New Green Paper Discussion - now includes accessible formats and consultation event sign up links!

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  • Catherine21
    Catherine21 Posts: 5,293 Championing

    OOh wow be interested to hear what you done sounds amazing

  • jul1aorways
    jul1aorways Online Community Member Posts: 161 Empowering
    edited 3:21PM

    Ask your MP to back Diane Abbot's call for Welfare Not Warfare.

    It only takes 30 seconds - lobby your MP here and spread the word today!

  • jul1aorways
    jul1aorways Online Community Member Posts: 161 Empowering
    20250422_163422.jpg

    ⚠️ Government Phishing Alert!! ⚠️

    If you see this on Facebook or anywhere else for that matter, don't fill it in!

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Online Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 3,757 Championing
    edited 3:54PM

    onebigvoice Scope Member Posts: 897 Pioneering11:25AM

    Been there, done that, thats why I keep copies of everything, including Court results

    I have too. It's how I've traced the erosion of my awards. Now in my 18th year of this. I won't feel secure until I can claim my state pension, if I last that long 😆

  • YogiBear
    YogiBear Online Community Member Posts: 163 Empowering

    On the Benefits & Work Site today under 'News'

    No legal ‘silver bullet’ to stop PIP proposals

    Benefits and Work and Inclusion London have obtained counsel’s advice on possible challenges to the Pathways To Work Green Paper proposals. 

    The advice suggests that at this stage there appears to be no clear or obvious route for challenge or ‘silver bullet’ regarding the ‘flagship’ elements of the policy.  Instead, individuals and organisations should focus efforts on challenging elements of the Green Paper politically as much as possible.

    Benefits and Work and Inclusion London asked solicitors Leigh Day to obtain advice from counsel about the potential legal challenges to the March 2025 welfare reform proposals.  Leigh Day appointed barrister Tom Royston of Garden Court North Chambers to undertake the work.

    Both Leigh Day and Tom Royston have a great deal of experience in social security law and we are grateful to them for the very detailed advice they have provided.

    The advice addressed the following proposals in the Green Paper:

    (I) ‘Focussing PIP more on those with higher needs’: the proposal to require at least one 4 point descriptor to be met to qualify for PIP;

    (II) ‘Scrap the WCA’: the proposal to amend the process by which ill and disabled people can claim income replacement benefit, and the amount of money they receive;

    (III) ‘New unemployment insurance’: the proposal to amalgamate contributory ESA and JSA into a single time limited contributory benefit;

    (IV) ‘Delaying access to the UC health element until age 22’: not paying 18-21 PIP recipients any extra means tested element in UC.

    Looking in summary at the above proposals, counsel told us that substantial challenges to central aspects of the envisaged legislation would ‘be likely to fall at various places along a spectrum from ‘hopeless’ to ‘challenging’.”

    In other words, given the information currently available, the chances of preventing the proposals being made law or overturning them subsequently appear to be limited.

    In relation specifically to PIP, a range of issues were considered, including - but not limited to -the decision not to consult on this measure, challenges under the Human Rights Act 1998 and challenges under the Equality Act 2010.  But the probability of any challenge succeeding in relation to the PIP 4-point rule specifically was considered to be low and heavily dependent on circumstances.

    Counsel did stress, however, that there may well be successful legal challenges in the future to elements of the above proposals, but these are likely to be to “contingent aspects of the proposals which emerge along the way, rather than to the elementary principles which were clear at the start.”

    In other words, if the laws are enacted, then the courts may have a major role to play in examining the way they are interpreted and implemented but not in upsetting the basic foundations, such as the PIP 4-point rule. Benefits and Work will aim to support any such challenges in any way it can.

    We are not able to publish the advice at present and we should add that it applies only to the four issues listed.  The Green Paper contains many more proposals that were not covered.

    In addition, we did not ask for advice on whether the current Green Paper consultation is lawful, because our initial enquiries are primarily about proposals which are not being consulted on.

    We know that this news will be greeted with considerable dismay by many readers, who had hoped that the courts could prevent such clearly cruel and discriminatory proposals coming into force.

    Sadly, there seems unlikely to be ‘silver bullet’ or straightforward legal answer.

    Instead, by far the best hope of preventing these cuts is to persuade MPs to pledge to vote against them, as evidence grows that the Labour Party is struggling to contain a rebellion.

    As one Labour MP, Neil Duncan-Jordan, who won his seat with a majority of just 18 votes but who has 5,000 constituents receiving PIP, told the Guardian  “The whole policy is wrong. It goes without saying that if these benefits cuts go through, I will be toast in this seat.”

    More facts about the effects of the cuts are being uncovered with each passing week. 

    Making MPs, especially those with slim majorities, aware of how dramatically the cuts will affect claimant’s lives provides the best hope that they will never come to pass.

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Online Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 3,757 Championing
    edited 4:19PM

    Leigh Day has somehow never quite got to the bottom of the 'welfare fiasco' whilst making a fortune from our misery. Nice work if you can get it!

    I keep seeing focusing and focused misspelt. Detail matters and we should not rely on LD to change much for us. They haven't so far.

    Welfare reform has been allowed to run and kept running with errors in text and interpretation.

  • YogiBear
    YogiBear Online Community Member Posts: 163 Empowering

    I copied this from the Benefits and Work site today. It's not looking promising from their assessment of things.😨

  • Catherine21
    Catherine21 Posts: 5,293 Championing
  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Online Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 3,757 Championing

    Oh, wasn't criticising you! This appears in Government reports.

  • alexroda
    alexroda Online Community Member Posts: 159 Empowering

    From previous experience, I don’t think Leigh Days’s view on these issues is relevant or accurate.

    Benefits and Work pensions is not an accurate website either, sometimes scaremongering too. My opinion.

    My hopes would be with DPAC and any other organisations that aren’t “related” with politics/government in any way if the legal process is to be followed.

  • Catherine21
    Catherine21 Posts: 5,293 Championing

    Have public law project and Disability Rights and others so just wait and see

  • Catherine21
    Catherine21 Posts: 5,293 Championing

    I agree still have disability uk public law project and some claimants taken them on as well

  • Martinp
    Martinp Online Community Member Posts: 116 Empowering

    I’m going to try and just live for today otherwise I will lose it big time. Please everyone stay strong

  • charlie72
    charlie72 Online Community Member Posts: 151 Empowering

    Our last little bit of hope seems to have been quashed too, no legal grounds to oppose these reforms, how on earth can that be right? I'm no lawyer but how inhumane does a policy have to be before it breaks human rights. I think charities and other groups have resigned themselves that these cuts will go through behind the scenes. The government won't back down, emailing mp's is useless, mine never replies, it's all negative each day, not even a glimmer of hope on any one day. Sorry to sound so defeatist, but I honestly can't see a way out of this unless the green paper gets watered down, which looking how things are going is not looking promising.

    Maybe other people on here think different, I don't know how reliable the benefits and work website is, but it makes for worrying reading if true.

  • Catherine21
    Catherine21 Posts: 5,293 Championing

    Me too body can't handle months of this day by day only way

  • Catherine21
    Catherine21 Posts: 5,293 Championing

    You think 1.2 million people going to sit back and accept this no way still have two other lawyers helping and some claimants it does help emailing I've had a few responses don't get disheartened I Google any challenges against 4 point pip rule hava look

  • YogiBear
    YogiBear Online Community Member Posts: 163 Empowering

    I was just posting what they're saying. I think we're going to need all the help we can get. I'm just hoping some of these proposals will be shelved or watered down.

  • YogiBear
    YogiBear Online Community Member Posts: 163 Empowering

    Anything I read now online I will ask myself 'Is it Fact or Opinion'?

  • onebigvoice
    onebigvoice Scope Member Posts: 899 Pioneering

    Have been contacted by the court for tomorrow, Seems they read my generic letter to all concerned who were or have tried to be involved in my case. (on the DWP and PIP side) it seems they want to discuss the case in greater detail? SORRY guys that was what you should have done the first time round.

    I have informed the court that the DWP were to produce documents that I had asked for in 2008 and ever since (The amendment numbers to my PDF files and the judges directional notices? sinc ethen they keep giving me a history lesson, less the information they removed/altered.

    This case will go ahead whether the DWSP and Secretary of State turns up or not.

    Because they have attached my daughters file to mine, she was to have come with me, but I am not putting pressure on her to appear, especially since she only had the second brain operation 3 weeks ago.

    I am her appointee and take that very serious. along with others that I have had to become an appointee for because the assessment of the claimant must be someone else.

    I would like to see ALL assessments done by these experts placed onto my medical history as they could explain what is missing from every report.

    Need to have 40 winks to recharge ready for tomorrow.

    I would like to thank every one who has joined in the discussion and would also like to say what can be done when we join a common cause.

    If you don't like the cuts to any benefit or you are about to be assessed, contact your local MP and send your Email stating like the one already produced here, that we will not take any more, unless you show the the changes with supporting evidence, and you show your support for the review of the latest Budget that supports us, and don't state how you will vote, you do not have my support.

    Will up date what is going on late tomorrow as I have a meeting in Cardiff to discuss these and other issues I have raised as an independent.

    My voice is one voice, but in the right place and in the right ears, it will spread to get us all a living wage from an assessment that is required to get benefits but by people who do what it says on the box.

  • onebigvoice
    onebigvoice Scope Member Posts: 899 Pioneering

    If it makes no difference, then E mail him/her, and keep emailing as one thing a parliamentary MP cannot do is NOT REPLY. they hate work or having to do something (not all are like this mind) and spend most of their time defying the labour party, instead of putting forward reasonable reasons as to not want to do what they are supposed to do under the manifestos they are given.