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PIP tribunal, errors in law

Catalonia13Catalonia13 Member Posts: 8 Listener
Morning,
Could any one tell me please, at my Tribunal last week (appeal refused) I was not given the opportunity to speak myself, only to answer their questions, I was not asked if I wanted to raise or talk about anything, or refer to any of the papers etc. 
I did not know at the time that I should have been.
Is this an error in law or has the judge erred in law?
Thanks,
Linda

Replies

  • JurphJurph Member Posts: 346 Pioneering
    I'm sorry about your tribunal. That must have been tough.

    Have you asked for a Statement of Reasons?

    I'm not sure you'd be able to use not speaking for yourself as an error of law as technically you did that by answering the questions.


  • Catalonia13Catalonia13 Member Posts: 8 Listener
    edited September 2019
    I have requested the Statement of Reasons.
    I did speak as answered all their questions (I found it quite hostile), but, I was not given the opportunity to rasie any points myself or refer to any of the papers in the bundle, like the submission from my advocate or supporting letters etc.
  • Catalonia13Catalonia13 Member Posts: 8 Listener
    after another question about a holiday this year from the DWP rep (it was the 2nd question by the judge at the beginning)  the judge laughed out loud when I said it's all inclusive, it is a total respite for me and worth £300, she said "£300? I must  be going on the wrong sort of holidays then" and with that wrapped it up real quick, "right, a decision will  be in the post, goodbye" end of!
  • JurphJurph Member Posts: 346 Pioneering
    edited September 2019
    What do you mean by DWP rep?

    I certainly understand why you're annoyed, I'm just not sure it'll be considered an error of law. The statement of reasons might shed some light.

    The things you wanted to refer to were in the bundle which they used as evidence in the decision.

    Did the tribunal award any points that you didn't have before? Or did it stay the same?
  • JurphJurph Member Posts: 346 Pioneering
    Has your advocate been informed? Can they help?
  • Catalonia13Catalonia13 Member Posts: 8 Listener
    there was a rep there from the DWP , she sat beside me
    I would have liked to have been given the opportunity to refer to papers in the bundle, I was not; things like the submission by my advocate and also the substance of the letter from my Immunologist (which was ignored in a previous PIP claim, that one is being re held next month after a District Judge declared the first one cancelled because of 4 errors in law, 3 of which have just been carried out all over again imho)
    points remained the same  6 for DL, 4 for mobility.
    I have raised this with my advocate and asked if the judge has erred in law by not asking me if I wanted to say anything, he said "That is a procedural issue rather than an error I law. It would be grounds for a complaint, but the Judge will argue that she did, and the panel will back her. It is not grounds to argue for an error in law. An error in law is regarding legal reasons for a decision, and not as to how a hearing was conducted."



  • Catalonia13Catalonia13 Member Posts: 8 Listener
    my advocate cannot do anymore until the Statement of Reasons arrives, which I know from my last Tribunal can be months, I'm just getting myself prepared! :)

  • worried33worried33 Member Posts: 399 Pioneering
    the points you got are so close, this must have been brutal for you :(
  • JurphJurph Member Posts: 346 Pioneering
    It sounds like your advocate is pretty clued up.

    He'll know your case so much better than us. I hope he can help you.
  • Catalonia13Catalonia13 Member Posts: 8 Listener
    edited September 2019
    Worried 33 - I know, it's like they are hell bent on not giving me any help, despite the supporting letters from 3 consultants at Addenbrookes, my GP and the submission from my advocate, and the questions, good grief!
    I made a note of them when I got home, still struggling to work out the relevance of some of them, this is just a few

    what alarm do you use to get up in the morning?
    What do you have for breakfast, a banana; do you take the banana back to the lounge to eat? 
    what size is your lounge?
    do you sell your crocheting?

    Have you been on holiday this year?, Yes, When did you go on holiday-  March, where - Egypt, who with- my (elderly) parents, for how long -  one week, what airport - Stanstead, how did I get to the airport – car, who drove me -  my sister, did I have assistance - no because my Father did, “but YOU didn’t”, well no because if one member of a party has it there is no need for others requiring it to request it as well as  you call go together , again, but you didn’t’

    Did I have a holiday last year, when, where, who with etc.

    Who lived with you in January - my son, age – 17,what’s he doing, college, what college,  what course, how does he get there, bus, where from, how often, you don’t drive him? No, he gets the bus outside our door. What was he doing last year, same but different college

    What car do I have, Nissan Note, does it have adaptions – no, she emphasised on it not having adaptations  - not sure what adaptations it could have that would help someone with Lupus, anaemia of chronic disease, ME and other auto immune issues, a driver maybe, lol 



  • christ125christ125 Member Posts: 9 Listener
    Yes I am going through a pip claim.i listed hospital dr under respiratory dept and my gp never once have the contacted those people what are pip.playing at I called em last time and I gotta call em again to see if they have got details from.gp yet or hospital dr yet what do they ask for them.in the forms for honestly pip people 

  • Catalonia13Catalonia13 Member Posts: 8 Listener
    christ125 said:
    Yes I am going through a pip claim.i listed hospital dr under respiratory dept and my gp never once have the contacted those people what are pip.playing at I called em last time and I gotta call em again to see if they have got details from.gp yet or hospital dr yet what do they ask for them.in the forms for honestly pip people 

    I have written letters of support, clearly spelling out the difficulties I have, the tribunal never even referred to any of them

  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    christ125 said:
    Yes I am going through a pip claim.i listed hospital dr under respiratory dept and my gp never once have the contacted those people what are pip.playing at I called em last time and I gotta call em again to see if they have got details from.gp yet or hospital dr yet what do they ask for them.in the forms for honestly pip people 

    Hi,

    It's not their responsibility to contact anyone for any evidence and they very rarely do this. The onus is always on the claimant to make sure evidence is sent to support their claim.
    Proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice I have given to members here on the community.
  • Chloe_ScopeChloe_Scope Scope Posts: 10,653 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @Catalonia13,

    I'm sorry to hear this. I imagine this was extremely frustrating!

    Here is some information on the upper tribunal process which you might find helpful. Please do let us know if you need anymore information.

    I would also suggest seeking some local advice from AdviceLocal.
    Scope

  • Catalonia13Catalonia13 Member Posts: 8 Listener
  • Betsykay19Betsykay19 Member Posts: 9 Listener
    Can anybody help me with my recent post please
  • christ125christ125 Member Posts: 9 Listener
    If I knew that at first I could have got it sorted but it has been  sorted now 
  • Betsykay19Betsykay19 Member Posts: 9 Listener
    What do u mean Christ 125?
  • christ125christ125 Member Posts: 9 Listener
    I have got what I need from me gp
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