New crackdown on benefits
Andi66
Community Member Posts: 1,469 Championing
I know I said before in the pip. But now I read that sunak saying that you will lose your benefit after 12 months if not in work. I am terrified. I'm in my 50s have autism ,copd due to previous cleaning job. Non smoker. And joint hypermobility syndrome. In pain all the time.plus osteoporosis in both feet making walking painful .I'm on esa and pip
So this is scary. I had to give my job up last year due to these conditions.
This is weighing on my mind now
So this is scary. I had to give my job up last year due to these conditions.
This is weighing on my mind now
2
Comments
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Andi66 said:I know I said before in the pip. But now I read that sunak saying that you will lose your benefit after 12 months if not in work. I am terrified. I'm in my 50s have autism ,copd due to previous cleaning job. Non smoker. And joint hypermobility syndrome. In pain all the time.plus osteoporosis in both feet making walking painful .I'm on esa and pip
So this is scary. I had to give my job up last year due to these conditions.
This is weighing on my mind nowAndi66 said:I know I said before in the pip. But now I read that sunak saying that you will lose your benefit after 12 months if not in work. I am terrified. I'm in my 50s have autism ,copd due to previous cleaning job. Non smoker. And joint hypermobility syndrome. In pain all the time.plus osteoporosis in both feet making walking painful .I'm on esa and pip
So this is scary. I had to give my job up last year due to these conditions.
This is weighing on my mind now
It is just a proposal at this stage.Andi66 said:I know I said before in the pip. But now I read that sunak saying that you will lose your benefit after 12 months if not in work. I am terrified. I'm in my 50s have autism ,copd due to previous cleaning job. Non smoker. And joint hypermobility syndrome. In pain all the time.plus osteoporosis in both feet making walking painful .I'm on esa and pip
So this is scary. I had to give my job up last year due to these conditions.
This is weighing on my mind now
Sunak hasnt even done it in manefesto yet.
From what I can gather, he seems to be aiming mainly at people with mental health conditions.
He said they dont need the same level of financial support as those with physical disabilities and he stated that those in the most need would always be supported.
Personally I am not going to stress over it yet because he intends to carry it forward after the next general election and I doubt the Tories will win but having said that I dont think Labour will be any more compsionate towards disabled people.
I think his proposals will be hugely unpopular and there will be a back lash against the Tories because of it.0 -
Even if the changes did take place and no one knows yet whether they will. Losing benefits after 12 months would only likely apply to job seekers. As you’re claiming ESA then you’re not a job seeker.1
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I get what your saying poppy
that esa claimants aren’t jobseekers and at most doing work related activity
but when esa claimants migrate over and become uc claimants they have to sign a claimant agreement (even those on sickness elements)
and if previous policy announced after last years consultation goes ahead as planned by stride along with this possible migration speed up, by 2025/2026 esa claimants will no longer exist and many will be recategorised as uc jobseekers)
the situation today is clear yes but if we’ve learnt anything in the past year there’s a whole multiverse of scenarios of what government policies (known or yet to be announced) will be imposed on the long term sickness
the only guarantee I can take with certainty - the uncertainty of every possible scenario of how this ends up playing out (and there’s many ways and extremes that could play out) is stressful as hell
people on this forum whom aren’t natural planners are better equipped to not worry about things till they happen
natural planners like myself have probably had any back plans blown to bits and the lack of new dates and details is stopping any replanning being down, so I’m in stress city right now and I doubt it’s only a population of one!0 -
No they will not because if in the Support Group then you're automatically entitled to the LCWRA element from the start of your claim. Your claimant commitments will simply be to agree to report all changes.apple85 said:I get what your saying poppy
that esa claimants aren’t jobseekers and at most doing work related activity
but when esa claimants migrate over and become uc claimants they have to sign a claimant agreement (even those on sickness elements)
and if previous policy announced after last years consultation goes ahead as planned by stride along with this possible migration speed up, by 2025/2026 esa claimants will no longer exist and many will be recategorised as uc jobseekers)
For UC you're treated as a job seeker only until a decision is made on a WCA. Those that have LCWRA are not job seekers.2 -
apple85 IS correct - claimants with health conditions do become 'disabled job-seekers' under UC.
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No they do not, if they've been found to have LCWRA.WhatThe said:
apple85 IS correct - claimants with health conditions do become 'disabled job-seekers' under UC.2 -
The only exception will be for LCWRA Special Rules cases I'm sorry to say. The rest become 'disabled job-seekers' under UC regardless of the health component.
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Again you are not correct and I’m sure you’ve been advised of this many times in the past. When you’ve been found to have LCWRA you are NOT a job seeker.WhatThe said:
The only exception will be for LCWRA Special Rules cases I'm sorry to say. The rest become 'disabled job-seekers' under UC regardless of the health component.
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Hello @WhatThe, I know you still have ongoing issues with your own claim which may be confusing things but what @poppy123456 has said is correct.WhatThe said:
apple85 IS correct - claimants with health conditions do become 'disabled job-seekers' under UC.
Under current rules, claimants with LCWRA are not expected to look for work or undertake any work related activity. They can if they choose to, but are not expected to and are not classed as job seekers.5 -
Poppy is correct the proposed changes are regarding people providing sick notes or LCW/WRAG. People in the Support Group etc will not be expected to seek work. Any changes are not even confirmed to happen, it depends on whether they get re-elected and even then its not guaranteed.
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How many currently on esa support group will actually get uc lcwra at their first uc wca?poppy123456 said:
No they do not, if they've been found to have LCWRA.WhatThe said:
apple85 IS correct - claimants with health conditions do become 'disabled job-seekers' under UC.
ignoring all the proposed changes that may or may not be implemented in the future, I’ve been told by someone with experience with the migration that invisible disabilities are having a significantly harder to impossible time getting on even lcw, let alone lcwra
i recognise that as neither yourself or me has personally experienced a uc wca we can’t 100% conclude anything but we can’t rule out anything either
if I’ve learnt anything in the last 14 years it’s make a (solid backup) plan as far as you can (or at least some forward planning) and then store it safe for when it’s needed then try to move forward crossing fingers any plans for worst case stays in ‘storage’
just saying it may never happen only works if it doesn’t - and with current politicans that’s quite frankly a daft bet to make
(and planning for all possible scenarios isn’t panicking, if a fall back is possible you should always seek it out)0 -
Those that are in the Support Group will be entitled to the LCWRA element of UC from the start of their claim.apple85 said:
How many currently on esa support group will actually get uc lcwra at their first uc wca?poppy123456 said:
No they do not, if they've been found to have LCWRA.WhatThe said:
apple85 IS correct - claimants with health conditions do become 'disabled job-seekers' under UC.
The stats for the WCA for both UC and ESA is about the same, so I'm not really sure exactly what it is you're talking about.apple85 said:
How many currently on esa support group will actually get uc lcwra at their first uc wca?poppy123456 said:
No they do not, if they've been found to have LCWRA.WhatThe said:
apple85 IS correct - claimants with health conditions do become 'disabled job-seekers' under UC.
ignoring all the proposed changes that may or may not be implemented in the future, I’ve been told by someone with experience with the migration that invisible disabilities are having a significantly harder to impossible time getting on even lcw, let alone lcwra
Who ever told you that needs to have some lessons in the process of the WCA for both ESA and UC because they are identical in every single way, even the descriptors are the same. Here you go, here's the descriptors for Support Group... support-group-descriptors
Here's the descriptors for LCWRA.. for UC. https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/universal-credit-uc/uc-faq/limited-capability-for-work-related-activityapple85 said:poppy123456 said:
No they do not, if they've been found to have LCWRA.WhatThe said:
apple85 IS correct - claimants with health conditions do become 'disabled job-seekers' under UC.
i recognise that as neither yourself or me has personally experienced a uc wca we can’t 100% conclude anything but we can’t rule out anything either
Well actually, that's where you are wrong again. Please do not assume something about me that you don't even know. I actually have been through a work capability for UC because my daughter claims it and I'm her appointee. This means it was me that started her UC claim, me that reported her health condition and provided fit notes, me that filled out the UC50 form and ME that actually answered all the questions during her WCA which was by telephone in June 2021.
So, yes I do have experience with both ESA and UC. As I advised, they are both identical. She's never even logged into her journal since I started her claim and has no interest in it at all. All she knows is that I give her money each month when her benefits go into my bank.apple85 said:poppy123456 said:
No they do not, if they've been found to have LCWRA.WhatThe said:
apple85 IS correct - claimants with health conditions do become 'disabled job-seekers' under UC.
if I’ve learnt anything in the last 14 years it’s make a (solid backup) plan as far as you can (or at least some forward planning) and then store it safe for when it’s needed then try to move forward crossing fingers any plans for worst case stays in ‘storage’
just saying it may never happen only works if it doesn’t - and with current politicans that’s quite frankly a daft bet to make
(and planning for all possible scenarios isn’t panicking, if a fall back is possible you should always seek it out)
I have no problems with planning things but when you're saying things that just aren't true is wrong.0 -
Forgot to include the current stats for both ESA and UC WCA. UC here. https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/universal-credit-work-capability-assessment-statistics-april-2019-to-december-2023/universal-credit-work-capability-assessment-april-2019-to-december-2023.
Since April 2019, DWP have made 2.4 million decisions. Of these decisions, 16% of people were found to have no limited capability for work and hence no longer on UChealth, 19% limited capability for work (LCW), and 65% limited capability for work and work-related activity (LCWRA).
ESA here. https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/esa-outcomes-of-work-capability-assessments-including-mandatory-reconsiderations-and-appeals-march-2024/esa-outcomes-of-work-capability-assessments-including-mandatory-reconsiderations-and-appeals-march-2024
Generally the proportion of initial ESA WCA assessments with FfW outcomes had been falling and the proportion with a SG outcome had been rising, up until March 2021. In the last 12 months proportions of initial assessments with FfW outcomes have fluctuated between 19% and 26%, and SG outcomes have fluctuated between 60% and 68%.In the quarter to September 2023, the percentage of DWP decisions for initial WCAsfalling into each outcome category was:
61% of outcomes for Support Group
14% of outcomes were for Work Related Activity Group
25% of outcomes were found Fit for Work
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It's easy to keep perspective when you don't have MH problems and when the government is at least making an effort to pretend they are interested in whether we live or die. Unfortunately for many of us, Rishi Sunak just spoke very plainly about exactly what they want to do to us. It's almost impossible not to imagine that we are in the firing line and if we are able, we should plan accordingly. If you'd have asked me 3 yrs ago I would have said I was able to not worry, but now I am terrified. I know that if I don't plan for the worst - and that IS almost exactly what Sunak has said will happen if they win, and Starmer is silent - then I will risk having the sky fall in with no idea how to stop being buried. You can imagine it's all going to be ok if you want, but constructive planning is never wasted imo.
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There is an election coming up, things really aren't looking 'rosy' for Sunak and Co.Meg24 said:It's easy to keep perspective when you don't have MH problems and when the government is at least making an effort to pretend they are interested in whether we live or die. Unfortunately for many of us, Rishi Sunak just spoke very plainly about exactly what they want to do to us. It's almost impossible not to imagine that we are in the firing line and if we are able, we should plan accordingly. If you'd have asked me 3 yrs ago I would have said I was able to not worry, but now I am terrified. I know that if I don't plan for the worst - and that IS almost exactly what Sunak has said will happen if they win, and Starmer is silent - then I will risk having the sky fall in with no idea how to stop being buried. You can imagine it's all going to be ok if you want, but constructive planning is never wasted imo.
It is 'debatable' whether there will be a Conservative party left. These are desperate sound bites from Sunak and Co. He and his party are throwing the kitchen sink to stay in power.
Get on with life, don;t left them cause you anxiety / stress.1 -
It is worrying though and now the media is all over it. Those with genuine mental health and physical issues are being tarnished .
It shows how people are being paid to write false documents so they can claim pip. But genuine people who are diagnosed are being lumped together as spongers. So unfair and worrying2 -
They are plans that will get put in motion if the Tories win, I remember how they were not supposed to win in 2017... I cannot ignore this, as I said maybe if I didn't have MH problems I might be able to but I do, so I can't. If I had that much control over what my mind does I wouldn't be so ill!rebel11 said:
There is an election coming up, things really aren't looking 'rosy' for Sunak and Co.Meg24 said:It's easy to keep perspective when you don't have MH problems and when the government is at least making an effort to pretend they are interested in whether we live or die. Unfortunately for many of us, Rishi Sunak just spoke very plainly about exactly what they want to do to us. It's almost impossible not to imagine that we are in the firing line and if we are able, we should plan accordingly. If you'd have asked me 3 yrs ago I would have said I was able to not worry, but now I am terrified. I know that if I don't plan for the worst - and that IS almost exactly what Sunak has said will happen if they win, and Starmer is silent - then I will risk having the sky fall in with no idea how to stop being buried. You can imagine it's all going to be ok if you want, but constructive planning is never wasted imo.
It is 'debatable' whether there will be a Conservative party left. These are desperate sound bites from Sunak and Co. He and his party are throwing the kitchen sink to stay in power.
Get on with life, don;t left them cause you anxiety / stress.0 -
Thank you for seeing the thought process behind my logicMeg24 said:It's easy to keep perspective when you don't have MH problems and when the government is at least making an effort to pretend they are interested in whether we live or die. Unfortunately for many of us, Rishi Sunak just spoke very plainly about exactly what they want to do to us. It's almost impossible not to imagine that we are in the firing line and if we are able, we should plan accordingly. If you'd have asked me 3 yrs ago I would have said I was able to not worry, but now I am terrified. I know that if I don't plan for the worst - and that IS almost exactly what Sunak has said will happen if they win, and Starmer is silent - then I will risk having the sky fall in with no idea how to stop being buried. You can imagine it's all going to be ok if you want, but constructive planning is never wasted imo.
i do think that sunak is increasingly coming across as a ‘mad scientist’ or at least desperate
but at the same way I almost appreciate sunaks ‘honestly’ (how he truly views the disabled) - I wish starmer would clarify his viewpoint as I’ve no clue if he’s appearing to be disinterested in the disabled in order to get the votes and then show his true intent once he has the power to change things or if he’s actually disinterested in the disabled (or he’s appearing disinterested as his true feelings are worse than sunak and that could be a vote loser as sunak is a pretty soulless benchmark imo)
the axing of the scheme to help the disabled into work 3 days after his speech is contradictory and badly thought out & I think some of the public (that don’t drink up the times, telegraph, and Mail’s to be frank fictional tales) are starting to ask what the government intent with the long term sick and disabled actually is
the medical community have also been insulted by all this - sunak is basically gambling on the amount of far right voters in the uk and the number of the public whom accept newspaper opinion as fact and a lack of common sense0 -
Apple85,
A first WCA for UC doesn't mean the decision will be any different to what it was when you were claiming UC. The stats for both speak for their self. Even if you stayed on ESA the decision could move someone out of the Support Group, the chances are the same.
No, your thoughts are not correct about UC TP. If someone was entitled to that, losing the LCWRA element will not remove the TP.
Having read through my comments in this read I never said you were scaremongering at all. What I said was some of what you were saying is wrong and it is. Im sorry if you don't like that but I'm here to advise people and giving the correct advice is very important to me because so many people rely on that. If I see something that's not right I will speak up. It's not just you, I would do the same to anyone and have done many times in the past.
I can't pass comment on sex & the city because it's not something I've ever watched, or wanted to.
I'm a great believer in thinking positive about most things in life and I think I've told you this before. For this reason I don't worry about something until I know I have something to worry about. I've been the same my whole life and it's highly unlikely to change now.
I never implied that you are a trouble maker or dishonest and I'm gob smacked at the thought that you think I did...
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Me and my partner have recently migrated from ESA Support Group to UC(we get more money) and he was placed in the LCWRA group straight away. Having the ESA award letter can be helpful to moving over to UC but it's not really necessary, just might have to wait a week or two for the system to be updated. So I can confirm you should be placed in the LCWRA group.0
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