I have read cockney the post regarding appeals with interest, especially the part regarding stating what you think the correct discriptor points should be.

    I did this on 2016, I gave the reasons for stating which descriptors I thought were relevant, however the DWP took exception to this and wrote to the appeal that I was not medically qualified to make such suggestion !!.

    I was asked about this at the appeal, I informed them that the decision maker is not medically qualified either, my PIP was reinstated.

    Unfortunatley, they decided this year to assess me again, a year early, the assessment was worse than the first one and she stormed out of the house.

    On my original claim from going from DLA to PIP I answered n/a in the mobility section as I receive a higher award with another one and have a mobility vehicle, when it came to parts 11 and 12 in the assessment I told her not to waste my time as DWP cannot give me the mobility part even if they wanted too, she contacted a supervisor and then informed me that my assessment would be void and I would lose my PIP and have to start over from scratch.

    I asked her for a summary of what she had typed, she refused, I showed her the procedure and guidelines on assessment, she slammed the lap top down and stormed off.

    I sent complaint in writing straight away, however on getting copy of report she was true to her word, zero points for both parts.

    Now had second report after rework, now 4 points for each.

    Hey ho, here we go again, oh and on inspecting second report she has changed wording, deleting paragraphs.

    Capita have replied to my complaint, whitewash as usual.

    Subject access has revealed some interesting insight on the documents and comments they hold ony case, rework was done for 'Legislative error'.

    Throughout the report, in every written comments by the assessor has written the following acronyms.

    CQ, AR, FH, IO, SOH, HOC, MSE, DA.

    The only ones missing are [email protected] and I.K.E.A.







  • o5jessicao5jessica Member Posts: 42 Connected
    Hi ingu1,

    One of my clients recently had a second assessment and scored much higher than the first one. It is difficult to say whether your second assessment is a good thing or not until you have seen how many points the first one had recommended.
    If your husband requires a home appointment you need his GP to send them a letter stating that he can't travel and why, and then hopefully they will change the appointment to a home one.
    I can understand how stressful these assessments can be so you definitely deserve more of an explanation about why another one is necessary.

    Lee
    How gp to send capita letter in pip assemenas date ? I not informed by dwp or on forns  I odd why dwp require  second assesment
  • michelleth64michelleth64 Member Posts: 9 Listener
    I've got 2 discrepancy on my claim I phoned and apparently what I've put on a couple of questions isn't the same as the assessment I have been truthful on all my questions will wait and see what my report says I'm already on lower living component but now claiming mobility as I've osteoarthritis in my knees and hands waiting on a full knee replacement. My hospital specialist was good enough to have a report typed out for me explaining the situation and listing all my meds as I also have ptsd and schizophrenia I was on full living component 3 years ago but last year was dropped to standard rate which I thought was very unfair as my condition as not and will not improve 
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