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PIP Mobility mandatory reconsideration help

abigail71abigail71 Member Posts: 14 Listener
Hello everyone, I got my decision today over the phone. My mobility ( standard ) was disallowed, daily living I receive the enhanced rate as usual. I put in a change of circumstance 8 months ago as I'd been to citizens advice and they'd said as I can't leave the house or go anywhere without my carer, which is referenced in hospital letters and my care plan that I should now be entitled to the higher rate of mobility, well I got no mobility. 
Spoke to a case manager who said they shouldn't have told me my results over the phone, but since they had he would have a look.
He couldn't understand why it wasn't awarded, and has sent me a copy of the report and told me to argue the mobility by going through the points. He said noone looked at my evidence from what he has seen they've just wrote what the health professional did. 
 PIP case manager then told me to go on gov.uk and look at PIP descriptors, I pointed out there's literally a sentence in my care plan that says * x cannot go out anywhere familiar, or unfamialir on own, severely agoraphobic health conditions ect ect * 
PIP case manager then told me just because social services said so, doesn't mean I'm entitled I repeated I didn't say social services said I was entitled, citizens advice did and social services have first hand knowledge about my mobility issues. 
He then proceeded to tell me all websites claiming to help with PIP are all wrong and noone but PIP know what they're looking for and that was that.
Anybody else took mobility to a mandatory reconsideration stage and won?
I feel like it didn't go well on the phone, but I'm awaiting my report ect that should be here this week. 

Replies

  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi,

    If you disagree with the decision then you have 1 month from that date to request the Mandatory reconsideration (MR) you should put your request in writing stating where you think you should have scored those points and your reasons why. Then add a couple of real life examples of what happened the last time you attempted that activity for each descriptor that applies to you.

    Whether you'll score any points for following and planning a journey will totally depend on how your conditions affect you. A letter stating that you're unable to go anywhere alone and doesn't state anything more than this will not get you a PIP mobility award, what could get you the award will be adding some examples.

    Do be aware that requesting the MR they do look at the whole award again so you do risk losing everything you already have. Of course the award could also be increased or remain the same. Only 15% of MR decisions change so you'll most likely have to take it to Tribunal. Appearing in person will give you the best chance of a decision in your favour. The only downside is that waiting times are huge in most parts of the country and some are waiting as long as 1 year for a hearing date.


    Proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice I have given to members here on the community.
  • abigail71abigail71 Member Posts: 14 Listener
    Hi, just to clear this up,
    The pip case manager said the whole decision would NOT be looked at, only the mobility part as that's what I was saying was incorrect. 
    So is that wrong?

    I do have more evidence, it was just the case manager making a point saying they're looking for this exact scenario and of stated my careplan has that scenario in it, amongst other things but I was told my evidence wasn't even looked at. I'll argue it at MR stage and see what happens.

    It seems daft to ask me for my evidence and they'll look at it this time around. They should've looked at it first time around .. 
  • Alice_HoltAlice_Holt Member Posts: 46 Courageous
    edited March 2020
    Info on MR's:

    https://www.gov.uk/mandatory-reconsideration/how-to-ask-for-mandatory-reconsideration

    https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/appeals/mandatory-reconsideration/

    https://www.advicenow.org.uk/dla-tool

    Will Citizens Advice be helping you with an appeal?


    It sounds like this descriptor might apply:

    1. Planning and following journey

    f.  Cannot follow the route of a familiar journey without another person, an assistance dog or an orientation aid.  12 points.

    https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/pip-points-system


    Who went with you to the assessment?   

    Who accompanies you to the shops / appointments / etc?

    What would happen if you didn't have someone with you?

    I suggest your carer writes a note to include with the MR, explaining why you need to be accompanied on familiar journeys, and confirming the help you need.



    This is a very good guide to the appeal process. 
    https://www.advicenow.org.uk/guides/how-win-pip-appeal

    As poppy says, it is a long process as the Tribunal Service are overwhelmed with appeals due to flawed assessments. Most PIP appeals succeed (c.74% currently).


    Did you score any points on the Mobility component ?

    Have a look at the PIP assessment guide:

    https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/831253/PIP-assessment-guide-part-2-the_assessment-criteria.pdf

    P 111 - to satisfy yourself that an award should have been given and that an appeal is worthwhile.

    "“Follow the route” means make one’s way along a route to a destination. This involves more than just navigation of the route. Safety should be considered in respect of risks that relate to making ones’ way along a route (for example, tendency to wander into the road, inability to safely cross a road or risk of self-harm due to overwhelming psychological distress caused).  The familiar route does not need to be planned – it is familiar. Any significant diversions from that route are therefore irrelevant – it is no longer the familiar route. However, making one’s way around road works, or a change of train platform (i.e. minor diversions) are part of being able to follow the route of a journey. The descriptor refers to “a familiar journey” rather than “any familiar journey”. Accordingly, claimants can satisfy the descriptor by showing that they typically need to be accompanied by another person or an assistance dog or to use an orientation aid on the majority of days when undertaking familiar journeys (it’s not necessary to show that they need such support for every possible familiar journey on most days). This descriptor is most likely to apply to claimants with cognitive, sensory or developmental impairments, or a mental health condition that results in overwhelming psychological distress, who cannot, due to their impairment, work out where to go, follow directions, follow a journey safely or deal with unexpected changes in their journey, even when the journey is familiar. A claimant who suffers overwhelming psychological distress whilst on the familiar journey and who needs to be accompanied to overcome the overwhelming psychological distress may satisfy descriptor"

    Does this apply to you?

  • abigail71abigail71 Member Posts: 14 Listener

    assessment?   

    My carer, I sat there dry heaving due to severe anxiety couldn't speak to the woman, so my carer spoke for me and explained the situation, showed her how when I don't understand I will go like this, and how she is needed to calm me ect

    Who accompanies you to the shops / appointments / etc?
    My carer, who is also on all my hospital and GP letters and I have NEVER attended alone, or gone anywhere alone.


    What would happen if you didn't have someone with you?

    I wouldn't go, and didn't for several years. Due to this my bowel disease and other illness went unmedicated and undiagnosed and  I never attended appointments, I do now so it's documented as they've found what I actually suffer from. I haven't left the house alone since I was 18. I'm now 25. I started to leave the house again when I was 21/22 for appointments.

    My carer DID write a supporting letter explaining things and expanding on my care plan and what difficulties I have in the car, then used supporting hospital letters so they had the opinion of a lot of medical professionals saying the same thing.

    She gave examples of when I can be fine then randomly grab the steering wheel due to panic. Or how I'll start to freak out if I get a slight twinge in my stomach as I then think my bowel disease has flared and I'm gunna need a toilet. Basically every example she gave, she gave the reason behind it, and the letter diagnosing me with it and what it meant for me in my day to day life if that makes sense 

    I have severe psychological issues, I'm under clinical psychology also, but pre this decision I DID meet the mobility criteria for not being able to leave the house due to overwhelming phsyochological distress. I phoned up to change my circumstance as I can now go out and follow journeys, but not alone.

    I know pip does not go off diagnosis but I'm diagnosed ; severe agoraphobia, anxiety and depression and currently under clinical psychology as they think I have something else going on up there.  Undertaken several types of therapy to help me with this and nothing has worked so far, benzodiazepenes aren't an option anymore, 

    I didnt score any points. I previously scored 10. I phoned the scope phone number and they've said they can help me, I'm just concerned because I have no extra proof, I sent in everything and the case manager said it hasn't been read by the look of it so!

  • Alice_HoltAlice_Holt Member Posts: 46 Courageous
    Then to award 0 points seems a very flawed decision.

    The MR is seen by a second DWP decision maker. So enclose copies of all the evidence again with your MR (and refer to the evidence in your reasons for requesting the MR).  I would hope that the second DWP DM would give you a correct award faced with the evidence and reports that the first DM did not look at.

    Good luck.
  • abigail71abigail71 Member Posts: 14 Listener
    Just rechecked my care plan, it states 
    It is important Abigail has the people around her acknowledge her needs and even doing the small things like getting in the car and the level of anxiety this causes
    Abigail has been referred to xyz and needs support to attend these appointments due to physical needs and anxiety
    Abigail experiences severe anxiety to the point she has grabbed steering wheels when carer was driving. She can NOT be rushed and she needs constant verbal reassurance and someone to implement coping mechanisms.
    Abigail needs support when leaving the house to mentally prepare and be ready. She needs support to attend all appointments and without support she would not attend appointments and her health needs would go unmet.
    Abigail spent a number of years not leaving her house and she becomes anxious and irritated. She needs a carer to reassure her and let her spend as much time necessary to prepare to leave the home. It does help if she knows where the toilets are. Abigail needs a carer to understand that the car and journeys cause severe anxiety and that without a carer Abigail would not leave the home.
    Abigail now goes outside but only with a carer due to severe znxiety.
    Abigail cannot use public transport due to severe anxiety, social anxiety and bowel issues.

    That's some parts of it, I thought that would give you guys some insight. Is there anything there that you think DOESNT describe the journey descriptor? Just so I don't waste my time arguing for nothing. That's just my care plan, I have others but I felt this was most relevant evidence I sent in.
  • abigail71abigail71 Member Posts: 14 Listener
    @Alice_Holt
    Well I went to citizens advice with my carer and they said my care plans back up my GP letters which are backed up by diagnosis so they thought it would be fine. I only put parts of my care plan on otherwise it's have gone on forever but it always goes back to why I cant. Thanks for all your help and hopefully it goes well! If not the appeals process seems to have really high results which I didn't expect 
  • Alice_HoltAlice_Holt Member Posts: 46 Courageous
    Yes. Around 74% of PIP appeals succeed at tribunal.
    It rather shows how poor some DWP decisions can be!

    If your local Citizens advice, say you have a good case - then that's very encouraging.

    It's helpful to explain why you can't use public transport on your MR (buses, trains), and also why you may need someone with you getting to the parked vehicle and then from the car to the final destination (shops, surgery, etc).    
  • Ricky69Ricky69 Member Posts: 7 Listener
    I suffer from servere depression and anxiety I dla and had to change over to pip . At first they awared me nothing so I asked them to look at my application again. Thankfully they have awarded me enhance rate daily living and low rate care. So it's definitely worth letting them look at it again. 
  • abigail71abigail71 Member Posts: 14 Listener
    @Ricky69
    I'm glad you got yours sorted!!
    Ive never had dla but my friend did and the switch to pip meant they got nothing at all !
  • Ricky69Ricky69 Member Posts: 7 Listener
    Its all wrong I hope it gets sorted soon. 
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