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PIP assessment next week, any advice

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  • Yadnad
    Yadnad Posts: 2,856 Disability Gamechanger
    AnnieJB said:
    Okay, this discussion is closed. How dare you. The assessor lied. 
    That is something that you will most unlikely be able to prove.
    I am only explaining to you how the other side would think, react etc.

    Besides which the assessors report is not a factual statement but only an opinion. Much the same as you and I could have an opinion.

    You are in my opinion placing far too much importance on an assessors report.

    I'll give you an example. 
    All three of mine for PIP were of such quality and accuracy that you would honestly believe that they related to someone else. 
    They disregarded psychiatric evidence which went into enough detail so as to explain the what's and why's I had difficulties and aligning it with the various descriptors. Additionally they disregarded the fact that I get another benefit for mental health issues and had a recent assessment by a doctor who stated that I have lost 40% of my normal mental abilities - they stated that their mental health examination showed that I did not have a mental health problem.

    They disregarded a report from the spinal unit at hospital that the damage was so severe that walking tests carried out showed that I could only manage approx. 10 metres without falling down - they assessed my walking ability as to be able to walk over 200 metres without difficulty.

    Finally they disregarded a 3 page GP report explaining why social services had to install equipment in my home so as to get in and out of the bath, go to the toilet and clean myself afterwards and get in and out of bed/dress/undress - they assessed that I had no need for any of that equipment, could dress/wash/go to the toilet independently.

    Those were their opinions which I ignored and presented the case for a MR pointing out my evidence. The DWP agreed twice and offered to increase the award from 0 points to Enhanced Mobility & Care. There was no need to complain about the assessment.
  • brighid
    brighid Community member Posts: 23 Connected
    Come on guys, I thought we were hear to support each other. Lies or factual inaccuracies, what is the difference? Bickering about semantics really isn't helping.
  • brighid
    brighid Community member Posts: 23 Connected
    BTW, I read the assessor guidance and it does say that how well kempt a person is, is a factor to consider. Thought that was worth sharing x
  • brighid
    brighid Community member Posts: 23 Connected
    So assessment went OK. The assessor was very professional and allowed me to speak. Partner prompted me when I forgot or to add examples. Don't think I would have done or said anything different with hindsight so just have to see what happens next. I declined the physical exam because I had been sat for well over and hour and was in a lot of pain. So hope that won't go against me. He did say that he would write that I didn't feel able to undertake it. 
  • Yadnad
    Yadnad Posts: 2,856 Disability Gamechanger
    brighid said:
    Come on guys, I thought we were hear to support each other. Lies or factual inaccuracies, what is the difference? Bickering about semantics really isn't helping.
    One is intentional and the other is probably an error.
    There is a lot of difference. You cannot call anybody a liar unless you can back up your statement. with evidence.
  • brighid
    brighid Community member Posts: 23 Connected
    Indeed but the outcome is the same, a misrepresentation of the issue likely to impact negatively on us directly. How or why that happens is not worth bickering over, semantics as I said. Getting into arguments like this is not supportive in the least and does nothing to help. Gross incompetence or outright lies, neither are excusable and both are destructive and distressing in equal measure.
  • brighid
    brighid Community member Posts: 23 Connected
    Quick question, I took some additional evidence and the assessor said it was unnecessary and didn’t copy it to send with the assessment. Can I send this directly to DWP? Or should I just wait and see wait happens and use it if I need to ask for a MR? It was an OH report from work, some copies of notes from GP with diagnosis, a list of my symptoms and their impact and a list of aids that I use...?
  • Yadnad
    Yadnad Posts: 2,856 Disability Gamechanger
    edited August 2018
    . Putting aside the thorny issue of whether the evidence should go in when you have an assessment there is a general principle that withholding evidence is not a good idea regardless of the stage you’re at. It won’t play well further down the line just like calling a HCP a liar is undermining your own case. If you have it it needs to go in to DWP now.
    I do entirely agree with you, but on the other hand I can fully understand why people would hold evidence back.
    The first would be because the claimant is of the opinion that no matter what is sent in to the DWP no one is likely to take much notice of it. The belief is that most people only trust that they will get a fair hearing at a Tribunal and therefore that is the place to present it all.

    Secondly some claimants watch far too much TV especially those programmes that relate to the police and court. They believe that by dropping a bombshell of evidence in the lap of the CPS will give them the best chance of justice in that no one will have had the time to discredit that evidence. They simply don't believe that the police or even their own legal team will use it properly if they let the cat out of the bag too soon. There is some evidence of a sort in this as seen in the media over the past months when cases have been thrown out due to non disclosure.

    I think the problem is the lack of trust that exists between the claimant, DWP and the assessing company.

    Do I trust the assessing company to be fair and honest in their reporting, No not at all. Do I have faith and trust in the DWP in their decision making, No not at all.

    So in a way I am saying that it is highly likely that where those two bodies are involved there is no real point in expecting anything that looks like fairness or even justice.
  • Yadnad
    Yadnad Posts: 2,856 Disability Gamechanger
    edited August 2018
    I should perhaps have emphasised that the principle of immediate disclosure is a legal principle rather than just a good idea. 
    It certainly is. Maybe I shouldn't treat criminal and civil courts as the same, but from my years of working, investigating and preparing cases for prosecution (both civil & criminal) for the government and before I became mentally too ill to continue it was always an absolute requirement that 'full and complete disclosure' was to be made at the earliest possible occasion.

    Mind you I do laugh at the Perry Mason type programmes where the private investigator rolls into the court room with some last minute evidence whereupon reading it the Judge declares the guy innocent!
  • brighid
    brighid Community member Posts: 23 Connected
    Hi, thanks for your info, I wasn't in disagreement with anyone in particular but there seemed to be a some unnecessary falling out further up the thread about people's individual views. That is what I was referring to and now those people have disappeared from the thread, I guess no longer feeling able to get involved in this discussion because they feel undermined again, after a horrible experience. Just a bit of insight into the impact. Now saying that you shouldn't describe the assessor as a liar in your appeal process is wholly appropriate, but us saying that they weren't lying at all, just makes the person that experienced that feel dismissed out of hand. That's the point was trying to make. I'm now even more confused about the evidence though. I wouldn't say I have withheld any evidence. There's nothing that says anything I haven't already said and as you say even the OH report only repeats what I described, though why I would describe myself out of a job unnecessarily seems crazy. The list of symptoms is my own list that just described in more detail how they impact me. I didn't necessarily mention every symptom in every descriptor on the form just my main symptoms. And used words like disoriented, but disoriented includes, blurred/double vision, the room spinning, noises in my head, staggering and falling, unable to hear... that isn't necessarily that clear just from saying disoriented! or am I just being obsessive...
  • Matilda
    Matilda Community member Posts: 2,593 Disability Gamechanger
    In my MR and appeal I didn't specifically use the word 'liar' but I appointed out that the Atos paramedic had put in her report that she watched me take my bag off over my head, put it down on the floor and pick it up again letter.  In fact, as I stated in MR and appeal submission, at no time, not even during the exercises, did I take my bag off.

    Tribunal must have believed me as they allowed my appeal.
  • brighid
    brighid Community member Posts: 23 Connected
    Think I will wait for the award letter and see what it says, if I need to be more explicit I’ll tackle it then. 
    Got a text today from DWP to say they’ve received the report and should hear from them within 4 weeks, was surprised it was so quick!

Brightness

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