PIP, DLA and AA
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Unexpected PIP Award

whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
edited March 2018 in PIP, DLA and AA
I'm new, so hello everyone.

I have been on DLA indefinite middle rate care, low mobility. 
I called DWP for a copy of the assessment - which I don't have yet, during the call I was told they had made a decision. For how long I forgot to ask.

I realise DLA and PIP are different, although the questions are pretty much the same as what the DLA asked you. But is PIP standard rate the equivalent of what was middle? Or do people feel it's the equivalent of low. Or totally unrelated?
The reason my award feels unexpected is I thought I would get standard Care and lose the Mobility because it was low before. I am going to be £80 a month worse off, but I am not going to question it or appeal. The reason, a) the stress, b) duration, this has been ongoing since December 8, c) if they look at it all again they could decide to drop me to standard.  

I wonder if the scoring system is designed to not award you points. You can only score once in a section. Obviously I am ahead of myself here because I don't know my points, but I have gone from middle care to zilch, so didn't score 8.

Anyone else lost award in one area but got higher award in the other?

My assessment lastest 1 hour 30 minutes and he was fine if anyone reads this and hasn't been yet. Four weeks wait for the decision.
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Replies

  • Pippa_AlumniPippa_Alumni Scope alumni Posts: 5,851 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @whistles, hopefully some of our community members will be able to share their experiences with you: I'm not sure on how exactly PIP compares to DLA but just from what other members have said it sounds much more difficult to gain PIP points and awards now than it was for DLA.

    If you do decide to appeal and need any guidance, do let us know. You might also want to check the online benefits calculator and also the extra money and help PIP entitles you to page, to check you're getting all the help you're eligible for.
  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,257 Disability Gamechanger
    if you feel that your award is incorrect you should challenge it
    Have a look at the B&W self test

    http://www.mybenefitsandwork.co.uk/pip/indexxx.php

    PIP standard is the equivalent of DLA middle

    CR

    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    I haven't got the assessment forms yet to see what's been written.
    But I have gone from middle care to nothing.
    Low mobility to enhanced. So it's strange either way.
    Perhaps things have changed but that's pretty drastic.
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  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,257 Disability Gamechanger
    that is a strange move . You should consider an MR. you have one month from the date of your decision letter

    CR
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    I wonder if this change will effect my ESA as I'm in the support group. They sent someone out three years ago and realised I wasn't on what I should be. 
    It's a minefield if you don't know what you don't know.
    I don't want to put that online publicly though, can I messsge an advisor?

    Thanks for the replies, this forum is so helpful.
    Do not follow me, I don't know where I am going.
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @whistles, hopefully some of our community members will be able to share their experiences with you: I'm not sure on how exactly PIP compares to DLA but just from what other members have said it sounds much more difficult to gain PIP points and awards now than it was for DLA.

    If you do decide to appeal and need any guidance, do let us know. You might also want to check the online benefits calculator and also the extra money and help PIP entitles you to page, to check you're getting all the help you're eligible for.
    Looking at that link. It looks as if the extra benefit is linked to the DLA care. 
    My concern now is I have just lost that. So I could actually lose some ESA as well.
    I will look in that forum in case someone else has experienced that. It looks to be classed as a change I need to inform them about.
    Do not follow me, I don't know where I am going.
  • caitainsleycaitainsley Member Posts: 4 Listener
    I think they cannot change you from support group ESA till you have another specific esa medical assessment. PIP and ESA are supposed to be independent. If you are a high rate mobility you would think ESA should be still support group , but nothing is logical with DWP , is it ?
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    It's not no. 
    I have never had an ESA assessment so I must be in some exempt category? 
    I know that if you get middle rate care you can get a disability premium, that's what they realised I didn't have- and I have just realised what it was for now.
    So, it must strangely be linked. 

    I think it would easier to navigate the Hampton Court maze blindfolded than understanding the complexities of the benefit system. 


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  • caitainsleycaitainsley Member Posts: 4 Listener
    edited February 2018
    Hmm I obviously know even  less than I thought! I have always had ESA assessments. You are right ... It is a maze for anyone .
  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,257 Disability Gamechanger
    ESA award cannot be changed until you completed a WCA
    Were you in receipt of any premiums ?

    CR
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    CR.
    I was on something called severe disablement Allowance on my original Income Support.
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  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,257 Disability Gamechanger
    SDP is paid as part of ESA when you receive PIP DL so this will be part of what the B******s have taken
    Please do consider challenging the wrong decision

    CR
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    Looking like I need to challenge if going to lose more than just the DL.
    The award and assessment letter isn't here yet. I wish it didn't take ten days. 


    Do not follow me, I don't know where I am going.
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    I won't challenge. It's for three years and I will be reviewed in two. I can spend time gathering 'evidence' that may or may not be taken into account.

    The more I read the report the more I realise what's gone wrong. 

    Section Four the box that says tell us about any help you or someone that's coming with you needs when you come to a f2f, I put no stairs.
    That's gone into my report as something that they can't help with as its beyond the scope of pip! 
    They asked, it wasn't part of my claim. But someone did read the forms then.

    I do think I might be one of the lucky ones though and had a nice assessor.
    He has scored me in what I said I didn't need help  and not scored me on what I said I needed help with. My condition although we get told isn't relevant was mentioned as the reason.

    The phone consultation to my gp, and ringing up to apply for the forms will have gone against me. 

    Now the immediate anger has gone I can actually look at it from their point of view and it's the % of time I need help to stay safe. I did only make myself 8 points one or twice.

    I am still a bit miffed to lose my sdp as well. I think that needs to move over and be inclusive with the dla/pip. Then you can do your sums. If that amount had been shared between low, middle and high we would know where we were. You get with care and lose without.
    I have read plans to roll out UC and they will lose the premium for new claimants. So if my area becomes UC before my next pip review I won't get it back. 

    Sorry going off topic now.  I think one of the reasons people might need to MR and appeal the pip, is because you can't live on the ESA. The cost of living is way higher than the benefits especially for those long term sick/ disabled but thrown off pip. 
    I can't cook so rely on food that's pre packaged- more expensive. Though I can cook a salad.  :)
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  • lillybellelillybelle Member Posts: 469 Pioneering
    I was on middle daily care DLA and lower mobility.
    no decision letter yet but looks like I’ve got 6points for daily living on Pip and enhanced mobility.
    therefore I too will loose money from my ESA support group.
    However the wheels are in motion before the letter arrives.
    ive contacted my local disability solutions centre and hopefully with their help will get an extra 2 points some how.
    otherwise it’s off to court.
    please do not give up without a fight and get as much help as possible
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    I will be interested to follow your progress as the time frame is similar. You should hear back soon on your award. 

    Do not follow me, I don't know where I am going.
  • lillybellelillybelle Member Posts: 469 Pioneering
    Yes, keep in touch.
    and please don’t give up.
    At least get advice and ask for MR
  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,257 Disability Gamechanger
    I might be wrong but as long as you have a current claim for ESA and PIP when you are migrated to UC you will not be considered a new claim. So if your next PIP review falls after your are migrated and you are awarded the DL component, you should be able to claim SDP.
    It may not be as simple as that but until a test case arises that is my logic

    CR
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    Yes we don't know this yet. 
    I hope UC isn't rolled out. I thought the idea was to save money and all these new benefits just seem to be costing the country money. 
    What's wrong with new claimants just going onto esa?

    I can feel like a guinea pig in the system at times.
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  • WaylayWaylay Member Posts: 949 Pioneering
    Hi @whistles! Well, congrats on your enhanced mobility, but that sucks about your daily living! Do consider doing an MR, and then an appeal. 69% of claimants are winning their Tribunal appeals. 

    Also, I agree about ESA being too little to live on, especially if you can't get to big shops and have to shop in Tesco Express, need to take taxis for mobility reasons (I just don't go many places now, including therapy a lot of the time, especially when very mentally ill), and (now) have to buy tons of meds off-prescription (I'm paying ~£45 a month for ibuprofen, paracetamol, loratidine, cetirizine, esomeprazole, ranitidine, and Rennies/Gaviscon). I'm sure there are many other issues that other disabled people face that cost more. 
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    Yes, keep in touch.
    and please don’t give up.
    At least get advice and ask for MR
    I wouldn't say i have given up. But because I scored four I need evidence to bring it up to 8.
    It's all being looked at again in two years, I can't spend a year challenging it.

    I live in warden supported accommodation with a night time live on site warden. This is where pip might be letting some people fall through the net- we don't care where you live, can you cook.

    Luckily I have this support- but it's not cheap. I am in talks with the provider about funding etc. Things need paying for, it comes out of someone's pocket. 

    I think the ( i ) in pip stands for insult. 
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  • WaylayWaylay Member Posts: 949 Pioneering
    Oh, and some specialist food (can't have lactose), and £100 a month on therapy, because NHS mental health services won't provide me anything through my service (not sick enough), or through IAPT (too sick). 
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  • WaylayWaylay Member Posts: 949 Pioneering
    Thanks @Victoriad. :) Unfortunately I can't get to Also, never mind carry stuff back on the bus. I'm limited to Tesco Express, small Co-op, or Sainsbury's Local. :/ Taxi back from Aldi = £9. Back from Asda = £8. Back from big Sainsbury's = £6. More than I'd save, alas. My partner goes by Aldi for me occasionally on his way to visit tho. 
  • WaylayWaylay Member Posts: 949 Pioneering
    Er, also = Aldi!
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  • MatildaMatilda Member Posts: 2,616 Disability Gamechanger
    @Waylay

    Have you thought about having a supermarket deliver your shopping?
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  • MatildaMatilda Member Posts: 2,616 Disability Gamechanger
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    edited March 2018
    So who is the best in terms of subsidizing an item for another.
    Depending on what you want to buy wiltshire farm food deliver meals if you can't cook at all.
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  • WaylayWaylay Member Posts: 949 Pioneering
    Hi @Victoriad , @Matilda , and @whistles ! Thanks for your comments! I do try to go shopping for a bit at a time, but 4-6 days a week I can't leave the house (highly variable pain, mobility issues due to spasms, anxiety), so I often run out. My partner grabs stuff for me from Aldi, and sometimes I ask a housemate to get me some stuff, but I don't want to ask too often - they already let me out of certain household chores (sweeping, mopping, hoovering, cleaning bathtub).

    I used to get food delivered by supermarkets, but at this point the fees are money I can't afford. :/ Sometimes I combine an order with one of my housemates, or order a lot of stuff for our house (loo roll, sponges, cleaning fluids, etc.), so I can share the fee. Since losing PIP I've had 50GBP/month to spend on food/toiletries/laundry/emergency taxis/etc. (after paying part of suspicious tax benefit back, part of HB overpayment, rent, bills, therapy fees, and buying over-the-counter meds), and it's really hard to live on when you don't have the mobility to go chasing bargains. :/

    I really want to get a granny trolley! Been looking out for them on Freecycle, etc. No luck yet. Would help a lot!

    I need my PIP. I just can't make it without it. :/
  • WaylayWaylay Member Posts: 949 Pioneering
    @CockneyRebel Have you heard about the terminally-ill man who moved from a non-UC area to a UC-area in order to get chemotherapy that would extend his life somewhat? He had to apply for UC when he moved, but assumed he'd get the transitional protection the government has been talking about. However, a) the transitional protection hasn't started yet, and b) his claim for UC was considered a new claim because his circumstances had changed (because he moved!), so he wouldn't have been eligible for transitional protection anyway. He lost both his disability premiums. He's taking the DWP to court.
  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,257 Disability Gamechanger
    Transitional protection will only happen when managed migration takes over. Any changed of circumstance like moving to a different LA and claiming HB will considered a new claim. If you move house but stay with the same LA this will not be a new claim.
    It does not seem right but nothing about dwp does.
     I hope he wins

    CR
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    My paperwork says they will do the migration over, but moving house before then would be a new claim. 
    It's an online claim as well. So haven't seen how you would supply evidence they usually want? 

    I have lost the sdp, now they are rolling out UC. Life itself is paused until they move me over!!!
    If I qualify for care in the futur I SHOULD  get the premium back.
    Imo it's unlawful and inhumane to cut a premium off someone for moving house, even within the area or days new claim !!!!!!

    I wasn't appealing the pip and with this on top I just don't have the mental energy to do anything.
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  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,257 Disability Gamechanger
    I really think you should get trained advice  from CAB or similar as the consequences could affect your finances greatly

    CR
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • whistleswhistles Member Posts: 1,590 Disability Gamechanger
    Do we have benefits advisors on here could tell me if migration is just simple change of name? 
    IS to ESA was a simple no f2f change.
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  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 6,606 Disability Gamechanger
    SDP is paid as part of ESA when you receive PIP DL so this will be part of what the B******s have taken
    Please do consider challenging the wrong decision

    CR
    She said SDA. That’s very different to SDP.
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