PIP Appeal after MR unchanged

Moonlady

From a past thread

PIP MR query — Scope | Disability forum

This is regarding my partner's PIP application. First time applying and he has scored Daily Living 11 Mobility 10.

We did a MR and have heard back today that basically nothing has changed with the points.

What I would like to know please is there a time scale for Appealing at all ? Is it a month from the date of the new MR letter?

I am not sure if my partner would like to appeal at this stage, as we need to have a longer chat about it and his stress levels

IF we did appeal I think he would choose the phone call ( I am aware that they are not as successful)

Another thing, they still have scored him zero points on planning and following a journey. My partner will not go out on his own and has to have someone with him at all times, due to his nerves/anxiety and mobility. Also he is nervous about having another heart attack if he did go out alone  , so he doesn't.He only goes to hospital appointments by hospital transport /or GP appointments in a taxi with myself and that really is it at the moment. 

In the MR I did I take on the advice regarding the section on planning and following a journey from a kind poster @ chiarieds as below from the other post I did on the MR. And they still scored zero

Quote From chiarieds

You should, as you've worked out, concentrate on the 'planning & following a journey' descriptor, & only need 4 points for this section to get enhanced mobility for your partner. You need to leave his physical problems out of this, as it's his mental health that's relevant here, such that he needs to be accompanied if going due to his anxiety. Now try to give a couple of examples as to what has happened when he has attempted to go out on his own, or how much prompting you need to give him (if appropriate) to go out if accompanied. You need to say exactly why he won't go out accompanied, what happens, when did this happen (thinking around the time of his assessment), & were there any consequences attempting to do this. How does going out exactly make him feel; how is he when he gets back home, does going out increase his stress, etc?

You can see the points for this descriptor here: https://pipinfo.net/activities/planning-and-following-journeys

Remember to say how often this occurs; does he only go out for appointments, or could he go out most days, if not, why? as PIP is how you are the majority of the time. Could he use public transport, if not, why? It's valid to say he has concerns about going out on his own in case of another heart attack.
 Unquote

I can not think of what else to include if we appeal as everything is there in black and white explaining his circumstances

Let's say he appealed, and it went to tribunal I know there is a long wait from what I hear

Also what is the process ?

Many thanks 

poppy123456

You have 13 months to request the Tribunal. If you're outside of the 1 month timeframe then you need to give a reason why you didn't request it within that time. It's unlikely they would refuse a late appeal.

Your thoughts on a telephone hearing have less success rate is not correct. Telephone, video and face to face hearings all have the same success rate, at about 68%. It's paper based hearings that have considerably less success rate.

Moonlady said:

From a past thread

PIP MR query — Scope | Disability forum

Another thing, they still have scored him zero points on planning and following a journey. My partner will not go out on his own and has to have someone with him at all times, due to his nerves/anxiety and mobility.

Not being able to go out alone because of mobility issues will not score any points for following and planning a journey. This part of mobility applies to mental health, cognitive and sensory impairments.

Waiting times for Tribunal hearings could be at least several months, potentially longer. Sometimes DWP may offer an award before the hearing but this is rare and you should rely on this.

Difficult to know what else to advise you to put for a Tribunal without knowing what information you've already given.

You could get expert advice from an agency near you. Start here. https://advicelocal.uk/welfare-benefits

Moonlady

poppy123456 said:

You have 13 months to request the Tribunal. If you're outside of the 1 month timeframe then you need to give a reason why you didn't request it within that time. It's unlikely they would refuse a late appeal.

Your thoughts on a telephone hearing have less success rate is not correct. Telephone, video and face to face hearings all have the same success rate, at about 68%. It's paper based hearings that have considerably less success rate.

Moonlady said:

From a past thread

PIP MR query — Scope | Disability forum

Another thing, they still have scored him zero points on planning and following a journey. My partner will not go out on his own and has to have someone with him at all times, due to his nerves/anxiety and mobility.

Not being able to go out alone because of mobility issues will not score any points for following and planning a journey. This part of mobility applies to mental health, cognitive and sensory impairments.

Waiting times for Tribunal hearings could be at least several months, potentially longer. Sometimes DWP may offer an award before the hearing but this is rare and you should rely on this.

Difficult to know what else to advise you to put for a Tribunal without knowing what information you've already given.

You could get expert advice from an agency near you. Start here. https://advicelocal.uk/welfare-benefits

@poppy123456
Many thanks for your response
Ah, thanks for clarifying the success rate 
.
I have gone on the link for appeals and it states
"You’ll need to choose whether you want to go to the tribunal hearing to explain your appeal in person. If you do not attend, your appeal will be decided on your appeal form and any supporting evidence you provide."
I've not gone any further than that yet.....just looking at options.
Now if he chooses to do something like a phone call and not attend would that still be counted as going to the tribunal or would that be the second choice, do not attend and decided on appeal form and evidence?
(There could be another choice after tribunal hearing option, as I go along the form, but I do not want to go that far at present)

In the planning and following journey question, I concentrated on the mental health aspect not mobility as I was advised to.

Thanks about the waiting times regarding the hearings and the advice link

I did have some advice from Macmillan as my partner has terminal cancer. I went through my MR with them and they advised a few minor details I had not added. 

Thanks for your help

poppy123456

Yes the information on the website just hasn't been updated, no idea why. Telephone and video hearings started way back in 2020 during the pandemic and they just continued. As i advised, telephone and video have the same stats as appearing in person.

Paper based is where they make a decision on paper alone so please do not choose that option because there's only something like 5-8% success rate, very low.

Moonlady

poppy123456 said:

Yes the information on the website just hasn't been updated, no idea why. Telephone and video hearings started way back in 2020 during the pandemic and they just continued. As i advised, telephone and video have the same stats as appearing in person.

Paper based is where they make a decision on paper alone so please do not choose that option because there's only something like 5-8% success rate, very low.

Thanks again. If we go ahead I hope he will be able to do telephone call....I think that will be less stressful for him. 
Gosh the paper based option has very low success rates then.....thanks again for your help and knowledge.

Moonlady

Two questions please regarding the appeal (still undecided)

1. If the MR decision was on the 7th Dec  2023 would it be 28 days or a calendar month as such to appeal (I know you can appeal after that but just to keep it neater as such).  So by 4th Jan or by 7th Jan (calendar month) please?

2. If you start to appeal and then change your mind, can you withdraw it at any stage ?

Many thanks

poppy123456

It's 1 month from the date of the decision, so 7th January but as you correctly stated, you have 13 months so there's no rush. If you are outside the 1 month then you must give a reason but HMCTS are unlikely to refuse a late appeal.

Yes, you can withdraw at anytime.

Moonlady

poppy123456 said:

It's 1 month from the date of the decision, so 7th January but as you correctly stated, you have 13 months so there's no rush. If you are outside the 1 month then you must give a reason but HMCTS are unlikely to refuse a late appeal.

Yes, you can withdraw at anytime.

Many thanks. I knew I could ask here and get swift correct advice.
Thanks again Poppy.

chiarieds

Hi again @Moonlady - sorry that a MR didn't change your partner's PIP award, but this happens too often unfortunately as has been said. Bearing in mind that he's approaching State Pension age next year, then I'm pleased you're appealing now (it won't matter if he's of State Pension age so long as you've appealed before this). As mentioned, altho possible, it's also difficult to increase the mobility component from standard to enhanced once over State Pension age. I don't think a tribunal by phone will be as stressful as his one for his assessment; a tribunal is separate from the DWP, & there to listen.

Do please go forward, & there's no reason to withdraw his claim as, if a tribunal thinks it would reduce his claim, then they'll let you know just beforehand, or on the day of his tribunal, so you'd then not proceed,  tho perhaps knowing his claim can be withdrawn at any time will help alleviate his understandable anxiety.

One thing I don't think has been mentioned, & dependent on the length of his current award, you can also query the length of time of this, but don't have to do this straight away.

You can add any extra information at any time, tho hopefully not at the last minute! Can you ask his Macmillan nurse(s) to write something? I do know from what my next door neighbour has said that there's not always funding to do so in all areas.

Remember that all that you've put in his MR will be there for a tribunal to see, which I consider a positive.

Moonlady

chiarieds said:

Hi again @Moonlady - sorry that a MR didn't change your partner's PIP award, but this happens too often unfortunately as has been said. Bearing in mind that he's approaching State Pension age next year, then I'm pleased you're appealing now (it won't matter if he's of State Pension age so long as you've appealed before this). As mentioned, altho possible, it's also difficult to increase the mobility component from standard to enhanced once over State Pension age. I don't think a tribunal by phone will be as stressful as his one for his assessment; a tribunal is separate from the DWP, & there to listen.

Do please go forward, & there's no reason to withdraw his claim as, if a tribunal thinks it would reduce his claim, then they'll let you know just beforehand, or on the day of his tribunal, so you'd then not proceed,  tho perhaps knowing his claim can be withdrawn at any time will help alleviate his understandable anxiety.

One thing I don't think has been mentioned, & dependent on the length of his current award, you can also query the length of time of this, but don't have to do this straight away.

You can add any extra information at any time, tho hopefully not at the last minute! Can you ask his Macmillan nurse(s) to write something? I do know from what my next door neighbour has said that there's not always funding to do so in all areas.

Remember that all that you've put in his MR will be there for a tribunal to see, which I consider a positive.

Hello again @chiarieds
Many thanks for your kind reply
I think we shall definitely decide next week, I've not brought up the subject too much due to Xmas/New Year and have until 7th Jan (more time if needed as Poppy12345 had said)

That's great that they will tell you they you if they will may reduce the claim and you can abort the process.
I think when I explain to my partner that also he can stop at any time it will make him feel less stressed about the whole thing.

On the MR I gave as much as I could on the information and too be honest I can not think of more. I may try to include some more real life examples if I can. 
On the reply they sent with the MR they said words to the effect as he was caring for someone who is disabled (myself for mental health reasons) for 35 hours as a carer ....he should be able to care for himself as well.  I want to get across that the care he gives to me is for mental health only and he can not go out alone without the support of someone else. I really do believe he fits the descriptors for the Planning and following a journey.

He doesn't actually have a Macmillan nurse as such. He just has regular blood tests ( to see if he needs more chemo or not) and telephone appointments with his cancer doctor regularly.  So he doesn't have a nurse. He has access by telephone to a Specialist Nurse led team at St Barts Hospital but doesn't really use them at the moment. 

Many thanks again for the information and support

Moonlady

Just an update we have gone ahead the appeal and filled in the online form and got confirmation in a text. Thanks for the information

Moonlady

This is an update for 2 very helpful members
@chiarieds and @poppy123456 

As you know from the beginning of this PIP claim, we did a MR and it was unchanged.
Due to my partners age ....nearly State Pension age, you encouraged us to go through with the appeal on the knowledge that we could pull out at any time. Which eased my partner's anxiety.

He had a phone call last week randomly from PIP a few questions asked by the lady, about the information we gave. She said no need to go to appeal and they would award him enhanced on both parts.

I waited for the confirmation letter before posting just to be sure.

SO THANKS EVERSO MUCH to you both especially for all your help and information. 

He can relax about it now and for myself not think about continually.

poppy123456

That's fantastic news!! Thank you for returning with an update, it's appreciated. 

chiarieds

I am so pleased to hear your news @Moonlady - well done to both of you, & great your husband was awarded without the need for a tribunal. Thank you for your update!

Moonlady

Thank you both. SO pleased, I wanted the letter before I mentioned it.

The update was the least I could do for all your help x

Moonlady

poppy123456 said:

That's fantastic news!! Thank you for returning with an update, it's appreciated. 

Thank you.....I think we are still in shock to be honest. I wanted the letter in my hand before saying anything.

Returning with an update was the least I could do. Your help was invaluable and gave me confidence to keep pushing for what I believed was right x

Moonlady

poppy123456 said:

That's fantastic news!! Thank you for returning with an update, it's appreciated. 

Thank you.

I wanted the letter in my hand before I said anything

We are still in shock

Least I could do with an update, Thanks again x

Lou67

@Moonlady
Hi I hope you’re good. Oh that’s amazing news I’m so pleased for you and your husband.
That’ll be a massive relief for yous.
I hope yous treat yourselves to something nice with a bit off the backpay.

Enjoy your day ❤️

Moonlady

Lou67 said:

@Moonlady
Hi I hope you’re good. Oh that’s amazing news I’m so pleased for you and your husband.
That’ll be a massive relief for yous.
I hope yous treat yourselves to something nice with a bit off the backpay.

Enjoy your day ❤️

Many thanks
We are still very shocked and pleased
It is a big relief to us. 

I think we will have a discussion to see if he wants to get a mobility car. I can drive but he can not. Will help him get around for appointments.

Thanks again x