PIP, DLA and AA
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Hi, my name is Jacklmagill05!

Jacklmagill05Jacklmagill05 Member Posts: 5 Listener
edited September 2020 in PIP, DLA and AA
Hi everyone. I'll jump straight in with a question if I may. Has anyone been refused the enhanced rate mobility component of PIP because they are over 65 years of age?
I am trying to assess how many claimants are affected by this rule with a view to organising a petition for a Judicial Review of this clearly Ageist rule.
I'd love to hear from you all.
Lots of love, 
Jacklmagill05

Replies

  • Cher_ScopeCher_Scope Scope community team Posts: 3,156 Disability Gamechanger
    edited September 2020
    Hello and welcome to your online community @Jacklmagill05

    I've moved your post over to our PIP, DLA and AA discussion board so its in a better spot to get attention.  I hope we can give you some support on this matter  :)
    Online Community Co-ordinator

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  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    edited September 2020
    HI and welcome,

    Just so that you're aware, it's not 65 year of age because of the state pension age increase, it's now state pension age. This is 2 very different things. https://www.gov.uk/pip/eligibility

    You would need an awful lot of signatures for this. This cut off age for the mobility part was there when it was DLA too. Mobility issess are likely to increase with age, which is why there's a cut off age.

    Good luck with the signatures though.
    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • janer1967janer1967 Community champion Posts: 8,545 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi and welcome to the community glad you have joined us and I am sure there are lots of people in this situation and as advised unfortunately this is the criteria

    I do wish you luck though in your campaig but I feel there has to be a cut off point somewhere as with age unfgrtunately comes reduced mobility so if there wasnt a cut off age everyone would be claiming in their more senior years

    I may be wrong here but if you already have the mobility element prior to pension age then you retain it
  • Jacklmagill05Jacklmagill05 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    I will check that but as far as I'm aware 65 years of age is the cut off point with PIP. To deal with the point you make about mobility issues being greater when older, that is for the DLVA to decide if ones mobility interferes with ones ability to drive, it has always been their domain and is not in the DWP remit. If infirmity is the test of ability to drive we wouldn't need disability attachments to mobility vehicles as the disabled would be immediately sidelined. DLA does not operate the same over 65's policy, I was on DLA and was over 65 and awarded the higher rate mobility component and had a mobility vehicle. When I was transferred from DLA  to PIP the enhanced rate was downgraded to the lower rate and I lost my mobility vehicle on the grounds that I was over 65 years of age. I have that in writing and it clearly states 'over 65'.
    Regardless, the policy they pursue clearly piles everyone of a certain age group into one category, that they might not be fit to drive which should not concern them. The policy, no matter if it is over 65's or retirement age, is ageist in nature and Ageism is unlawful. It is as unlawful as racism or, for that matter, any other 'ism'.
    I would love to know other peoples views on this especially from anyone who has also fallen foul of this abominable rule.
    Regard to all,
    Jacklmagill05
  • janer1967janer1967 Community champion Posts: 8,545 Disability Gamechanger
    Enhanced mobility award isnt just for those wanting a vehicle or to drive and as such not part of DVLA remit.

    I get enhanced as I cant walk or drive and goes towards the cost of mobility scooter, power chair and also taxis and such so I can actually get out of the house
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    Yes it did used to be 65 and over because that was once state pension age but the age of this isn't 65 anymore, therefore the upper age for the mobility part is now state pension age, which it does clearly state that on the gov.uk link i posted above. It most definitely doesn't state 65.

    I'm not sure what DVLA have to do with PIP mobility, it's nothing to do with this. Being awarded any mobility part has nothing to do with anyone's ability to drive.

    When you transferred from DLA to PIP you could have indeed claimed the Enhanced mobility. Just because you were given the standard mobility doesn't mean you were unable to claim the Enhanced. The rules in 2013 when PIP was first introduced were if you were 65 or under on 8th April 2013 then you would be invited to apply for PIP which also mean the mobility part.

    If a mobility award wasn't possible then you wouldn't have been awarded standard rate to begin with. DLA and PIP are 2 different benefits with different criteria. The reason you lost your mobility vehicle was because you weren't awarded Enhanced mobility. Of course you could have appealed that decision by first requesting the MR and then Tribunal if that failed.
    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • Jacklmagill05Jacklmagill05 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Thank you for you comments and I really appreciate them. I can see how the upper age limit would rise in relation to retirement age, the letter I received at the time stated that as I was over 65, I didn't qualify for the enhanced rate. The retirement age at the time was 65. However, that doesn't make the policy, and in particular, this rule, any less ageist in nature.
    I will explain in brief what occurred to me at the time I changed over from DLA to PIP and you might better understand my grievance. After my initial assessment I was awarded only the standard rate mobility component and I appealed the decision and following procedure asked for a mandatory reconsideration. Unfortunately I caught TB and was hospitalised for a period of time after which I was quite ill for another pretty long period of time while recuperating and taking the dreadful drugs that was the cure. During this time my mandatory reconsideration arrived which had changed nothing, but I was too ill to lodge an appeal within the time limit they set which was 4 weeks from receiving their decision. I rang them and they said I could write and try to have them consider an appeal under extenuating circumstances but that I had would have little chance of success. This is where their trickery, for want of another word, came into play. They told me that in any case if I was to be successful in being granted an appeal, the waiting list for appeals was in excess of 9 months and that if I wished to hurry up the process I could make a fresh claim instead. Mistakenly, I did just that then fell foul of the over 65's rule upon my new assessment.
    I know now that although they tell you you must appeal within 4 weeks that is not the case. The actual time limit is 1 year and 1 day but they didn't tell me that but instead insisted I was out of time as it was well in excess of the 4 week period they state you are allowed.
    So you can see why I feel so aggrieved. As I had a mobility vehicle when I was in receipt of DLA and had I been successful in a PIP appeals procedure, the over 65's rule would not then have applied and my entitlement to enhanced rate mobility would not have been affected regardless of my age. 
    Keep in mind that it is not the extent of ones disability that decides the rate of allowance but ones age in cases like this. So it's age that denies one the enhanced rate mobility regardless of the seriousness of ones disability.
    I am sure others have fallen foul of this rule that I seriously consider to be Ageist in nature.
    Best regards,
    Jacklmagill05.

  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    I'm sorry to hear that. When you say you rang them, would that be DWP or HMCTS? You always have 13 months to appeal a decision, the same as the MR, you actually have 13 months for this too. HMCTS very very rarely refuse an appeal if it's late, so where ever you got the advice from that it's within 4 weeks was terrible advice.

    Had you appealed the decision then there may have been more chance of receiving the Enhanced mobility, although the criteria for this against High rate DLA is also completely different. It was 50 metres for DLA but it's 20 metres for Enhanced mobility PIP.

    It's very unlikely that the rules for the mobility award will change now after all these years
    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • Jacklmagill05Jacklmagill05 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Thanks for your imput, Poppy, it was the PIP office I rang, their phone number was on the letters I have from them. They told me I was too late to apply for an appeal and it was the girl to whom I was speaking who suggested that it would be quicker if I re-applied thus making my application a new application and thus subject to the over 65's rule. That is why I called it trickery on their part and from reports I have read in various articles I believe the people who run this department know what they are doing by misinforming or plain and simply not informing claimants of the statutory rules governing their department. In my case I was told many times I was out of time after the 4 week period had lapsed. This, as you highlighted, is blatantly untrue and at no time did anyone in the DWP tell me any different. I believed I had run out of time as I had been ill with TB and the sickness involved taking the cure for a period of a few months. To me that seemed reasonable because I knew no better and no one in the DWP told me.
    Thank you for your trouble in posting a response to my concerns. I still think the policy is Ageist in nature and Ageism is unlawful.
    Best regards,
    Jacklmagill05 
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,794 Disability Gamechanger
    I think you have multiple hurdles to overcome here and they are likely insurmountable:

    1 - if you’re going to JR a decision then you need to do so quickly and will need expert assistance. I’m sensing from your being on a forum like this that you’re not clear on the need for speed and have no firm employed. I’m sensing you’re well outside the 13 months brick wall time limit also. JRs take money or legal aid. An EA10 based case is also going to need a group of you who have similar but not identical argument i.e. if you want to argue that there’s discrimination against a group your case is strengthened by several members of that group taking action not one. It’s not impossible but it’s a damn sight harder. 

    2 - it’s a complete myth you cannot claim PIP mobility post pensionable age. See the first post of this thread

    3 - the failure here is really one of getting timely advice. Neither PIP nor HMCTS have any specific duty of care and the advice you got was someone in a call centre who may not have even been employed by PIP. A general would be to not get SD have from the very parties your in dispute with.

    A late appeal would likely have been admitted. Whilst the timing of your ill health was unfortunate there’s lots of well established case law on delegation whilst in hospital i.e. whether you could have communicated your needs to another person to act on your behalf whilst in hospital. It may not sway in your favour. 

    4 - I’m not seeing anything here worthy of a JR, Nothing in the advice you did receive I prevented you from exercising your appeal rights and as PIP mobility can be chai,Ed post pensionable age then what exactly is the argument?
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    @mikehughescq ah yes the supersession, completely overlooked that. Although for this wouldn't they have to prove that they were entitled to Enhanced mobility at the time? Rather than a worsening of condition?
    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • Jacklmagill05Jacklmagill05 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Hi Mike, after a number of phone calls arguing my condition and how it affects my daily living the DWP conceded that I passed the criteria for the enhanced rate but my age prevented them from awarding it to me.
    Thank you for you input and your interest.
    Best regards,
    Jacklmagill05.
  • tommymcfc22tommymcfc22 Member Posts: 23 Connected
    Hi won appeal at court for pip on 11/08/20 received a letter asking if I've been in hospital or abroad or in prison sent that back not heard nothing so rang and the man said they have up to 18th September to respond is this normal and does anyone know why they take so long as of today I've waited 56 weeks altogether
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi won appeal at court for pip on 11/08/20 received a letter asking if I've been in hospital or abroad or in prison sent that back not heard nothing so rang and the man said they have up to 18th September to respond is this normal and does anyone know why they take so long as of today I've waited 56 weeks altogether

    Perfectly normal. Backdated money can take 2-8 weeks, sometimes longer after a Tribunal win. There's nothing more you can do but wait.
    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,794 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi Mike, after a number of phone calls arguing my condition and how it affects my daily living the DWP conceded that I passed the criteria for the enhanced rate but my age prevented them from awarding it to me.
    Thank you for you input and your interest.
    Best regards,
    Jacklmagill05.
    Please read the link at point 2 of my previous post. Thank you.
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