NI class 1 credits when on PIP only

Philonline

Hi folks, Phil 59 years old on Standard rate PIP and no other benefits due to a small amount of savings left to my as inheritance from my late parents, on another posting about pensions I mentioned I had no class 1 credits for aprox 15 years due to the above reason, another poster Calcotti pointed me towards a web page from the DWP and mentioned that NI credits sre not means tested? well I had heard this before and tried to get them via the job centre route and sent packing quick smart basically telling me not a chance without a qualifying benefit, on reading what Calcotti pointed me towards I noticed some changes since the last time I tried so I thought I would try again but got a similar reaction via email, this is seems as clear as mud to me and I wondered if anybody else has been in this situation before and how they got on? Please see the att. cropped email and the valid page details from the DWP NI credit info.
I now have a fit note for restricted work and have registered and uploaded a CV to the Gov. job finder site.
Thanks in advance for any info.
Phil

calcotti

If you have a health condition that limits your ability to work you should be trying to get NI credits on the grounds of Limited Capability for Work rather than as a job seeker. The route to this is by making an application for new style ESA (as advised in the other thread https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/420623#Comment_420623)

The email is telling you that if you wish to claim NI credits as a Jobseeker the mechanism for doing so is to apply for new style JSA, which I agree doesn't accord with advice on gov.uk website but will probably work.

Philonline

I am not entitled to any other benefit including esa (only new style esa now credit based and I have no credits for 15 years) also over 16K in savings, I have tried via the job center registering for work with a limited capability for work and even have a fit note saying the same and the email is what I got back from them? so what am I doing wrong Calcotti?

calcotti

Philonline said:

I am not entitled to any other benefit including esa (only new style esa now credit based and I have no credits for 15 years) also over 16K in savings, I have tried via the job center registering for work with a limited capability for work and even have a fit note saying the same and the email is what I got back from them? so what am I doing wrong Calcotti?

You are missing the point.
You can get NI credits as a jobseeker - apparently by applying for new style JSA or on the grounds of having Limited Capability for Work by applying for new style ESA, as previously advised. In both cases you will not actually be paid anything but you will get the NI credits if you meet the entitlement conditions (excluding the NI contributions requirement).
What you need to do is make a claim. That's what the email says.

Philonline

Thats exactly what I tried a few days ago and it wont let continue as soon as I put my savings in it stops the online claim dead in the water and says you are not eligible? so how do I get past that?

Philonline

JSA, not eligible savings over 16K,  ESA, not eligible no credits, UC, not eligable savings over 16K, I am at a loss how to get around this if its at all possible?

Philonline

Philonline

Finally getting somewhere, this has nothing to do with the job center, JSA UC or ESA, if you are looking for NI credits and do not qualify for any benefits for any reason and have a limited capability to work do not try any benefits claims go to the benefits claim phone system 0800 328 5644 and fluff your answers so you get to speak to somebody and not told to go online and fill in online claims and then the call ends, ask the advisor for an NI claim form for people with limited capability to work, there is no mention anywhere online about these! I have just been told its only four pages where you can argue the fact that you should be entitled to NI credits (it is not guaranteed you will get them) you must be able to do some sort of work and be available for that work, I have already registered with the job center online job search and uploaded a CV which I was told was a good step forward, fingers crossed.

calcotti

Philonline said:

JSA, not eligible savings over 16K,  

That is incorrect. There are no savings limits for new style JSA, it's not means tested. You will however not be paid anything because you will fail the NI test.

Philonline said:

ESA, not eligible no credits, 

As repeatedly advised you can still put in a claim for new style ESA. When it is processed you will be told you are not eligible for payment because you fail the NI test. You will still be referred for a Work Capability Assessment and eligible for NI credits.

Philonline said:.. you must be able to do some sort of work and be available for that work, I have already registered with the job center online job search and uploaded a CV which I was told was a good step forward, fingers crossed.

But you need not do this if you wish to claim on the basis of Limited Capability for Work by making an application for new style ESA.

Philonline

So why do they ask about savings on the online claim form for new JSA? hence I held the phone this time to speak to somebody and they explained how to do it, and he did confirm with my savings and lack of credits I would not qualify for new JSA or UC and not having 2 years clear paid credits or three years fragmented credits I would not qualify for new ESA, you are missing one big step and that is getting into the job center to even be considered for claiming limited capabilities for work or getting to see the WCA team, there are no face to face appointments its all online and without a benefit claim to refer to you are booted off the system, I tried the same in 2015 in North Shields sitting in the job center and got nowhere, was registered as looking for work for a year and got no credits paid as I did not qualify, this will now be looked into once I fill out the correct form, if you can get me somebody from any job center to say yes you can claim jsa or esa with my savings I will bow down to you as every time I try I hit a brick wall, they might not call it means tested but I assure you it is as he even said it would even be based on your partners earnings! its all well and good you sitting there saying that is wrong but your not the one trying to sort this out, at least this time I have some hope with a form I have never heard of and I will post the form number once it arrives.
You cannot claim something with the online system if you do not qualify all of the sections and savings is there and stops any claim, dont take my word for it try it. 

Philonline

woodbine said:

Hi you are 59 and have 15 missing years, so my question is how many years cont. do you have? You may only need 35 to get the full unified SRP in 8 years time.
You can of course check how many years you have cont. and a SRP forecast.

That is being sorted, I was born disabled and have only been able to work part time for most of my life but over the latter part say the last 26 years I have had my own registered small business and had child benefit in my name up to a certain point but I left all the financials in my trusted ex's hands as she was a bookkeeper with her own money, earnings and bank accounts and it seems she has done more than pilfer a chunk of my inheritance she has also not been paying class 2 credits and sorting my pension out as she led me to believe, I have recently found out she has also pilfered a family members income tax payment but they let it go due to not wanting a massive family rift, wish I had known as I would have been more hands on with mine. I do know nothing has been credited or paid over the last 15 years but it could be worse hence I have to get it sorted now.

calcotti

Philonline said:

So why do they ask about savings on the online claim form for new JSA? 

I think it’s because if you put less than £16,000 you are encouraged to claim UC.

Philonline said:.. with my savings and lack of credits I would not qualify for new JSA or UC and not having 2 years clear paid credits or three years fragmented credits I would not qualify for new ESA, 

That is not in dispute, We know you will not qualify to receive payments of any of these benefits. All you are trying to navigate is access to NI credits.

Philonline said:.. if you can get me somebody from any job center to say yes you can claim jsa or esa with my savings I will bow down to you as every time I try I hit a brick wall, they might not call it means tested but I assure you it is as he even said it would even be based on your partners earnings! ..

New style JSA and ESA are not means tested. Partner’s earnings are completely irrelevant.

As you have a Fit Note my advice is still to make a claim for new style ESA
 https://www.gov.uk/employment-support-allowance/how-to-claim

I am out now, I am simply repeating myself and you don’t believe what I am saying.

Philonline

calcotti said:

Philonline said:

So why do they ask about savings on the online claim form for new JSA? 

I think it’s because if you put less than £16,000 you are encouraged to claim UC.

Philonline said:.. with my savings and lack of credits I would not qualify for new JSA or UC and not having 2 years clear paid credits or three years fragmented credits I would not qualify for new ESA, 

That is not in dispute, We know you will not qualify to receive payments of any of these benefits. All you are trying to navigate is access to NI credits.

Philonline said:.. if you can get me somebody from any job center to say yes you can claim jsa or esa with my savings I will bow down to you as every time I try I hit a brick wall, they might not call it means tested but I assure you it is as he even said it would even be based on your partners earnings! ..

New style JSA and ESA are not means tested. Partner’s earnings are completely irrelevant.

As you have a Fit Note my advice is still to make a claim for new style ESA
 https://www.gov.uk/employment-support-allowance/how-to-claim

I am out now, I am simply repeating myself and you don’t believe what I am saying.

Honestly Ive tried for new esa and I do not qualify, if I did I would bee over the moon and shouting from the rooftops lol you must have at least 2 years full credits or three years fragmented to even be allowed to claim, seriously.

calcotti

Philonline said: Honestly Ive tried for new esa and I do not qualify, if I did I would bee over the moon and shouting from the rooftops lol you must have at least 2 years full credits or three years fragmented to even be allowed to claim, seriously.

My last go. We know that you do not qualify for new style ESA. However making an application for New style ESA is the way you access the Work Capability Assessment in order to determine Limited Capability for Work.

Philonline

Ok Calcotti you are both right and wrong so you get a half bow lol, yes I have finally managed to get a claim in for ESA but it could only be done via a telephone call (a long long telephone call) they have said there could be a chance I get on credits only as I have the fit note but its not guaranteed, there would be no way of me doing it online without lying to get past the savings bit which would invalidate my claim which is all hocus pocus to me as I now have a claim in? JSA not a hope and as you will see on the top of the claim form for NI credits (DO NOT FILL THIS IN IF YOU ARE GETTING JSA) because to even claim JSA you must have the last 2 years credits paid or at least 3 years fragmented, no ifs or buts that is what you must have to even claim JSA no exceptions, for anybody interested it seems there is another way to get your NI class 1 credits without the ESA route get this form. And after being told it had nothing to do with the Job Center look whats on it! more misdirection, what a minefield. 

Philonline

I think it may be worth mentioning that for the ESA they wanted the FIT note and medical proof of my disabilities which was not a problem, for the NI Credit claim form they required dates and details of work done (part time, full time, voluntary or self employed) not a problem as I have records but one thing that has got a hmmm is the placements as a paid part time employee on a New Deal for the disabled placements, 4 placements in total with no credits paid? after being on that it was found that all my details apart from Name, NI number and a grant for a winter waterproof coat whilst on one of the placements, I do wonder if a huge mistake has been made somewhere down the line, please do not say that cant happen as that is what they said at Hexham Job Center before loging in and shaking their heads in disbelief, it happened but I luckily kept all the New Deal paperwork.

calcotti

The important thing Isco that you have got the ESA claim in but I don’t understand why you could not complete the ESA claim online. Using ESA online claim link and stating no NI contributions gets you to this page from where you can continue to make a new style ESA claim for credits only purposes
https://www.apply-new-style-employment-support-allowance.dwp.gov.uk/get-national-insurance-credits

Based on your answers, you may not be eligible for New Style ESA payments
If you’ve not made enough National Insurance contributions over the last 2 to 3 years, you may not be eligible to claim New Style ESA payments. But you may be able to get National Insurance credits (opens in new tab).

New Style ESA gives you Class 1 credits, which can help to fill gaps in your National Insurance record and may help you qualify for certain benefits, including New Style Jobseeker’s Allowance and the State Pension.

If you’re on a low income or out of work, you can check if you’re eligible for Universal Credit. This will give you a regular payment and Class 3 credits. They count towards your State Pension only.

What do you want to do?

Continue to apply for New Style ESA

I understand that I might not get a payment, but I may get Class 1 National Insurance credits.

Apply for Universal Credit

I understand that if I’m eligible for Universal Credit, it will give me Class 3 National Insurance credits.

calcotti

As regards people wishing to claim NI credits as a jobseeker the form you reproduced  is the one I would have expected JobCentre to give you when you enquired. It was them in their email to you that said you should apply for new style JSA.