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Dad’s State Pension age reached and Joint ESA with mum stopped.

Hi. My dad had reached state pension age and his joint ESA with my mum has stopped. He was supposed to start receiving SP at the end of May, but there was a problem that’s held it up and it will likely take a few weeks to now come through. 

I didn’t realised ESA would stop when SP was claimed either. My dad receives DLA as well and my mum receives CA for him. Will these also stop?

She is a few years away from SP but her ESA was joint with my dad and she’s no longer entitled to that. Can she claim for anything else?

Finally, does SP also include pension from work? Before my dad was sick, he worked for decades and should have a work pension as well but I’m unsure how to go about claiming it for him. 

Any help is appreciated. Thanks. 

Replies

  • janer1967janer1967 Member Posts: 11,201 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi there I'm no expert when it comes to retirement bit your mum's dla will continue 

    Work pension and sp are separate and you need to contact his work pension provider to sort out his claim 
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 2,217 Pioneering
    edited June 12
    ESA is a working age benefit and stops when the claimant reaches pension age (regardless of whether or not they claim their SP). 
    ESA is never a joint claim, it is claimed by one person and their partner is included in the calculation but is not a claimant.
    As the ESA was in dad's name it has stopped. I think he should have received a letter earlier in the year advising him it would stop.
    If it had been mum's ESA claim it would have continued.

    His DLA continues. Her CA continues.

    A work pension is separate from State Pension. To claim the works pension he will need to contact the provider. He should have annual letters from them which will have contact details.

    As a 'mixed age couple' they may be able to claim Universal Credit but whether or not there is any entitlement will depend on their overall income.
    Because his ESA has stopped dad would have to have another Work capability Assessment to see if he qualifies for the LCWRA component of UC.
    Mum would be entitled to the carer element of UC.
    Any pension income and the CA will be deducted from the maximum UC amount when determining whether anything is payable.

    Do they own or rent their home? If they were claiming housing Benefit in his name that will also stop and to get help with rent they would have to get this through Universal Credit.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • woodbinewoodbine Community Co-Production Group Posts: 4,512 Disability Gamechanger
    Your mum will still be able to claim Carers allowance until she herself reaches SRP age, as above he needs to contact the private pension, if it's a defined contribution pension he will have the option of taking it as cash, if it's a defined benefits pension it will pay a monthly sum.
    The link below has details on how to track down a pension if needed.

    https://www.moneyadviceservice.org.uk/en/articles/trace-lost-pensions-and-request-pension-forecasts
    "Putting a child into care, isn't caring for a child" (T.Rhattigan)
  • oldestdaughteroldestdaughter Member Posts: 11 Listener
    calcotti said:
    ESA is a working age benefit and stops when the claimant reaches pension age (regardless of whether or not they claim their SP). 
    ESA is never a joint claim, it is claimed by one person and their partner is included in the calculation but is not a claimant.
    As the ESA was in dad's name it has stopped. I think he should have received a letter earlier in the year advising him it would stop.
    If it had been mum's ESA claim it would have continued.

    His DLA continues. Her CA continues.

    A work pension is separate from State Pension. To claim the works pension he will need to contact the provider. He should have annual letters from them which will have contact details.

    As a 'mixed age couple' they may be able to claim Universal Credit but whether or not there is any entitlement will depend on their overall income.
    Because his ESA has stopped dad would have to have another Work capability Assessment to see if he qualifies for the LCWRA component of UC.
    Mum would be entitled to the carer element of UC.
    Any pension income and the CA will be deducted from the maximum UC amount when determining whether anything is payable.

    Do they own or rent their home? If they were claiming housing Benefit in his name that will also stop and to get help with rent they would have to get this through Universal Credit.
    Thanks. This was really helpful! I’ve also called my local citizens advice to ask some questions. 

    His pension has finally been approved and should be paid very soon which is a relief. I’ll be helping them apply for UC and hope he will qualify for the LCWRA component. 

    They rent their home from a housing association and they’ve received a letter from their local council to say “housing benefit and/or council tax support are suspended”. I understand they have to claim through UC now but the letter states there are “changes in your DWP benefits” and we need to provide “documentary evidence that resulted in the revised DWP benefit awards from 2021”. I’m unclear on what this means exactly?

    I’m also increasingly worried about housing benefit in general as I’ve looked into this and my understanding is the following: if you have non-dependants and your housing benefit is fully paid, you need to be middle or higher rate care component of DLA. Is this right? My dad is on lower rate for care and higher rate for mobility, but their housing benefit has been fully paid for since he started receiving DLA. Was this not meant to be the case? Should their non-dependants have been contributing? And I f so, what happens now?

    Thank you for taking the time to help. I really appreciate it.
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 2,217 Pioneering
    edited June 18
    oldestdaughter said:
    They rent their home from a housing association and they’ve received a letter from their local council to say “housing benefit and/or council tax support are suspended”. I understand they have to claim through UC now but the letter states there are “changes in your DWP benefits” and we need to provide “documentary evidence that resulted in the revised DWP benefit awards from 2021”. I’m unclear on what this means exactly?
    Help with rent will be through UC but not CTR. The council need to recalculate the CTR based on changed circumstances so they need to know what his revised situation is. Once UC is in place they should be able to get information feed from UC. Best thing is to ring them and see what they need.
    oldestdaughter said: I’m also increasingly worried about housing benefit in general as I’ve looked into this and my understanding is the following: if you have non-dependants and your housing benefit is fully paid, you need to be middle or higher rate care component of DLA. Is this right? My dad is on lower rate for care and higher rate for mobility, but their housing benefit has been fully paid for since he started receiving DLA. Was this not meant to be the case? Should their non-dependants have been contributing? And I f so, what happens now?
    For Housing Benefit any level of care component DLA gives rise to exemption from a  non dependant deduction so there is no cause for concern about past HB. However for UC the exemption only applies if the claimant has mid or high rate care DLA. It may therefore be that there will be non dependant deductions in the UC calculation. These are called housing cost contributions and are a flat rate of £75.53/month (unlike HB which has a tiered range of deduction amounts). Who lives with them and what are their ages/circumstances?
    see https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/non-dependants
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • oldestdaughteroldestdaughter Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Hi. Thanks. Okay, what about the housing benefit? And if it should have been fully paid before now or that was a mistake?
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 2,217 Pioneering
    edited June 18
    Hi. Thanks. Okay, what about the housing benefit? And if it should have been fully paid before now or that was a mistake?
    Sorry - cross posted. Still editing my previous reply as you posted!
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • oldestdaughteroldestdaughter Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Ah, sorry for being impatient! Thanks. 

    Okay, that’s a huge relief. Thanks! So as I understand it, my dad would need to be on the mid or higher care component for DLA on UC? If that’s right, would it be worth asking them to reevaluate him for DLA now (before applying for UC)? It was last reviewed years ago and his health has deteriorated quite a bit. I’m pretty sure he’s eligible for at least the mid care component now. 

    As for who lives with him and their circumstances: excluding my mum, it’s his 5 children. They’re aged 20, 23, 24, 26 and 31. The oldest two have full time jobs and the other three are full time students. The 23 year old is studying abroad. 
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 2,217 Pioneering
    Ah, sorry for being impatient! Thanks. 
    You weren’t. I posted and then realised I’d missed something so rethought it. 
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 2,217 Pioneering
    edited June 18
     ...would it be worth asking them to reevaluate him for DLA now (before applying for UC)? 
    If you ask them to reassess his DLA he will have to apply for PIP. This may be worth doing but should only be done if you have looked at how PIP works and assessed how your dad might score. 
    https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/pip-points-system

    PIP claims take a long time, as many threads on this forum testify.

    Your starting point, if you have not done so yet, is to put all the details into a benefit calculator to determine whether or not there is likely to be some UC entitlement (assume that LCWRA will be awarded when doing the calculation). If there is, in my opinion, it makes no sense to delay claiming UC as they would simply be missing out on income while they delay.

    As regards the non dependant deductions there would be two deductions for the two in work, none for the students. You should make sure these are taken into account when you do the calculation.

    if the calculation shows no entitlement then obviously there is no point in applying for UC.

    Calculation should show standard couple allowance plus housing element plus LCWRA element plus carer element. There will then be a deduction in full for the Carer’s Allowance, State Pension and occupational pension.

    The housing element will be calculate as the rent minus two housing cost contributions.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • oldestdaughteroldestdaughter Member Posts: 11 Listener
    This was a really thorough explanation and I’m super grateful for the help. I’ll update my parents and help them get started. I hope it’s okay to come back and ask questions again. Have a great weekend and take care :smile:
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 2,217 Pioneering
    edited June 18
    I have just realised, there appears to be something wrong with what you have said about their benefits. You said she gets CA for looking after him but that he only gets low rate care DLA. She is not eligible for CA if he only gets low rate care. If she gets CA he should be on mid or high rate care. 
    https://www.gov.uk/carers-allowance/eligibility
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • oldestdaughteroldestdaughter Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Oh, I have his proof of entitlement but it’s from 2016 so perhaps it changed? DLA is split into two entitlements and it shows he receives the lower rate care component but the higher mobility component. I’ll check with DLA in case that’s changed and also with my parents in case they’re mistaken. Does this have any effect on HB?
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 2,217 Pioneering
    edited June 18
    How long has mum been getting CA?
    Have you seen any bank statements that show how much DLA dad is receiving now?
    The rate of care component makes no difference for HB.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • oldestdaughteroldestdaughter Member Posts: 11 Listener
    I’m not sure but if she were receiving CA, would that be sent directly to her bank account and not my dad’s? Because my mum doesn’t receive anything directly and may have been confused by the care component of the DLA. 
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 2,217 Pioneering
    If she had claimed CA she could choose which bank account to have it paid - presumably it is more likely that she would have chosen her own.

    If dad is definitely on low rate care, in respect of UC you will now need to do the calculation without including the carer element. She would be expected to look for work, although the work coach might agree to limit the requirements.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • oldestdaughteroldestdaughter Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Ok. I’ll make sure to check the DLA first. My dad definitely needs the help everyday now (eating, bathing, changing etc) so it might be best to have him reevaluated on PIP, but I’ll ask them what they want to do. In cases like this, if my mum doesn’t work while we wait for PIP, is that a problem?
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 2,217 Pioneering
    edited June 18
    .. In cases like this, if my mum doesn’t work while we wait for PIP, is that a problem?
    It would be down to the UC work coach.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • oldestdaughteroldestdaughter Member Posts: 11 Listener
    @calcotti I’ve discussed this with my parents and they would like my dad to be reassessed for DLA (which is now PIP, I think). Will his DLA stop while he’s being reassessed?

    In the meantime, only my dad wants to apply to UC. My mum doesn’t want to chance that she might have to work when he definitely needs full time care, so she’d rather wait. What will the effect be on both mum and dad if she doesn’t apply to UC now? Will this effect my dad's UC and housing benefit?
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 2,217 Pioneering
    edited June 23
    @calcotti I’ve discussed this with my parents and they would like my dad to be reassessed for DLA (which is now PIP, I think). Will his DLA stop while he’s being reassessed?
    DLA will continue until a PIP decision has been made.
    oldestdaughter said:.. only my dad wants to apply to UC. 
    That is not possible. UC is a means tested benefits and all means tested benefits take into account the circumstances of a couple. If they wish to claim UC they must both apply.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • oldestdaughteroldestdaughter Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Okay, then they’ll both just apply. I did a benefit calculator as well so they could get an idea of what they’d receive. It showed the DLA, SP, Council Tax Support and ESA (the last from UC). I presume the calculation is for both of them and the amount seems realistic. 

    It doesn’t show Housing Benefit but I presume that’s included in the UC. Is HB joint but written under one person? 
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 2,217 Pioneering
    edited June 23
    The help with rent is part of UC (the housing element). UC is calculated on joint circumstances and paid to one of them. If mum finds the conditions too onerous they can always cancel the claim. If they get an understanding work coach and she fully explains what she has to do by caring she may get a fairly light commitment pending a decision on thePIP claim (although unfortunately those are taking many months at the moment).

    Please take time to understand the PIP assessment process and be very thorough when helping him complete the health questionnaire.

    When claiming UC he will need a Fit Note from GP confirming he is too unwell to work (ignoring the fact that he is no longer working age).
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • oldestdaughteroldestdaughter Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Thanks. I’ve been helping them fill out the UC claim and they don’t ask much in the way of disability, except for the fit note. I’m requesting one from the doctor. He hasn’t worked since he first fell ill in 2006. Should the fit note start from then? And what’s the end date required? Is it possible to be indefinite?

    The UC application also doesn’t ask for much information regarding the other adults in the house or what benefits he already receives?When is this information required?
  • calcotticalcotti Member Posts: 2,217 Pioneering
    GP will not give you an indefinite Fit Note. Start date can be anything appropriate but wants to be not later than the start of the UC claim. Try and get at east three months on Fit Note, if GP will give a longer one so much the better.

    The UC application does ask about other adults in the house.

    When dad claims he reports mum is there and will be given a linking code. Mum then claims and uses the linking code to join her claim to his.

    On his claim if there are adult children in the house he will need to record these.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
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