The Universal Credit Bill becomes law. Here are the changes to disability benefits you need to know
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Let's not start with rumours please @Catherine21 it's best to stick to facts as we don't want people getting more worried than they have to be. 😉
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Yeah it's not speculation though is it. It's as speculative as the 4 point PIP rule, but you do you.
There's lots of shifting of goalposts going on here and revision of points without acknowledging the revision so genuine engagement doesn't seem to be the aim on here so I'm out of this thread.
I'm over on X with the same handle if anyone else is interested in genuine & realistic engagement on this topic.1 -
It's this misuse of the word speculation that I have a problem with. You're undermining opposition to the White Paper now with the misuse of that word.
Speculation is defined as: taking to be true on the basis of insufficient evidence
There is sufficient evidence that DL PIP will be used as the gateway for the 'Health Element' as per the paragraph in the Green Paper I provided above. There is also sufficient evidence that this will result in at least 23% of 'Health Element' claimants becoming ineligile.
I'm adding this final statement because you're continuing to mislead people by using the word "speculate" incorrectly which has the effect of undermining efforts to oppose the White Paper now.
You communicate with such authority on here yet hadn't even read paragraph *37* of the Green Paper. That tells me everything I need to know about your ability to accurately gauge the situation for the 'Health Element'.1 -
Important additional point:
The PIP 4 point rule was going to be introduced prior to the planned PIP review so if you vocalised your protest of that rule then you were doing so based on "speculation" (applying your use of this word).
The PIP review, which was due to be undertaken AFTER the planned 4 point rule implementation (before it was dropped from the bill), may have changed eligibility criteria so if you protested against that policy then you are now a hypocrite for saying we should wait to know eligibility details for the 'Health Element'. It's exactly the same situation.
The Timms PIP review is due to conclude in August 2026 so we can only base failure rate figures on current criteria in exactly the same way people protesting the 4 point PIP rule did.
The Timms PIP review may result in eligibility changing but, by your method, that means we can't even protest the White Paper because that isn't going to tell us what the DL PIP eligibility criteria will be following the PIP review.1 -
Paragraph 37 *literally* states that the Work Capability Assessment will be scrapped in the first line of that paragraph and that access to UC Health will be via qualification of DL PIP. It *literally* states that this will be implemented via Primary Legislation.
Your revisionism of the facts is so easily disproven! Good grief. You really are so intent on believing your own fantasy version.1 -
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I said that if you protested the 4 point PIP rule based on the Green Paper before the UC & PIP Bill was published (so between March and June) that would make you a hypocrite.
You've said you did raise concerns about the Green Paper with your MP so you did vocalise your opposition based on what you would call "speculation" (the Green Paper).
You've then contradicted yourself again by saying "the current descriptors remain the basis for scrutiny" but then in previous posts you've said that the FOI isn't useful for protesting because it's a snapshot of the eligibility criteria now.
Your apparent need to be right is blinding you to the actual evidence and reality of the situation and causing you to make multiple contradictions and illogical statements.1 -
I've already provided my reasons for not waiting for the publication of the White Paper so your suggestion is something I cannot inherently get behind. You have the option of not engaging with this thread if you find it jarring.
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I agree.
Things are bad enough for us without people arguing and point scoring.
Personally I am waiting for an official announcement to be made and hopefully that will happen soon.
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You are so badly wrong. The WCA scrappage was NOT in the UC Bill and has NOT been passed via Primary Legislation yet
This is the UC Bill which does not contain any reference to the WCA being scrapped:
https://bills.parliament.uk/publications/62123/documents/6889The Big Issue today have published an article precisely on the upcoming scrappage of the Work Capability Assessment to be included in the autumn White Paper which has NOT been voted on by Parliament yet:
https://www.bigissue.com/news/social-justice/benefit-cuts-disabled-people-work-capability-assessment/
You are gravely misleading people on here.
There is still an opportunity to ensure the WCA scrappage doesn't go ahead.
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jw68, miscreants is the right word for them.
I'm 100% persuaded that nothing has changed since I claimed Incapacity Benefits in 2006. DWP has knowingly put me at risk of harm and homelessness by denying my rightful entitlement ever since! I've told them I'm just waiting to retire so they'll leave me alone. They have no intention of leaving me alone just yet though 😔
I have identified what I believe is the root of the scam which is a 'Correction Slip' inserted into the ESA regs by IDS in June 2011 which was carried into the 2012 Welfare Reform Act unscrutinised and unchallenged.
It didn't correct anything; it corrupted the ESA regs. It was a corruption slip. I've tried and tried to explain it on this forum but members still believe it was so long ago that it no longer matters. It does.
In 2015, IDS suddenly spotted "a fundamental flaw in the regulations", new cuts were agreed and ESA was further corrupted by the removal of reg 29 -(2)(b) - exceptional circumstances - from the WCA process. That was the Welfare Reform and Work Act 2016.
Reg 35 -(2)(a)b) under Part 6 of the ESA regulations is the equivalent of reg 29 -(2)b) under Part 5.
In 2008, there was a Work-Related Activity Assessment (WRAAt) (Part 6) and a Work Capability Assessment (WCA) (Part 5) to determine eligibility for an award - in that order.
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Hi and welcome to Scope! You shouldn't have to fight to be heard on here!!
I want to understand and members need to understand these changes to WORKING-AGE BENEFITS.
Please start a new thread, perhaps with Scope's help - this is the only platform I use - we need information and facts, urgently.
TYVM for all you've done and are doing 🤝
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Albus, please can we have two separate threads so the rest of us can move on from discussing PIP?
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If people wish to create a new discussion about PIP, then that's totally fine @WhatThe but for now I will ask nicely that people keep this particular topic related to universal credit.
Your cooperation is appreciated.0 -
My first post was in drafts, written ages ago..
All the attention paid to PIP (and little else) was exactly what happened 10 years ago, too. It was never meant to continue past State Pension age. Another failure.
We need to catch up with UC - 13 years of it - and changes to working-age benefits.
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Evening all looking at some posts in here makes me wonder if these people are just scaremongering and making the real chronic ill people frightened even more after reading these posts. Let’s wait and see what the this government is planed for the real disabled person I always go by if you are genuinely ill to work and have a severe life long condition that’s has no cure and will progressively get worse and has medically been verified by a leading nhs consultant than you have nothing to worry about. I suffer from muscular dystrophy and it’s progressive and will not get better and I have a full time job already which is dealing with my disease so NO I don’t worry about what governments try to bring it. What makes me mad is to see people playing the system and taking money fraudulent from any government. Rand over my hands are tired to keep posting on site every 5 or 10 minute take care thank you for reading my post
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Nope.
See below screenshot from Work and Pensions Committee Report published on 29th July 2025, 7 days after the UC bill passed the House of Lords.
https://committees.parliament.uk/publications/49050/documents/257767/default/
Clearly states that the Government *will* (future tense) legislate to remove the WCA. This is going to be done via Primary Legislation not Secondary Legislation as you are stating. That is clearly indicated in paragraph 37 of the Green Paper: "we will implement this change via primary legislation" (screenshot provided again below).
https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/pathways-to-work-reforming-benefits-and-support-to-get-britain-working-green-paper/pathways-to-work-reforming-benefits-and-support-to-get-britain-working-green-paper
The UC Bill does not scrap LCWRA at all, it is a bill that indicates how the rates will change over certain years depending on which claimant group someone falls into. LCWRA & IR ESA are both very much labelled in that bill. The rate for new LCWRA after Apr 2026 is only indicated for 2026-2027 to leave it open to the changes the Government want to push through Parliament via FURTHER Primary Legislation following this autumn's White Paper, so it is NOT set in stone and this does not somehow confirm that the WCA has already been scrapped or that Secondary Legislation has already been completed.
I notice how I'm the only one of us backing up their points with ACTUAL EVIDENCE (screenshots, links) whilst you're just saying stuff.
You are misleading people and making them think their fate has already been sealed in terms of the WCA. You're the one scaremongering on this thread not me. I'm trying to let people know it's not a done deal yet.
I've also provided a link to The Big Issue article published a few days ago, in one of my replies above, which also backs up what I'm saying. The DWP were given a right of reply to that article and therefore if anything was inaccurate in that article it wouldn't have been published.
I'm not posting on here anymore because you are intent on proving yourself as correct even when you're not.
Anybody reading this please judge this based on the evidence provided, not just what someone says. I can be found over on X with the same handle if anyone wants to properly join the opposition to the White Paper. I refuse to keep draining my already severely depleted energy on someone who is not engaging in good faith.4 -
Adjunct to the above to further back up what I'm saying: the screenshot below is from the UC bill showing the clause that will be added to current legislation for new LCWRA claimants after April 2026. It is a clause about the RATE ONLY. It does not remove the LCWRA category from legislation, it does not confirm the WCA has been scrapped.
The poster I'm responding to has failed to provide any evidence to back up what they're saying, because there isn't any.
See you on X if you're able to join in over there. There are some good people fighting for the 'Health Element' (LCW/LCWRA/ESA). This forum isn't all there is.https://bills.parliament.uk/publications/62123/documents/6889
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Jesus , I've had a nice break from scope , I've been on here for 2 mins and I'm already anxious and nervous ..... What's going on with this arguing , were all in this together aren't we ? .... The wca , if scrapped isn't happening till earliest end of 2028 and apparently that's for new claims first , you could be looking at 2030 before anything happens , slot can change by then z we will also have a new government aswell , I can't be worrying for that long , wait to see the official information
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Absolutely 😊👍 these changes will be anything but delivered on time , not to mention when they are finally ready to be rolled out it will be a gradual process , with almost certainty of it being new claims first , i mean these are big reforms and a massive undertaking , very worst ways for people ( including people in my situation ) of being on CBESA and LCWRA but no pip , your looking at the end of 2028 / 2029.... And even then there talking about transitional protection for existing claiments , not to mention a election year coinciding with all of this 😂🤦.... I've definitely learnt not to get sucked in as much by every single media article and YouTube content you see as the gossip and false information it all creates is quite dangerous....when we know what's actually happening we can go from there .... It doesn't matter how much people think they know because quite frankly it's all based on panicked guess work and trying to fill in the blanks to things you can't possibly know , debilitating not to know absolutely but definitely doesn't help to just try and put 2 and 2 together , does even less good to be arguing about it
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