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ESA 3 form, recent CBESA migration error

Rosehearty
Rosehearty Member Posts: 13 Listener
Hi, I just received a form from DWP, requesting me to give info since Sept. 2012.

This request was photocopied one side correctly, and reverse side upside down.

I had an anxiety attack as it scared me, and took me most of the day to calm down, and a family member helped me a bit.

We tried to find some more info and found the BBC news article from November re CBESA being incorrect.  Now just need to find some help to complete the form correctly.  I always wondered why I was on less money than relatives on IRESA, when I had worked for almost 30 years and was on lowest benefit of them all and thought was just typical.  So much hardship over the years, and now this worry and now thinking will have to do another medical.

This form was sent automatically to me and not requested, but would appreciate being pointed in right direction to get assistance to complete it please.
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Comments

  • Lasian_Alumni
    Lasian_Alumni Member Posts: 659 Pioneering
    Hello @Rosehearty

    I'm sorry to hear about the problems you have had regarding your benefits, and the anxiety it has caused you. 

    Hopefully one of our community members can offer some advice, and maybe contacting your local Citizens Advice could help?
  • Bexa
    Bexa Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Is the form asking about your income between now and 2012? and or about your health conditions? 

    I reckon they are checking to see if you should been paid more, especially, if it's mainly asking for information about your finances? 
    Maybe checking for any other income, benefits, savings to see if DWP owe you a big fat lump sum,! 

    This ESA error business is new. If the form is not  straightforward, be best to see either a) specialist Welfare Rights Adviser or b) a CAB Advisor. 

    CAB have a lot of info on their website. Including a step by step  guide to completing the PIP form. So first have a look on their website. There's an online chat available with a CAB Advisor which might help. If not enough, they'll suggest you go in. 

    This should be about obtaining information to calculate, if you were underpaid. Then paying you a big lump sum!

    DWP can be sneaky. But them trying to query the current claims, of the same people, they underpaid by mistake, wouldn't look good. 

    I was changed over from ICB to CB ESA in the dame year. I'm hoping to get a letter from them as I'm desperate for a few bob! I can't cope with paperwork from them either! 

    Best of luck, fingers crossed,
  • Rosehearty
    Rosehearty Member Posts: 13 Listener
    Second week in September 2012 for me, so having to get lots of old paperwork out now to find original letter from them showing my benefit breakdown.  So hope you get your form very soon Bexa.
  • Bexa
    Bexa Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Hi Rose, 

    So THAT's what they're asking YOU for? Surely, THEY should have kept copies? What if you hadn't kept it? 

    I'm a paperwork hoarder, since 2005. That year, I was strongly persuaded to shed, my bank a/c statements. I'd kept all from the beginning. 

    Later when, the PPI misselling claims emerged realised I'd lost 10s of thousands. Because if I'd kept those statements. I could have proved and claimed 20 yrs worth back, instead of 6/7 yrs!

    Lets know how you get on, if you don't mind? 

    Bexa
  • Rosehearty
    Rosehearty Member Posts: 13 Listener
    Just found a letter dated 15/6/2015 saying they had not paid my Christmas bonus for 3 years lol.

  • Rosehearty
    Rosehearty Member Posts: 13 Listener
    Also a decision letter from 5/12/2013 telling me I was able to get CB ESA - £106.50 per week.

    Living Expenses £71.70 and Extra money for being in support group £34.50, and £5 deducted for child support.  I am wondering how I managed back then, and even now on £109…...
  • Rosehearty
    Rosehearty Member Posts: 13 Listener
    Bexa said:
    Hi Rose, 

    So THAT's what they're asking YOU for? Surely, THEY should have kept copies? What if you hadn't kept it? 

    I'm a paperwork hoarder, since 2005. That year, I was strongly persuaded to shed, my bank a/c statements. I'd kept all from the beginning. 

    Later when, the PPI misselling claims emerged realised I'd lost 10s of thousands. Because if I'd kept those statements. I could have proved and claimed 20 yrs worth back, instead of 6/7 yrs!

    Lets know how you get on, if you don't mind? 

    Bexa
    Oh, the paperwork search is just for me as I cannot remember if I was on income support or incapacity benefit.
  • Bexa
    Bexa Member Posts: 5 Listener
    If you can't find it.....

    On DWP website, somewhere, theres a freedom of request form 2 request info on all your benefit claims.

    Complete and  ✓ the box beside all or the specific benefit you want. 

    It goes back as far as Supplementary Benefit! Not sure how long it takes but should say. 

    Can you figure out the error from the form? 

    Bex
  • Rosehearty
    Rosehearty Member Posts: 13 Listener
    Update....

    They increased my benefit payment with the enhanced premium of £15.90 but...
    I have just received a payment into bank appox £2000.
    This does not even cover backdated shortfall from 2012 which is what they have just sent the Esa3 to me for, so no letter yet, how do I get the rest that they have not paid me?

  • Rosehearty
    Rosehearty Member Posts: 13 Listener
    This has been dealt with in 4 weeks btw.
  • allrog
    allrog Member Posts: 3 Listener
    Hi
    I'm new here. I'm in exactly the same situation, being underpaid when automatically migrated from incapacity benefit to esa. The problems stem from dwp not assessing those who were moved to contributory esa (based on ni contribution record) for eligibility to a further means tested top up.
    The dwp have stated that they are rectifying situation and there is no need for individuals to contact them, so it's very pleasing to hear from someone who has actually been contacted. I haven't as yet and am about to contact dwp . Is anybody else in a similar situation? 
    Ally
  • Rosehearty
    Rosehearty Member Posts: 13 Listener
    Just received my letter today, they say payable only from 21st October 2014to 1st January 2018...

    So nothing received from 2nd Jan 2018 until last week, and nothing for 2012 to 2014. Grrrrrr
  • CockneyRebel
    CockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,216 Disability Gamechanger
    I believe there is some sort of action going on with the DWP not paying before 2014
    If I can find the details I will post unless a more learned member can enlighten

    CR
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • Rosehearty
    Rosehearty Member Posts: 13 Listener
    Thank you, I should have received over 4k not 2k grrrr.

    I have been holding on phone now for 45 mins, no answer.
  • CockneyRebel
    CockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,216 Disability Gamechanger
    This from DRUK

    04 January 2018

    The DWP is contacting around 75,000 claimants who may have been underpaid employment and support allowance (ESA) following their transfer from incapacity benefit.

    ESA was introduced in 2008. In 2011 the Department began reassessing people claiming pre-existing incapacity benefits to see whether they were eligible for ESA. The previous benefits included incapacity benefit, severe disablement allowance and income Support.

    In a written statement to the House of Commons, Secretary of State for Work and Pensions David Gauke has confirmed that in 2013 he was made aware of individual cases which were transferred in error to contributory ESA, rather than to income-related ESA,

    In these cases, incapacity benefit claimants had an unidentified entitlement to additional benefits such as the enhanced disability premium. These premiums are only payable to those on income-related benefits.

    From 2014 additional DWP guidance was put in place to ensure all claims transitioning from that point forward were more fully assessed for both contributory and income-related ESA.

    At the time officials did not identify the need to explore the potential impact of the earlier error. This was reconsidered in the light of analysis following the preliminary Fraud and Error statistics published in May 2016.

    As a result of a sampling exercise, the DWP estimates that around 75,000 claimants may have been underpaid - about 5% of those people who moved over from incapacity benefits.

    In his written statement, the Minister says that the DWP has established a special team to begin contacting all claimants it believes may be affected and that –

    “There is therefore no need for individuals to independently contact the department on this matter. Once an individual is contacted and subject to establishing the relevant information, we expect to make a decision on each case and repay the appropriate arrears within 12 weeks. The Department expects to complete the review and correct cases during the course of 2018/19.”

    However, he then adds that –

    “This relates to a specific group that transferred to contributory ESA between 2011 and 2014, for which applicable underpayments will now be corrected and paid. Arrears are payable to those who qualify from 21 October 2014 following an Upper Tier Tribunal ruling in the case of LH v SSWP on that date. Under Section 27 of the Social Security Act 1998, when a tribunal establishes the meaning of a legislative provision, payments of arrears which pre-date the tribunal ruling are barred.”

    DR UK’s Welfare Rights Adviser Ken Butler said –

    “The DWP’s belated recognition of the scale of this problem is to be welcomed and its commitment to begin a review to identify those claimants who were affected.

    However, given that the DWP admits it knew of the problem back in 2013 and that income related ESA was rightly payable, it is unacceptable for it to limit ESA arrears back to October 2014.

    Hopefully, this stance will be overturned by a future Upper Tribunal. In the meantime, those disabled people denied full ESA arrears should consider formerly challenging that decision.”

    The Minister’s written statement is available @ http://www.parliament.uk/business/publications/written-questions-answers-statements/written-statement/Commons/2017-12-14/HCWS356/

             




    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • Rosehearty
    Rosehearty Member Posts: 13 Listener
    edited February 2018
    Well, they are the ones who contacted me, and they put 2012 on my ESA3 form, so I think they should pay me from the date they put on the form.  Because they have told me they are reassessing me from that year.  They put me in hardship .and should pay all the arrears. I will contest this, and will phone again tomorrow, hope someone picks up their phon.

  • allrog
    allrog Member Posts: 3 Listener
    Hi
    It's encouraging to hear from someone who has been contacted by dwp. 
    Wasn't there a ruling about only backdating to 20 14?  I'll check this out.
    Do you mind me asking what your additional esa was comprised of? 
    Was it additional premiums etc? 
    Thanks
    Ally  



  • butterflies
    butterflies Member Posts: 29 Courageous
    I am one of these claimants who was migrated from IB to CBESA Support Group and did not receive the Enhanced disability Premium from October 2012.
    The arrears were backdated to 21 October 2014.  I have appealed their decision after MR was refused.

    It was an Official Error by the DWP.  The DWP have known about the Official Error from as early as 2013.

    If anyone is interested.....
    Here is a thread on Rightsnet that has been active since February 2014 and over 100,000 views which gives you an idea of the scale of the problem!

    https://www.rightsnet.org.uk/forums/viewthread/5928/

    Post number 197 dated 25.1.2018 gives a good overview of what UT Case the DWP are using to limit the payment of arrears before the 21 October 2014!

    What should have happened in 2012.......
    An ESA3 form should have been sent to claimants at time of migration but this did not happen.
    Claimants should have been assessed at the time of IB Migration for eligibility for IRESA...this did not happen.  Hence people losing out on EDP and SDP.

    Up until recently i.e. November 2017.  Claimants were being paid arrears back to the migration date.

    The DWP are using the UT Case LH(known as the lead case) as an "Error in Law"
    to limit backdating of premiums owed to claimants to the 21 October 2014.

    Hope this is of help




    When Life Gives You Lemons Make Lemonade
  • Rosehearty
    Rosehearty Member Posts: 13 Listener
    I received a letter today and my mandatory reconsideration has been refused.
  • butterflies
    butterflies Member Posts: 29 Courageous
    Hi @Rosehearty
    Yes this is their usual reply now.
    You can now put in an appeal using this form(attach a copy of your letter you used to DWP for your MR).
    Here's a link to the form.....
    https://formfinder.hmctsformfinder.justice.gov.uk/sscs1-eng.pdf

    You can do a paper appeal no need to attend Court.
    It will take months to be heard but hopefully if enough people appeal it will help.

    If you haven't already ring your Local Welfare Rights Officer and direct them to the Rightsnet thread in case they are unaware of this particular DWP Error!

    Let me know if you need more help  :)








    When Life Gives You Lemons Make Lemonade

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