Lodging an MR

nh74

Hi, I'm new to here and have yet to introduce myself. Could I please ask for support regarding my failed pip I'm looking to do an MR and would appreciate some help.
I applied for pip in February. At the time I couldn't get an appointment with CAB to help me fill the forms in but used their website to answer the questions. It took a good week as I wanted to give as much detail as possible. After a couple of years of debilitating pain, tiredness, memory loss and numerous other problems I finally got a diagnosis of Fibromyalgia. I looked into what it was and it all made perfect sense as to why i felt so ill all the time. Anyway, I've had a telephone assessment and then a few weeks ago the decision came. I scored 10 points for daily living and 4 for mobility. Looking at the report, the assessor has taken no notice of the original claim form and has used parts that I've said ( maybe, as I can't actually remember everything that I said, so I'm taking her word for it) against me. I know for sure I would have told her how my symptoms varies from day to day and even within the day. But that the majority of days are bad and on odd days where I push myself to do more how I'll then suffer for days afterwards. In reality I'm debilitated most of the time. At first I wondered if I was just being greedy and maybe I should be happy to have gotten something but the report isn't a valid representation of how fibromyalgia affects my daily life. I'm going to ask for an MR. I've asked over the phone and have to send written evidence in. My GP has  written me a letter and I've printed off CRMR1 forms. But has anyone got any advice or tips please? I gave so many details in the application form that aside from repeating myself I'm unsure what to do. I work 2 4 hour shifts a week that I had to cut down from 5 days due to my health although currently furloughed. My manager has pulled me in the office many times over phoning in sick and I've had to have adjustments made at work. I'm considering allowing her to dismiss me whereas in the past i think she's felt sorry for me and so kept me on. But I'm seriously thinking if it's worth struggling as much for just a few hours pay!?
 
Sorry for the long post, any advice would be welcomed. Thanks so much.

katho31

hi, sorry to hear about your distressing situation, someone will hopefully respond soon and be of further help, keep strong and good luck:)

nh74

Thanks I hope so!

woodbine

Hi @nh74 and welcome to scope, the thing with an MR is to concentrate on where you think you should have scored points but didn't and try and give some examples of what happened when you tried to do something, I would say that they take little notice of letters from GP's as whilst they may know a lot about the condition they won't know how it affects you on a day to day basis, did you send any written evidence with your original claim?

nh74

Thanks for replying @woodbine. I sent the letter from the Rheumatoid consultant's diagnosis. What else would be deemed as evidence? 

woodbine

Any letters from consultants but don't overdo it.
If there's anything esle we can help with please ask.

nh74

I only had the one as all other follow ups were put on hold due to covid. Actually having an MRI brain scan on Saturday to see if any change from last one a couple of years ago (suffered a bleed on the brain from a car accident late 2017) thats where the problems all started. Also, do you know if they will look at the original claim form too? There were examples in it that explained what happened when I did things. 

woodbine

They might look at the original claim form, did you keep a copy of it?

mikehughescq

1 - the success rate for MRs is around 16%. Essentially random.

2 - do not do an MR unless you have identified specifically where your extra 2 points are going to come from.

3 - less is more. Throwing medical evidence at them is not a great tactic. What does it actually say? Is it directed at the activity you have identified which would get you the 2 points? 

4 - anecdotal evidence is key. Real world examples of what happens when you perform that specific activity. 

5 - the fact your symptoms vary has already been taken into account where you wouldn’t have scored points. It’s been accepted you can’t do specific things reliably. Arguing you’re even less reliable doesn’t do anything. Identify where the extra 2 points should come from. 

6 - 4 points on mobility is either needing prompting or 50 to 200 metres. I’d guess the latter but you tell me. My experience tells me that your current award is a good one for fibromyalgia given that the medical profession is split on the condition but really you need advice before you decide what to do next.

7 - getting a diagnosis is neither here nor there and a diagnosis of fibromyalgia is by no means helpful. 

nh74

 @woodbine, yes the CAB got back to me before I posted the original and they looked over my claim and made a copy for me before posting. @mikehughescq, the lady I saw said I'd done a good job at answering the questions and had provided examples of what happens when I perform an activity. It was easy to see where they hadn't given points. Am I right that the decision should be based on performing that activity as often as needed? Eg, if on the majority of days I'm unable to prepare and cook a meal due to intense pain/fatigue so either go without because the hassle of doing it outweighs eating or if I must provide some nourishment for my 14 yo daughter so she orders delivery food in and I manage twice a week to cook then what score should I get? Even on a good day I have to use the stool to sit down. There's others in DL. And yeah you're right, the mobility 4 points came from 50m but no more than 200m which again if I do my shopping in a supermarket I'm then laid up for days afterwards unable to manage even the simplest of tasks. It's whether they say that if I can do something on a good day then it's fine if I can't for the next 5 but surely thats not right?

mikehughescq

It's all about whether you can do stuff reliably i.e. safely, repeatedly, to a reasonable standard or in a reasonable time. 

PP78

Hi @nh74, and sorry to hear about your situation. You've probably made a decision about your MR by now, but thought I'd reply as your PIP experience sounds almost the same as mine.

I applied back in Feb also, and had a telephone assessment on the 1st June, and had the outcome a few weeks ago. I took a bit of time deciding whether to do an MR or not. In the end I did appeal after asking for advice and experiences on forums, including here.

The report you had sounds so similar, as on mine the assessor only listed 1 document (out of 20+ of evidence I sent) as being used in making decisions - and they got the dates of the evidence completely wrong too -  and stated incorrect facts and contradicted themselves within their own report.

As @mikehughescq says, the success rate of MRs is fairly low, though taking it on to Tribunal is apparently fairly successful. I think I saw somewhere, maybe on these forums, that the success rate is now more around the 40-50% mark.

Concentrating on the areas where you can gain the extra points, rather than re-making the same points made in your original application, as they already have all that and will still refer to it. 

Also, a piece of advice I read on another forum/website was to point out glaring errors made in the report - obvious factual inaccuracies, or where a strong piece of evidence which would gain points has clearly been ignored. This would undermine the confidence in the accuracy of the report and its recommendations.

Good luck!

mikehughescq

The success rate at appeal is ordinarily around 76%. Anecdotally, as with telephone assessments and MRs it is currently much higher. 

I can only echo the advice re the HCP report. Don’t rip it apart. It simply needs undermining with a couple of obvious things and then you can move onto concentrating on the strength of your own evidence.