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Failed pip assessment...is a reconsideration the same thing as a mandatory reconsideration?

minnieme2018minnieme2018 Member Posts: 5 Listener
edited February 2018 in PIP, DLA and AA
So far this year I’m supposed to have had two pip assessments at home. The first capita didn’t attend and when my friend rang she was told to ring back in 24 hours however they rang a couple of hours and left a message on my phone (I only answer to people I know) asking for me to ring them. My friend again rang to be told the assessor had left the company and the appointment had been cancelled so another would be made. 

The second assessmemt the assessor is claiming to have attended but apparently I didn’t cooperate. No one knocked on my door from an hour before my appointment to an hour after. My friend was here with me the whole time. Capita had told us once they were an hour late to carry on about our day as normal and ring in 24 hours which was when we got the info about the assessor saying they had attended. 

While led on the phone to capita my friend filed a complaint with their customer relations department, about both failed attendances. Don’t expect anything to come from it but hey ho. 

She he was told to phone the dwp about my claim. The person who answered the phone there said all she could do was make notes about what my friend was saying as to why capita returned the claim as uncooperative and ask that a case manager would reconsider it. She was very specific using the word reconsider multiple times which made me assume they have a decline pip due to  being uncooperative on my file and this would in fact be asking for a mandatory reconsiderion meaning my Dla which is due to end in March will be stopped and I’ll have to wait who knows how long going through  the stress and hassle of appeals process. 

Capita and dwp have now been aslked to complete a paper based assessment instead but I’m not clear what this involves?  I’ve been lucky enough up to now that my esa medical last year was the first I’ve had to have for any disability benefit in the years I’ve been claiming.  

Replies

  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering
    Hi minnieme2018,

    A paper-based assessment means that they will be making a decision on your entitlement on the evidence they already have and won't be seeing you face to face. Whether this is good or not depends on whether they have gathered any further evidence such as a report from your GP or any other medical professionals who are involved with you. 
    Generally if you fail to attend an assessment (I know you didn't) Capita will send it back to the DWP and PIP will be refused, but it sounds as though in your case, although they seem to have decided to do that to begin with they are now doing a paper-based assessment to determine entitlement. You'll just have to see what happens next and what decision you receive. Good luck!

    Lee


    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • minnieme2018minnieme2018 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    My friend has requested they do a paper assessment instead as it’s capita who have failed to turn up twice. Other than that it’s  been returned to the dwp who said a case manager has to decide about a reconsideration I don’t know what’s happening. 
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering

    Hi @minnieme2018

    from what you write, I too am not clear on why the decision is being described as a reconsideration, and not simply a decision.

    possibly a decision was made about the purported 'uncooperative' ending of the assessment, but that this mistaken decision has now been 'reconsidered' in order to enable the paper assessment.

    In answer to your question - any instance where the DWP looks again at their own decision with a view to changing it is a 'reconsideration', and the fact that some of these are a 'mandatory' part of the appeals process is by the by. It seems unlikely that a Mandatory Reconsideration in the appeals sense has happened, as you haven't had a substantive decision to challenge...

    Let us know how you get on!

    Kind regards,

    Mary


    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • minnieme2018minnieme2018 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    My friend spoke to a dwp case manager today, they’ve not made any decision on whether to disallow my reasons for not turning up for the second appointment capita didn’t bother to show for but it sounds very likely my dla will be stopped because capita gave a description of my house...all of said description is visible on google street view.  So far no decision has been made and they will write when they have. If they allow my “excuse” then they will send it back to capita who will be the ones to decide whether paper based or insist on another appointment. 
  • thgunthgun Member Posts: 10 Connected
    Hi just received a copy of my PIP assessment and they have lied,  falsefied what I said When I was aked if I needed suppervision or promoing for the activities in the daily living component such as cooking , dressing etc I said I needed to be promptedon all except toileting needs or it doesn't get done,  they have ticked I can do all these unaided that' s a lie.Due to my mums age she rings me and reminds me my boyfriend does too. They have also said that I had no support at the assessment. This is true as I have no support worker due to cuts in servises and as my Boyfriend does not live with me he cannot speak on my behalf. He came to my last assessment and they would not listen to him. I even tried asking the assessor to read the letter that I got from winning the appeal last time regarding how my condition limits me but she said I'm not hear to read letters I'm hear to assess you. I think its time I write to my MP and course  stink. I was calm and relaxed they said,  like hell I was. But she could not see that or was told not to. Because I had no cognitive or learning disability,  was not under fed or look neglected they don't see me as having a mental health problem. Also they said I only take my meds twice a month. I take someb meds as and when but antidepressants are taken daily. There trying to make me kill myself I have tried to in the past and also self harm. Then they can say he's dead but we got him of benefits.




  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering
    Hello thgun

    You can challenge the PIP decision.  You must first request a Mandatory Reconsideration.  It is best to make this request in writing stating the date of the decision and why you disagree with it.  If you can, get medical evidence e.g. from your GP to support your request.  The medical evidence however needs to be specific to the PIP descriptors.  This request must also be lodged within 1 month of the date of the PIP decision letter. 

    You also mentioned speaking to your MP.  This maybe a good idea as then an MP can see the distress caused by PIP medical assessments and the effects of the decision subsequently made after a medical assessment. 

    Good luck.

    Maria
    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • minnieme2018minnieme2018 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Apparently my claim has been disallowed and a letter was sent (not yet received) on the 20th February....we’ve spoken to them twice since then and not been given that information before. 

    Do so I start over with a new application or start an appeal? 
  • susielockettsusielockett Member Posts: 53 Courageous
    I had a home assessment done for P.I.P around October last year and got refused it. I put in a mandatory appeal with the C.A.B.'s help and when I got a full copy of the report back and saw the lies that had been told I was more than furious. My son was present as he lives with me and couldn't believe it. The assessor said when she arrived and my son opened the door, I was smoking a cigarette with my left hand, was seen to flick ash into an ashtray and apparently I said I was smoking because I was nervous. I don't smoke! I have a none essential tremor throughout my body and apparently the tremor was not seen! She also said I had full mobility in my right arm, was seen to put it behind my back and also to use it to sit back down after she had asked me to stand and walk. I have a frozen right shoulder which I have had for many months, cannot hardly move it and have tremendous pain in it, I also have suspected fibromyalgia for which I am waiting on an appointment with rheumatology. I contacted my M.P. who is following the case and I also put in a complaint to ATOS. I received a reply from them stating that they believe the assessor. The had spoken with her and she has stated that she would not have put this on the report if she had not seen it with her own eyes. As if she is going to admit to telling lies! They have also said I can state my case in front of an appeal tribunal when I get a date! Totally disgusted that these people can get away with this especially as both these things are on my medical reports. The assessor worked off information from 2016, I offered her all my up to date info that I had in a folder next do me and she declined to look at it. Other lies had been told but I am aware it is classed as hearsay. I don't know how long I will wait for an appeal date but I am not holding my breath! Just to add that 4 weeks later I had a work capability assessment and they put me on a no work section for the next 18 months. Sorry for the rant but I cannot think of anything else I can do to make these people sit up and take notice.
  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,257 Disability Gamechanger
    Apparently my claim has been disallowed and a letter was sent (not yet received) on the 20th February....we’ve spoken to them twice since then and not been given that information before. 

    Do so I start over with a new application or start an appeal? 
    You should ask for acopy of the report (PA4)
    when you receive the decision letter you have 28 days from the date of the letter to request a mandatory reconsidration which is the first stage in the appeal process

    CR
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • minnieme2018minnieme2018 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Apparently my claim has been disallowed and a letter was sent (not yet received) on the 20th February....we’ve spoken to them twice since then and not been given that information before. 

    Do so I start over with a new application or start an appeal? 
    You should ask for acopy of the report (PA4)
    when you receive the decision letter you have 28 days from the date of the letter to request a mandatory reconsidration which is the first stage in the appeal process

    CR
    I don’t see that there will be an assessment report given that no assessment was carried out as capita did not show up. If there is one the most it can contain is the time the assessor allegedly knocked on my door and the info easily found via google street view that they used as a description of my house to prove they’d been here, However I shall be sending a request for all info the dwp have on me when I can get to the post office so if there is one it should be included. 
  • Pippa_AlumniPippa_Alumni Scope alumni Posts: 5,851 Disability Gamechanger
    edited March 2018
    Hi @susielockett, and welcome to the community. Thanks for sharing this with us, and so sorry to hear about your experience- it must have been so frustrating for you to hear that outcome. Unfortunately, I'm sure many of our community members will be able to relate and empathise too. Do keep us updated with the progress of your complaint, and let us know if we can be of any assistance.
  • susielockettsusielockett Member Posts: 53 Courageous
    Thanks Pippa, I will because I feel it is so important for our voices to be heard. I am actually quite elated today as Daniel from Coronation Street was on Good Morning talking about his tremor and it was also discussed by the resident doctor. It was so good to hear that it IS debilitating and that it IS recognised as a disability affecting your ability to do normal things and affects your working life. 
  • Neil06Neil06 Member Posts: 23 Connected
    @susielockett hi I know what your going through my assessor lied through out her report I suffer really bad with fibromyalgia I also have server anxiety and depression i put a complaint into capita round the assessor and all the lies. I am also waiting on my tribunal date has when I requested a mandatory reconsideration I was told I had 28days to get it into them on what I was appealing against and what ever evedince I had yet they had over 40pages of evedince from day one that their decision makers said their was none. I sent my paper work off to them the day after I called them they got it the following day about 6days later I get a letter dated the day after I called them to request the mandatory reconsideration turning it down sayin I did not tell them what I was appealing against and no evedince was provided. I phoned  and explained to them what was going off and told not to worry someone would still be looking at it a week later I phoned back up to make sure it was been looked at like I was told the week before to find out no one had even looked at it I told the person on the phone that it was coming up 10 days that if I new no one was going look at it I would started the ball moving on my tribunal to which I was told to send off my paper work to the tribunal this was in case the out come does not go my way but if it does I can cancel the tribunal but they was going get someone to look at my mandatory reconsideration that day or next a few days later I get a letter saying was to late for them to re look at my mandatory reconsideration and I was to apply to the tribunal I was not even given the 28 days off them to send in my mandatory reconsideration appeal I have sent off all the paper work on what I was appealing against all the evedince on my condition off all the specialist team I am under and a list times dates and who I spoken to at the DWP and a copie what was said to me off them like I said just waiting on my tribunal date now.
  • susielockettsusielockett Member Posts: 53 Courageous
    Hi Neil, Its a pain in the butt! I have been waiting for an appeal date since September last year. I have done all mine through the C.A.B. which has helped tremendously. They have all my records now at the tribunal and they have sent the records back to me now so it is just a waiting game. I hope yours goes well.
  • susielockettsusielockett Member Posts: 53 Courageous
    Well! It does pay sometimes to take it further. After seeing the lies told by the assessor at my PIP assessment, I put a complaint in about her but got a reply saying that after looking into it and speaking with the assessor, they believed what she had said she had seen! I went on to the Independent Assessment Services website, onto the feedback page and boy did I give a feedback!!! Just now I have had a letter saying that due to what I had said on there that a senior staff member will now review what I have said and that further investigation is needed. Maybe it was the fact I told them that my MP was involved and following my case? Let us see what happens now.
  • Neil06Neil06 Member Posts: 23 Connected
    @susielockett this is my 3rd time applying for PIP each time Capita have done my assessment and this is the 3rd time I have been turned down. This time I thought enough is enough and I was not backing down this time after I got the Decision Makers letter that was full of lies and then getting hold on a copie of the Capita Assessor report and seen all the lies she had put then been turned down for my Mandatory Reconsideration the day after I had called up to request one before they even got my letter on what I was appealing against and all the evedince that the DWP said their was none. I have put on the second complaint to Capita as what she as told them in her investergation she has told them total opposite to what she put in her report on me and I got a letter today from the tribunal serves saying thank you for the evedince I have sent in and that the DWP have been informed on why I am taken it to tribunal and the court is waiting on all the paper work from them just waiting now on my tribunal date. Even my local MP is involved now and watching what's going on.
  • susielockettsusielockett Member Posts: 53 Courageous
    Hi Neil, go onto the website for Capita and complain to them, make sure you put everything in there and also state how it is impacting on a day to day basis. Make them sit up and take notice. Good luck.
  • Neil06Neil06 Member Posts: 23 Connected
    @susielockett i have sent in my complaint to Capita telling them how this as now impacted me on a day to day basis and pointing out to them what she told them in her first investergation was the total diffrent to what she put in her report back to the DWP am going make sure that they sit up and take notice that am not going be bullied off them with their lies.
  • susielockettsusielockett Member Posts: 53 Courageous
    Well I have received a letter once again stating they have done as much as they could, that the assessor was upset someone had put a complaint in against her. How can they say that the cigarette I was supposed to be smoking was hearsay? Its in her report and I have medical records stating when I gave up smoking. They have now said I can take my complaint to an independent assessor or wait for my tribunal date. Surely ALL complaints should be done by someone independent?
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