The Oxford comma

WhatThe
WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,583 Championing
edited October 2024 in People power

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  • Morgan_Alumni
    Morgan_Alumni Posts: 782 Online Community Team

    I have no strong feelings either way. Do you @WhatThe?

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,583 Championing
    edited October 2024

    Morgan - enough to start a thread about it, yes.

    MW, I mentioned TC in relation to her role at DWP and I mention the Oxford comma in relation to the 2008 ESA regs. That's what needs to be examined and understood - why it was in the original text and why it was edited out.

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,583 Championing
    edited October 2024

    Heck, not heard of Holly Willoughby until now or read those emails.

    MW, I can't do much more online today. This is heavy stuff. I've got downloads on memory sticks and a computer but cannot upload them. The DWP reports recently published by Labour 🙏 and mentioned by another member need your attention.

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,583 Championing

    vikki, those newly published reports from 2014 will hold some of the answers. I really need someone else to trawl through them (and the regulations) because I can't easily explain the ESA fiasco. I'm encouraged to read that MW had not heard of it because there was one and it was buried by the media..

  • OverlyAnxious
    OverlyAnxious Community Member Posts: 5,900 Championing

    I've always felt the Oxford comma looks awkward next to an 'and', though I do use it myself where I feel it offers more clarity. But, of course, that additional clarity will only be understood by others who have, at least, the same level of grammatical education in written English. 🤔

    (I don't know anything about the ESA comma issues though.)

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,583 Championing

    OverlyAnxious, I'd never heard of it or used it but its omission from later text altered the intended use of those regs.

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,583 Championing

    vikki, I was so excited when I heard TC mention the Oxford comma!

    It told me 1) Most importantly, that I hadn't imagined any of this. 2) That perhaps the Conservative minister didn't agree with the dishonourable gentleman's scam. 3) There was now a chance that the truth would come out.

  • michael57
    michael57 Community Member Posts: 2,751 Championing
    https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/926798#Comment_926798

    on a lighter note man and lady in a restaurant lady says its the guys duty to pay thats why it is men'u man replies its both our responsibility thats why its called me'n'u i will leave now 😂

  • OverlyAnxious
    OverlyAnxious Community Member Posts: 5,900 Championing

    Have you heard the one about the mafia Panda visiting a restaurant?

    He eats, shoots, and leaves.

    Which is very different to his friend without commas, who eats shoots and leaves.

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,583 Championing
    edited October 2024

    Different again from the book of the same title 😁

  • michael57
    michael57 Community Member Posts: 2,751 Championing
    https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/926941#Comment_926941

    i was walking past a farm and saw a sign that said "duck, eggs" i thought thats an unnecessary comma and then it hit me

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,583 Championing

    😂

  • Jimm_Alumni
    Jimm_Alumni Scope alumni Posts: 5,713 Championing

    I like to use it in lists to make sure the final two items in the list are shown to be entirely separate. I remember watching a youtube video actually where the oxford comma wasn't used in a certain state law in Maine, USA and ended up costing the State government a lot of money in a lawsuit. I'll need to try and find it again.

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,583 Championing
    edited October 2024

    Jimm, it's the ESA regulations - regs 29 and 35 - I'd like someone to upload here so we can identify the Oxford comma in them because I don't know how to upload.. (please don't give me how to steps) Thank you

  • michael57
    michael57 Community Member Posts: 2,751 Championing

    i dont use them much because i have a job to see them and it has a habit of winding people up a tad and i do not take great comfort it that 😈

  • chiarieds
    chiarieds Community Member Posts: 17,439 Championing
    edited October 2024

    Hope this helps. Reg 29 in first link, & Reg 35 in the 2nd:

    https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2008/794/regulation/29/made

    https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2008/794/regulation/35/made

    If you search for ESA regulations 29 & 35 Rightsnet there's an interesting document discussing both if you click on the first link which says, 'Making an exception: Regs.29 Reg.35 in ESA cases - Rightsnet'

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,583 Championing

    Thank you! Are you able to put the text on here?

  • chiarieds
    chiarieds Community Member Posts: 17,439 Championing

    Exceptional circumstances

    29.—(1) A claimant who does not have limited capability for work as determined in accordance with the limited capability for work assessment is to be treated as having limited capability for work if paragraph (2) applies to the claimant.

    (2) This paragraph applies if—

    (a)the claimant is suffering from a life threatening disease in relation to which—

    (i)there is medical evidence that the disease is uncontrollable, or uncontrolled, by a recognised therapeutic procedure; and

    (ii)in the case of a disease that is uncontrolled, there is a reasonable cause for it not to be controlled by a recognised therapeutic procedure; or

    (b)the claimant suffers from some specific disease or bodily or mental disablement and, by reasons of such disease or disablement, there would be a substantial risk to the mental or physical health of any person if the claimant were found not to have limited capability for work.

    _____________________________________________________________________________________________

    Certain claimants to be treated as having limited capability for work-related activity

    35.—(1) A claimant is to be treated as having limited capability for work-related activity if—

    (a)the claimant is terminally ill;

    (b)the claimant is—

    (i)receiving treatment by way of intravenous, intraperitoneal or intrathecal chemotherapy; or

    (ii)recovering from that treatment and the Secretary of State is satisfied that the claimant should be treated as having limited capability for work-related activity; or

    (c)in the case of a woman, she is pregnant and there is a serious risk of damage to her health or to the health of her unborn child if she does not refrain from work-related activity.

    (2) A claimant who does not have limited capability for work-related activity as determined in accordance with regulation 34(1) is to be treated as having limited capability for work-related activity if—

    (a)the claimant suffers from some specific disease or bodily or mental disablement; and

    (b)by reasons of such disease or disablement, there would be a substantial risk to the mental or physical health of any person if the claimant were found not to have limited capability for work-related activity.

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,583 Championing

    🙏

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