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PIP appeal advice needed

chocbic73 Member Posts: 4 Listener
Hi, my 21yo daughter has been awarded 7 points for her DLC of PIP whereas previously it was 11 points. Her conditions include absence epilepsy, underactive thyroid, depression, anxiety, OCD and IBS. She is agoraphobic and cannot attend the appeal so we have asked for a tribunal hearing based on the evidence we sent. 

We have just received the paperwork from the DWP with their own response. Do we now have to respond back again? Even though we have sent letters from our GP and her counselor to support our appeal? 

TWO big things stand out as wrong to me in the paperwork from the DWP.

One is that she was awarded no points for preparing food this time ( 4 in the previous award). The assessor states "she chops vegetables and her stepdad watches her. she does not use a sharp knife. she can chop lettuce and tomato. she would not be allowed to handle boiling pans due to safety. she can stir sauces and not lift the pan to drain. she is supervised all times in the kitchen" YET she ticked the box saying "cannot cook a simple meal using a conventional oven but is able to do so using a microwave" surely this box should be the "needs supervision or assistance to be able to either prepare or cook a simple meal"??? 

Two is "Can make complex budgeting decisions unaided" was checked yet in the notes it is written

FH states she is able to buy sweets although tends not to bother. Her parents help her with budgeting and finance. She can calculate the cost of goods
The evidence in the MSE shows good cognition and intellect. The IO's show that she was able to understand the purpose and follow the assessment. Therefore it is likely that on the majority of days Miss - can make complex budgeting decisions unaided  reliably repeatedly and to an acceptable standard"

The above is contradictory surely? This is a 21-year old that can only pay for a bar of chocolate and a can of cola by handing over her purse to the cashier! We explained all this to the assessor. 
It is also very clear in the report that she has over 30 seizures a day so surely the observation that she has a good grip with her hands is overruled by the fact that any grip is lost during a seizure? 

Can I send in a response to the appeal papers even though we have already made a statement or is it unnecessary at this point? no appeal date has yet been given. Thank you in advance. 


  • lillybelle
    lillybelle Member Posts: 556 Pioneering
    I have uncontrolled daily seizures and was awardee 6 points for daily living and 12 for mobility.
    im now going through the MR process hoping to get an extra 2 points.
    in my MR I stated that I was not mentally ill or uneducated and would be very offended if thought otherwise.
    however help on a daily basis is needed during and after seizures for safety reasons . As I have numerous different seizures a day, anytime day or night, outside or inside.
    therefore the 50% rule is applied.
    how an assessor can judge my needs in 60 mins whilst seizure free I do not know.
       I hope this helps as your not alone.
    i don’t expect my MR to get overturned at this stage.
    however I shall take this to a tribuneral as I feel I have a good case.
    people with epilepsy are let down just because it can’t be seen and you are expected to Have other mental problems.
    the fact is- whilst I have seizure and for a period afterwards I can’t see, hear, feel, aware or either anybody or anything. It’s like turning off a light switch.
    and yet apparently an assessor says I can cook a meal with assistance !
    sorry for the rant
    good luck

  • chocbic73
    chocbic73 Member Posts: 4 Listener
    Thankyou Lillybelle - I'm sorry that you are going through this as well! My daughter also got 12 points for mobility so it sounds as if our cases are very similar. 

    What is the 50% rule please I haven't heard of this? 

    Will you go to the tribunal hearing yourself? Unfortunately, my daughter cant leave the house as she has such severe anxiety so a paper hearing is the only option we have. I have heard that this has a very poor success rate. 
  • lillybelle
    lillybelle Member Posts: 556 Pioneering
    the 50% rule means that a person needs care more than 50% of the week not just once or twice a week.
    if you go onto the epilepsy website this is all explained. It was a new ruling that was bought it for people like us who are at risk of harm
    allways keep repeating that she can’t do things for safety reasons.
    eating alone- choking 
    preparing food- burning etc
    bathing- drowning
    toilet needs- incontince due to seizures
    talking to people- how can you do that when you are not properly conscious 
         I don’t have any electrical gadgets on the kitchen units any more.
    during an absence seizure I poured a pint of milk in the electric toaster.
    had a grand mal fit whilst holding the microwave door. This was ripped from its socket and fell on the floor with me.
    loads of plates, cups etc have been smashed. And I wasn’t aware of any of this
    i also had a near miss with a kettle. Luckily I fell before I picked it up however it was on the edge of the worktop.
        All these things that know doubt have happened to your daughter need to be told.
    good luck and keep in touch

  • feir
    feir Member Posts: 395 Pioneering
    Even if she is able to prepare meals supervised she should get some points for that anyway.don't get why she got 0 for them saying she could do that.

    I'm starting to wonder why they are even bothering assessing people. They could just contact your GP or consultant and ask them, which they do ask for permission to do that on the form.
  • lillybelle
    lillybelle Member Posts: 556 Pioneering
    What did she gain points in?
    im sure this should be overturned.
    however get some advice if possible and try to go to the tribuneral if possible to get your point across and let them see her in person
  • chocbic73
    chocbic73 Member Posts: 4 Listener
    feir said:
    Even if she is able to prepare meals supervised she should get some points for that anyway.don't get why she got 0 for them saying she could do that.

    I'm starting to wonder why they are even bothering assessing people. They could just contact your GP or consultant and ask them, which they do ask for permission to do that on the form.
    GP and counselor both wrote letters to back up what we have said also! GP has known her for several years but seems this still wasn't enough. They said in the assessment Decision maker concluded claimant is able to reduce risk by using food choppers, slicers and dicers rather than knives and use microwave-safe dishes that do not heat up in the microwave or break if they are dropped"! Yet clearly noted at the same time she is supervised AT ALL TIMES in the kitchen! crazy! 

    She gained points in the following 
    2 points cant use a conventional cooker but can use a microwave
    1 point needs prompting to manage medication
    2 points needs supervision for bathing and washing safely
    2 points needs prompting to engage with others 

    Question. I have already submitted my statements prior to receiving this pack from DWP - and I have covered in detail all my daughter's problems so do I need to counter and argue the things they have raised here again? 
  • lillybelle
    lillybelle Member Posts: 556 Pioneering
    I do think you need to point out in your MR what exactly she can’t do and why. Give examples of what accidents have happened in the past.
    and keep repeating over and over that she can’t do this activity for safety reasons.
      Spend time reading it properly every detail and making notes why something is wrong.
    if your daughter can’t use a microwave then say why.

  • feir
    feir Member Posts: 395 Pioneering
    Surprised to hear they went against your GP also, who do they think they are?
    But yes @chocbic73 you need to argue against what they said because it is lies and they based their decision on those lies.

    When i fill my form in i'm just not going to agree to having an assessment. You know they're getting ridiculous, they don't use medics qualified in the areas they are assessing and they ignore the people who know what they're talking about. Someone needs to stop them doing this and force them to use proper qualified assessors and to listen to the people who diagnose us. It's poop enough being disabled as it is,  we shouldn't have to keep begging for help all the time on top of that.
  • lillybelle
    lillybelle Member Posts: 556 Pioneering
    Your GP has confirmed diagnosis of her condition but will not know if or how she copes with activities on a daily basis.
    so don’t waste time sending in more medical jargon 
    you have got to point out but by bit why she can not do that specific activity, and the results or what may happen if she did
    Dont start calling the assessor a liar or anything else nasty.
    but explain why the assessor has in your opinion got it wrong.
    i wrote that the assessor based her decision on a 60 minute interview when I had been seizure free for 2 hours. So this was not a clear picture of my daily needs.
    that is the only time I mentioned the assessor and that was at the very end.
    im sure this will get turned around
  • susan48
    susan48 Member Posts: 2,222 Disability Gamechanger
    Congratulations it will be a huge relief for you all
  • Waylay
    Waylay Member Posts: 963 Pioneering
    That's great @chocbic73!

    @feir, unfortunately if they call you in for an assessment, you have to go. If you reschedule/miss two they close your claim.
  • Matilda
    Matilda Member Posts: 2,610 Disability Gamechanger
  • feir
    feir Member Posts: 395 Pioneering
    Waylay said:
    That's great @chocbic73!

    @feir, unfortunately if they call you in for an assessment, you have to go. If you reschedule/miss two they close your claim.
    I just won't engage with them then Waylay. Someone else can do that for me. They don't even have to assess anyway me as i sent in loads of consultant copies of letters and they have plenty of info, one even says on it my symptoms and how my spines condition would cause this stuff.

    Hope you get your one years back pay @chocbic73
  • Waylay
    Waylay Member Posts: 963 Pioneering
    @feir Your choice, obviously! If you can live without the money, keeping your mental health stable may well be worth it.
  • feir
    feir Member Posts: 395 Pioneering
    Got my rejection letter already, they said id didn't get their info to them on time. They just do what they want anyway. And yeah i can live without the money, i'm just completely housebound and have no actual life.


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