Esa

Melin

Hi a quick question my partner was on ssp for 28 week which has end this week he is going to apply new style esa this week how long will it take him to get his first payment l would be grateful if l can get some answers please 

woodbine

here you go;
https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/employment-and-support-allowance-phase

poppy123456

HI,

He will need a fit note from his GP and the SSP1 form to be able to claim New style ESA. If he's paid the correct amount of NI contributions in tax years April 2017 to April 2019 then he'll be able to claim it. It pays £74.35 per week (over 25) or £58.90 (under 25) It's paid for 1 year unless placed into the Support Group.

First payment can take about 2-3 weeks sometimes longer.

This link will tell you how to claim it. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/new-style-employment-and-support-allowance#how-to-apply

Melin

Thankyou for your replies 

Melin

Hi my husband has applied new style esa last week online  and today with no other notice he recieved his esa50 form he has sent his sick note and recieved a text saying they have got it but we didn’t think we will get the form this quick will he start getting his first payment after he send the form and get an assessment or will he start getting  paid after  l am very confused 

poppy123456

He will receive £74.35 per week at the moment. Once he's assessed and had the work capability assessment if the decision is to place him into the Support Group then he'll receive extra money from the 14th week of his claim. If a decision hasn't been made by this time if he's placed into this group then he'll receive any backdated money owed. Support Group rate is £113.55 per week. If he's not placed into the Support Group then payments will end after 1 year.

Melin

Hi poppy thankyou very much for your reply the only thing is he didn’t start to receive any money yet or no letter from dwp we only received the letter from the assesment service to fill the form in 

poppy123456

It can take 2-3 weeks to start receiving the money, it's paid every 2 weeks. They are just extremely quick in sending the work capability assessment form out. He'll very likely receive first payment before he receives the letter from DWP.

Melin

Thankyou poppy he has recently been awarded pip daily leaving and standard mobility will this take any affect him to be put in the support group or it has got nothing to do with it ?

poppy123456

You're welcome. PIP and ESA are 2 completely different benefits with totally different criteria. See the Support Group descriptors here https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/employment-and-support-allowance/esa-glossary/1353-support-group-descriptors

Regulation 35 (exceptional circumstances) also a route into the Support Group is explained here. https://cpag.org.uk/welfare-rights/resources/article/making-exception

Melin

Hi need some advice as l have said before my husband has applied esa but today received a letter saying he doesn’t have enough National insurance concibutions but when we look at his national insurance record it says full year and he has been on sick pay which shows his national insurance was being paid we don’t know what to do should we apply universal credit 

poppy123456

It's not this year that counts it's tax years April 2017 to March 2018 and April 2018 to March 2019. If he hasn't paid enough during those 2 tax years then he won't be entitled to claim NsESA. In the letter he was sent it should tell you which year he hasn't paid the correct amount. Then he can look at his NI contributions online here https://www.gov.uk/check-state-pension

Universal Credit is a means tested benefit and claiming this will depend on your circumstances as a couple because you'll need to claim together. Savings/capital of more than £16,000 will exclude you from claiming. Savings between £6,000 and £16,000 will see a reduction of £4.35 per month for every £250 (or part there of) over that amount.

If you're working then your earnings received during your monthly assessment periods will reduce the amount of UC you're entitled to.

Use a benefits calculator to check entitlement because there's no point in claiming if you're not entitled.

https://www.entitledto.co.uk/benefits-calculator/Intro/Home?cid=6c9dbad3-3d53-410f-ab52-4085df543410

Do be aware also that a claim for UC will end any tax credits you may already be claiming and you can never go back.

Was he working during those 2 tax years?

Melin

Thankyou poppy yes he was working the full 2 tax years only he was getting sick pay for a while at 2019 could it be becouse of that

Melin

We have looked at his national insurance records and it says full for the 2 tax years

poppy123456

• First contribution condition - in one of the last two complete tax years, you must have paid Class 1 or 2 contributions on relevant earnings at the lower earnings limit for at least 26 weeks. This means you must have worked for at least 26 weeks of the last two complete tax years; and
• Second contribution condition - in both of the last two complete tax years, you must have paid or been credited with, Class 1 or 2 contributions to the value of 50 times the lower earnings limit.

The 2 tax years that are relevant are the ones that were completed before the benefit year in which your period of limited capability for work began.

• The tax year runs 6 April - 5 April
• The benefit year runs from the first Sunday in January.
• The lower earnings limit for the 2018/19 tax year was £116, for the 2019/2020 tax year it was £118 per week

If he thinks the decision is incorrect then he'll need to ring DWP and speak to them,.

Melin

Thankyou poppy he will be calling them tomorrow 

Tori_Scope

I hope the call goes well today @Melin  

Melin

Hi update about the call today we have been told that becouse my husband was on sick pay 2019 he had been paid class 3 national Insurance credits which makes him not able to claim new style esa we have been told that he has to apply for universal credit which we have not got a clue about 

poppy123456

Class 3 doesn't allow him to claim NsESA. Although it's unusual for an employer to pay class 3 usually it's class 1. Class 3 is usually paid voluntary by yourself if you have missing years for your state pension.

Claiming universal Credit will totally depend on both of your circumstances because it's a means tested benefit you'll need to claim as a couple. It's impossible to give any further advice without knowing your circumstances, for example, do you work, own or rent your own home etc etc.

Use a benefits calculator to check entitlement. https://www.entitledto.co.uk/benefits-calculator/Intro/Home?cid=d237f7de-f08e-4e65-a02a-4d3567b0a381

When using the benefits calculator, one question asks if your partner has a limited capability for work, for this you tick no because he hasn't yet been assessed as having LCW.

If you have savings/capital of more than £16,000 you'll be excluded from claiming. A claim for UC will end any tax credits you may already be claiming.

Boyden1964

Hi I don't know if you have sorted your ESA out. I had the same problem as your husband. It will almost certainly be due to him getting ssp if this is the case you can apply for credits all you need to do is send in his last 3 payslips that's what I did and got paid ESA as you are claiming New style ESA you can also claim universal credit along side it they will take ESA off your entitlement pound for pound you are no worse off as you get your ESA payment. My advice would be to get in touch with your local benefits adviser your local council can give you a number to call. Hope this is of any help to you?

poppy123456

Boyden1964 said:

Hi I don't know if you have sorted your ESA out. I had the same problem as your husband. It will almost certainly be due to him getting ssp if this is the case you can apply for credits all you need to do is send in his last 3 payslips that's what I did and got paid ESA as you are claiming New style ESA you can also claim universal credit along side it they will take ESA off your entitlement pound for pound you are no worse off as you get your ESA payment. My advice would be to get in touch with your local benefits adviser your local council can give you a number to call. Hope this is of any help to you?

It will also depend on how much they worked during those 2 tax years i mentioned above. Claiming UC will also depend on their circumstances because not everyone is entitled to claim this. Claiming New style ESA doesn't mean you're also entitled to UC.

Melin

Hi thankyou for your comments l have been out of work since last year due illness and didn’t know l was entitled to anything as l said my husband has been on sick pay for a very long time and has just came to the end so he is not getting any payment from anywhere either any more l spoke to dwp and was told we must be entitled to universal credit as we don’t get severe disability premium becouse my son lives with us.  

Melin

We have been told he can only get new style esa credits not any payments and if we want any payments we should claim universal credit l don’t know what to do shall my husband fiil in the form that came from capality assesment for esa or should we just claim universal credit sorry if l am repeating myself we have been working for years and really don’t know anything or what to do

poppy123456

You would definitely not be claiming the severe disability premium because this is only paid with certain means tested benefits and you don't claim any of those.

As i previously said, it's extremely difficult to give any advice without knowing all of your circumstances. Did you use the benefits calculator that i posted above?

As your husband has been claiming sick pay for a long time then i would guess that this is the reason why he's not entitled to New style ESA because you need to have paid class 1 or class 2 NI contributions in those 2 tax years.

Whether you're entitled to UC will depend on both of your circumstances. Do either of you receive any works pension? If you do then this will be classed as income for UC purposes and reduce it £1 for £1.

Standard allowance for couples over 25 is £594.04 per month. You haven't said whether you own or rent your home? If you rent it then you'll be able to claim the housing element of UC as part of your maximum entitlement. How much you'll be entitled to will depend on your circumstances and whether you're renting from social housing or a private landlord.

Does either of you claim either daily living PIP or DLA mid/high rate care? If you then the person that doesn't claim it will be able to claim the carers element of UC. Your husband will need to send in fit notes to start the work capability assessment off and for this he'll need to speak to his GP and the sooner he does this the better.

UC is paid monthly and all the elements will be paid in 1 payment. Your first payment is 5 weeks after you submit your claim.

You need to claim online here https://www.gov.uk/apply-universal-credit

You also say you haven't worked since last year, if you've paid the correct amount of NI contributions in those 2 tax years then you maybe entitled to claim New style ESA but a fit note from your GP will be needed. If you claim this and UC then the new style ESA will be deducted in full from any UC entitlement.

Please use the benefits calculator i posted above.

Melin

Hi poppy yes l did the benefit calculator and it does show l will be entitled for universal credit we rent privately and have been getting housing benefit for a long time me and my husband we both are getting pip standard rate for both 

Melin

We don’t get any pensions 

poppy123456

Melin said:

Hi poppy yes l did the benefit calculator and it does show l will be entitled for universal credit we rent privately and have been getting housing benefit for a long time me and my husband we both are getting pip standard rate for both 

Thanks for that, that does help me and now i can advise you further.

Once you claim UC your housing benefit will continue for 4 weeks and then stop and transfer to UC. There will be no non dependant deductions for your housing element because you're claiming PIP. This means you'll be entitled to the housing element, couples standard allowance of £594.04 and you can each claim the carers element for looking after each other, which will be £162.92 x 2 (£325.84) BUT you'll need to make sure you report that you are caring for your husband and he's caring for you. You do not need to claim carers allowance to claim the carers element of UC. (providing no one else claims the carers allowance or carer element for looking after you of course)

As you will both be claiming the carers element for each other, you will not have any work commitments and you'll be placed into the "no work related requirements group"

You can send in fit notes to start the work capability assessment process off for either yourself or your husband or even both BUT if you're placed into the LCWRA group you can only receive 1 LCWRA element per claim. Also if placed into this group then one of the carers elements will end and will be replaced with LCWRA element. So basically, it means you'll be £179 per month better off from the 4th month of your claim but this is only if placed into the LCWRA group.

I know this is extremely confusing but the sooner you start your claim for UC the sooner you'll start receiving some money each month. If you need any help and advice along the way please do just shout and i'm sure someone will advise you further.

Hope this helps just a little.

Just to add, if your husband is waiting for any final wages from his employer it will be worth your while waiting to claim UC after he's received his final pay, otherwise it will reduce your UC by 63%.

Melin

Thankyou very much for your comments poppy about the carers element my son is claiming careers allowance but no one is claiming carers allowance for my husband so will l be able to claim the carers element for him then ? l am confused sorry 

Melin

My son is claiming Carers allowance from me by the way 

poppy123456

Then you'll be able to claim the carers element of UC for looking after your husband. You don't need to claim carers allowance to be able to claim the carers element. If you do claim them both together then the carers allowance will be deducted in full from your UC entitlement.

This means that your husband will definitely need to send in fit notes from his GP to start the work capability assessment process off.

Melin

Thankyou so much poppy

poppy123456

You're very welcome

Melin

Good evening l have got a question regarding my universal credit claim in the application there is a question asking are you and your partner both name on the tenancy agreement on my tenancy agreement it’s only on my name so l gave a call to universal credit help line and they told me to answer no because it’s only on my name but no where in the application does not ask anything else about my agreement so will the stil pay my rent from universal credit 

poppy123456

There shouldn't be any problems with them adding the housing element to yout maximum UC entitlement.

Melin

Thankyou poppy

poppy123456

You're welcome.

Melin

Hi really need help as l am very confused as l did say in my previous post my husband has been denied new style esa because he hasn’t paid enough national insurance so we was told to claim universal credit which we have started a claim and esa did send a esa50 form before the decision so we thought we don’t need to fill the esa50 because we are not getting it anyway but yesterday my husband has received a letter saying he should fill the esa50 form to get esa and the letter was sent on the 11th of November and the last day was the 20 th of November will him not sending the esa50 form make any effect on our universal credit claim?

poppy123456

Melin said:

Hi really need help as l am very confused as l did say in my previous post my husband has been denied new style esa because he hasn’t paid enough national insurance so we was told to claim universal credit which we have started a claim and esa did send a esa50 form before the decision so we thought we don’t need to fill the esa50 because we are not getting it anyway but yesterday my husband has received a letter saying he should fill the esa50 form to get esa and the letter was sent on the 11th of November and the last day was the 20 th of November will him not sending the esa50 form make any effect on our universal credit claim?

Although the UC work capability assessment for limited capability for work is exactly the same as the ESA one, it won't make any difference if he doesn't fill it in and return it. Although he should ring the health assessment advisory service and tell them that he's not claiming ESA because his claim from refused because of lack of NI contributions. Details here. https://www.chdauk.co.uk/contact-us

He may also want to ring DWP to tell them the same thing.

I did think it was rather forward planning when he was sent the form before his claim had even started.

Just so that you're aware if he's sending in fit notes for UC the form he'll be sent for the work capability assessment is the same, except it's the UC50 instead of the ESA50.

Melin

Thankyou very much poppy 

poppy123456

You're welcome.

Melin

Hi just spoken to esa and have been told my husband still needs to fill the form in as they will give him national insurance credits l told them we have applied universal credit but they told us it doesn’t matter he still needs to fill in the form and send it off or he will be find fit to work ! 

poppy123456

NsESA pays class 1 NI credits. UC pays class 3. Both go towards state pension, although class 1 can count towards some benefit claims, as well as working in previous 2 tax years. He can't claim NsESA and receive the money because he's not paid the correct amount of NI contributions in the relevant tax years.

I don't know how they can find someone fit for work when they have no entitlement to a benefit. The claim was refused, which you should have received a letter telling you the claim was refused. The claim can be left open if you ask for a credits only claim, if you didn't then it should have been closed.

Even if both NsESA and UC were claimed together the money from ESA would be deducted in full from any UC, which doesn't apply to him anyway.

You're now claiming UC and if he's sending fit notes in for this he will be refered for a work capability assessment and the UC50 form will be sent.

I'd ring DWP/ESA to ask.

poppy123456

Melin said:

Hi really need help as l am very confused as l did say in my previous post my husband has been denied new style esa because he hasn’t paid enough national insurance so we was told to claim universal credit which we have started a claim and esa did send a esa50 form before the decision so we thought we don’t need to fill the esa50 because we are not getting it anyway but yesterday my husband has received a letter saying he should fill the esa50 form to get esa and the letter was sent on the 11th of November and the last day was the 20 th of November will him not sending the esa50 form make any effect on our universal credit claim?

@Adrian_Scope can you please help here. I've quoted the question for you here because it's rather a long thread and would take a while to read through all of it.

My opinion here is i don't understand the need to fill out the ESA50 form when the claim was refused because of lack of NI contributions. UC is now being claimed.

Melin

Thankyou for your reply’s we have told them exactly the same thing and they said when universal credit will start paying him they will close the claim anyway but l just don’t understand why keeping a claim open if they are not even going to pay him  l am stuck now and don’t know what to do shall we fill the esa50 form or not or just wait until they will eventually close the claim

Boyden1964

It could be worth filling out the ESA50 form because the credits will count towards your NI contributions and over time you should start getting some money when you have enough credits on universal credit you only get credits towards your pension. You should only have one assessment as both UC and ESA are the same but on the other hand it does not make difference either way the money works out the same as I get both universal credit and ESA that's because ESA is taken pound for pound from your universal credit. Hope this has helped in making your decision.

poppy123456

Boyden1964 said:

It could be worth filling out the ESA50 form because the credits will count towards your NI contributions and over time you should start getting some money when you have enough credits

That's not correct. As the person hasn't worked enough and paid the correct amount of NI contributions then an ESA claim will never be in payment. NI credits alone is not enough for payments to be made.

poppy123456

Melin said:

Thankyou for your reply’s we have told them exactly the same thing and they said when universal credit will start paying him they will close the claim anyway but l just don’t understand why keeping a claim open if they are not even going to pay him  l am stuck now and don’t know what to do shall we fill the esa50 form or not or just wait until they will eventually close the claim

The claim should already be closed unless you asked for it to be a credits only claim. My advice is to ring DWP to ask.

Adrian_Scope

Thanks for the tag @poppy123456. 

@Melin, the first thing I would suggest is to double check what they've said regarding the SSP and NI credits. He should be eligible for class 1 for that period and it may be worth him applying for that. See below:

You’re on Statutory Sick Pay and you do not earn enough to make a qualifying year

Apply for Class 1 credits. Write to: PT Operations North East England, HM Revenue and Customs, BX9 1AN, United Kingdom. Include your National Insurance number and say when the credits are for and why you’re eligible

With regards to your UC claim and the ESA50 form you already have, if his ESA is now credits-only, your husband filling in and sending the ESA50 could still be worthwhile. The decision from his credits-only ESA claim would still transfer over to UC and would mean you're not serving a longer wait period than necessary as it would begin from the date of his NS ESA claim, not your joint UC one which I believe was much later?

poppy123456

@Adrian_Scope thank you very much for that!

Melin

Thankyou very much for the comments l have spoken to dwp (esa) and just been told they are closing the claim as we have started a claim with universal credit 

poppy123456

Thanks for letting us know. I thought that maybe what might happen but am surprised they didn't already do that, if your partner didn't ask for a credits only claim.

Melin

Hi sorry if  l am keep asking questions but l really don’t know about the system on citizen advise website l have read that l need to book an appointment with my work coach but on my web jeornal it says they will contact me  if they need anything do l need to call universal credit helpline and ask or should l just wait until they will contact me.

poppy123456

Face to face appointments are mostly suspended, especially if you live in England because we are still in a lockdown. Your journal is correct, if they need anything they will contact you.

Melin

Thankyou so much poppy