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Rights to see Medical Reports

Wibbles

Do I have any rights to see exactly what my Medical Professonals write abour me in medical reports ?

Of course, I hope that this is not necessary

But - if I do fail to win what I honestly expect - I just need to know the reasons

because I have sent DWP a really supportive set of documents in my quest for PIP

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Comments

Wibbles

woodbine said:

If you have already applied for PIP I'm unsure what use your records would be now ? Doctors are rarely contacted by the DWP.

Really?
That's not what I understand from CAB
So how do they check that what I claimed on the form is true?

poppy123456

Wibbles said:

woodbine said:

If you have already applied for PIP I'm unsure what use your records would be now ? Doctors are rarely contacted by the DWP.

Really?
That's not what I understand from CAB
So how do they check that what I claimed on the form is true?

That's poor advice from CAB. I've claimed PIP since 2013 and had 3 reviews and no one has ever been contacted.

The onus is on you to prove you qualify, not their's. The only person that really knows exactly how your conditions affect you is yourself.

MarkM88

Wibbles said:
So how do they check that what I claimed on the form is true?

Your not claiming for a specific condition or illness so there is nothing to check in that respect.

Wibbles

MarkM88 said:

Wibbles said:
So how do they check that what I claimed on the form is true?

Your not claiming for a specific condition or illness so there is nothing to check in that respect.

I am claiming that I am virtually immobile (amongst other issues)
Which is true

MarkM88

Wibbles said:
I am claiming that I am virtually immobile (amongst other issues)
Which is true

Still nothing to check with the doctor though.

You are scored for each PIP descriptor and the ability to perform that descriptor.

It’s up to you to evidence why you can’t do that activity to an acceptable standard.

You need to give real world examples.

Your doctor does not see you go to the toilet, or take a bath, or cook, or manage money, etc.

Wibbles

MarkM88 said:

Wibbles said:
I am claiming that I am virtually immobile (amongst other issues)
Which is true

Still nothing to check with the doctor though.

You are scored for each PIP descriptor and the ability to perform that descriptor.

It’s up to you to evidence why you can’t do that activity to an acceptable standard.

You need to give real world examples.

Your doctor does not see you go to the toilet, or take a bath, or cook, or manage money, etc.

Which I did
But how does someone prove that, for example - they cannot walk more than a few steps
Or cannot hold their pee
Or cannot speak properly
Or cannot write

MarkM88

Wibbles said:
Which I did
But how does someone prove that, for example - they cannot walk more than a few steps
Or cannot hold their pee
Or cannot speak properly
Or cannot write

That’s where providing real world examples comes in , at least 2 detailed examples, per descriptor that applies to you.

These need to be detailed and clearly explain what happened the last time you attempted the activity, what happened and what the consequences were.

There is no real value to just saying “I can’t do that”.

Wibbles

MarkM88 said:

Wibbles said:
Which I did
But how does someone prove that, for example - they cannot walk more than a few steps
Or cannot hold their pee
Or cannot speak properly
Or cannot write

That’s where providing real world examples comes in , at least 2 detailed examples, per descriptor that applies to you.

These need to be detailed and clearly explain what happened the last time you attempted the activity, what happened and what the consequences were.

There is no real value to just saying “I can’t do that”.

Which I have done but its still my word against there's, - that I have the problems in the first place
I have also included heaps of past medical records and reports
But will they actually read them and take them into account in their decision

poppy123456

Sending "heaps" of medical evidence if it doesn't state exactly how your conditions affect you isn't helpful. Most medical evidence usually states the basics like diagnosis, medication etc etc and these aren't helpful.

The best person to tell them how your conditions affect you is yourself and i don't mean things like, i can't do X because of Y, this is an assertion not real world incidents.

Telling them "you can't walk properly" isn't enough, you need to tell them why you can't complete this activity and what exactly happened the last time you attempted it.

Wibbles

poppy123456 said:

Sending "heaps" of medical evidence if it doesn't state exactly how your conditions affect you isn't helpful. Most medical evidence usually states the basics like diagnosis, medication etc etc and these aren't helpful.
The best person to tell them how your conditions affect you is yourself and i don't mean things like, i can't do X because of Y, this is an assertion not real world incidents.
Telling them "you can't walk properly" isn't enough, you need to tell them why you can't complete this activity and what exactly happened the last time you attempted it.

Well I'm not going to have sent anyone else's medical records in

That's exactly what I did

poppy123456

I never said you should have sent someone else's medical records...

chiarieds

Hi @Wibbles - try to put aside any of your medical records/evidence. As has been said above, your diagnoses won't be in dispute. There's no way of 'proving' your difficulties, nor are they needed, other than giving your own individual account as to the difficulties you face; that's your evidence. So, if you have problems with your mobility for example, say how far you can walk 'reliably.' That means safely, in a timely manner (so does it take you longer than someone without your disability?); can you walk repeatedly (as often as it would be normal to expect?), & to an acceptable standard? If you're in pain/breathless after a certain distance, then mention this. Is there any consequence to trying/doing this activity?

Do give those all important couple of detailed descriptions as to how you where when you last attempted this, i.e. when did it happen, what exactly happened, why, did anyone else see this, & how did it leave you feeling afterwards, if this applies?

Sorry that Citizens Advice actually gave poor, incorrect advice. Please do take onboard the advice given by our members above instead.

Wibbles

chiarieds said:

Hi @Wibbles - try to put aside any of your medical records/evidence. As has been said above, your diagnoses won't be in dispute. There's no way of 'proving' your difficulties, nor are they needed, other than giving your own individual account as to the difficulties you face; that's your evidence. So, if you have problems with your mobility for example, say how far you can walk 'reliably.' That means safely, in a timely manner (so does it take you longer than someone without your disability?); can you walk repeatedly (as often as it would be normal to expect?), & to an acceptable standard? If you're in pain/breathless after a certain distance, then mention this. Is there any consequence to trying/doing this activity?
Do give those all important couple of detailed descriptions as to how you where when you last attempted this, i.e. when did it happen, what exactly happened, why, did anyone else see this, & how did it leave you feeling afterwards, if this applies?
Sorry that Citizens Advice actually gave poor, incorrect advice. Please do take onboard the advice given by our members above instead.

I did do all of that in my 24 page submission

Wibbles

And you appear to be saying that DWP believe everything you that a claimant says..?
I gave real world examples of my problems including wettiing myself on a particular occasion and a historical accident when I almost died through blood loss

poppy123456

It will depend what real world examples you gave. A lot of people confuse assertions with real world incidents and an assertion isn't evidence.

When i had my PIP review last year the only medical evidence i sent was a repeat prescription list and a OT letter saying the aids that were given to me to help in my home. The rest was real world incidents. I had a paper based assessment, with a decision in about 6 weeks.

Wibbles

I am just summising but hopefully there will be no problems in my application?

Sorry but I fail to understand how DWP can ignore medical reports written, for example by a senior physio - or a Neurologist - but accept a personally written report from myself - stating that I am unable to walk due to hyperextended knee joints and spinal scolioscis - which I cant personally prove - but my medical evidence is there on paper

Mobility - I stated that I am vitually immobile - what more can I say ?

I try to walk - I get incredible pain in my knees (and back) - I fall to the floor and crawl on my hands and knees back to my chair, where I try to recover until the next time that I need the toilet

Similar with bladder control - I often don't quite make it to the toilet

I, too, have included a letter from OT giving details of equipment provided, such as railings and grab handles, aids - fitted in my home to help me to get around - I hope that they take this into account in my application ?

This is the reason that I have requested a home assessment, should they want to assess me - to allow them to see the equipment at first hand.

poppy123456

I think we are going round in circles here. No one is saying those reports are ignored. What we are saying is a GP/Consultant or anyone else doesn't spend any time with you to know exactly how those conditions affect you. PIP is not awarded based on any diagnosis, which is why your detailed real world incidents are what should be conctrated on.

Wibbles said:

but accept a personally written report from myself - stating that I am unable to walk due to hyperextended knee joints and spinal scolioscis

To just tell them this isn't helpful. You need to tell them why you can't do those activities as previously explained.

Wibbles

How is this - which I provided for them on A4

Q14) “Moving around” – being limited to less than a few metres of self-mobility – I struggle to raise myself from an armchair and always end up crawling on the floor on my hands and knees due to pain in my knees and back – I certainly cannot do this action more than once because I am absolutely exhausted when I do this and then crawl to the hallway and upstairs to the toilet on my hands and knees – I do not use a walking stick or walking frame due to poor coordination (I have tried both and they don’t work for me) . I have to stop every few metres to get through the pain barrier when trying to walk. – I had a partial knee replacement at ***** Hospital in 2016. This helped for a while, but the tendons / ligaments had stretched too far and my pain has returned due to hyperextension. I have been told that I am still too young to be considered for a full knee replacement, because it may not even help and there’s no going back from a full knee replacement.

I use a wheelchair for any distance of more than a few metres, and anywhere out of the house, but lack the ability to self-propel the chair - so have to be pushed. Without assistance – I would be immobile.

I also have a mobility scooter – but the battery no longer holds a charge – so I can’t use it

I have an electrically adjustable bed (self-purchased) to help me to get in to a comfortable position to sleep and to try to reduce my on-going back pain – also when I raise the foot end, it helps to reduce swollen legs and cramp – leading to DVT, something that I have experienced in 1992 (see included medical report.)

I have a bed rail to help me to safely get in to bed and move across the bed – supplied by the ****** hospital, ******* OT team in 2020.

I have grab rails fitted all over the 1st floor of my house and a second banister on the staircase – all fitted by the ******** hospital, ******** OT team in 2020.

I have grab rails fitted to the wall by the toilet – fitted by the ********* hospital, ****** OT team in 2020 – to help me to get on to and off the toilet,

“Pre-Covid” (until 2020) - I regularly attended a Chiropractor clinic where I had physiotherapy acupuncture and manipulation. This had a temporary effect on the pain, but it always reverted within a few weeks.

I constantly have falls and, in the 2011, have dislocated a finger, that necessitated a trip to Accident and Emergency at the hospital for it to be pulled back in to place (see included medical report) – My body is covered with bruises from falls – my shoulders are currently suffering with Rotator Cuff Syndrome – caused by regularly falling on my hands – I have had physiotherapy for this – with no improvement.

My knees are currently also suffering from Bursitis – from my crawling across the floor on my hands and knees due to my walking ability being so poor.

I do not have a suitable leg brace – I have a brace that was provided by NHS, 7 years ago and no longer fits my leg and even when it did – it caused bleeding through rubbing on my thighs and calves. Even at the time I could only wear it for emergencies and for a few minutes at a time.

I am currently waiting on an appointment with orthotics to provide a more suitable (KAFO) brace for my left leg – the problem being that in the meantime, my right knee is also failing due to arthritis.

When I try to walk – it feels as if my knees are going to collapse/give way – and I often fall on to my hands and knees. Getting up from the living room floor after falling is not easy and takes me 5 minutes or more to get back to my armchair. I cannot use walking sticks, frame or crutches due to poor coordination and weak arm muscles – I could not support my weight on my arms alone – caused by rotator cuff syndrome.

It takes me 5 minutes of considerable pain, to try to walk 10 metres, I freeze and need prompting from my wife to resume. I definitely cannot carry this out repeatedly, reliably or safely so I would class myself as immobile.

I have not been shopping on my own for 10 years due to my inability to walk not only around the shop but even to the shop entrance - I always rely on a wheelchair, pushed by my wife.

I have had a blue badge for parking for the last 10 years.

I could not walk 20 metres even with the help of someone else.

From The Senior Physiotherapist at ******* Hospital, who has known me for several years and supports my application for high-rate mobility PIP.

“I have known ****** for several years in my professional capacity. Over the last few years. I have noted a severe deterioration in *******'s ability to walk due to his knees.

He is currently unable to walk more than a few metres and is in severe pain throughout. He currently uses a wheelchair for most of his mobility needs and has to crawl upstairs, as it is not safe for him to walk.

His situation with his knees is complex and I do not foresee any surgical or conservative management that is likely to change the situation for him. We have had discussions in a complex case clinic regarding management of his knees and it was decided at that point that surgery is not likely to offer a good long-term solution to this problem.”

I do not have good days and bad days – every day is the same for my condition.

poppy123456

A lot of what you said there isn't relevant to the moving around part of mobility. What is considered is outside on a flat surface.

Wibbles

I simply followed the advice given to me by CA and what that, that I read on B&W website