Employment and Support Allowance (ESA)
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ESA ADVICE PLEASE ?

LostLost Member Posts: 50 Courageous
Hi guys to cut long story short I just had Maximus assessment this Wednesday ESA advisor called me and said I did not score enough points they paid me my w weeks payment in Wednesday and told me I would get letter by end of this week I'm assuming tomorrow I will get this letter. He'd said I can ask for
MR ( Mandatory Reconsideration ) 

Small background about me. 2007 I fell off 3 story building I smashed my right ankle to peaces and snapped my left ankle in multiple places now I have pins inside and suffer from severe mobility because of it. Then in 2014 I was in severe RTC ( Road Trafic Colision ) where I was hit hard by large Lorry and I was sandwiched between 2 lorrys I had to go to 2 different hospital and I fractured my back in multiple places. On top of this I suffer from Severe Anxity and Depression. I'm taking around 25+ tablets on daily bases 

I have a letter from doctor which mentions all this I sent this off to DWP and was told I need to attend F2F assessment. I did and to my surprise I was told by ESA advisor I did not score enough points. He said I can ask for MR once I get the letter from them and I would get reply with in 10 days. Last year I had my PIP assessment and I passed, year before that I had my ESA and passed that also infact from 2007 till now I always passed my PIP and ESA.

Here are my questions. ( sorry for long post ) 

1. When asking for MR do many people actually win this as if decision maker already failed you dye to lie on the report from Maximus why would they change their mind now. 

2. When asking for MR what should I include in that letter?

3. If I fail MR I was told I can apeal that decision also and I would get my ESA reinstated till appeal is going on I would like to know if this is true first of all and if it is how much me and my wife would get as joint claim ? Shes my carer. 

4. Is it actually worth appealing MR if I fail to tribunal ? Can I just reapply for ESA instead of wasting time reason I say this I have been  getting chest pains nd it's been getting worse as well as black outs at times which is not on original ESA claim nor this was told to DWP or maximus. Or do you think it's better just to apeal to tribunal first and then if I'm not successful the reapply to ESA. Can people actually reapply for ESA if they fail at MR and tribunal ? 

Sorry for long post  it I really could use your help and advice on this please.

Thank you.
Lost

Replies

  • sleepy1sleepy1 Member Posts: 299 Pioneering
    Hello @Lost and welcome to Scope, I am not an adviser but will try and help.  It seems not many people have their decision changed at the MR stage but in order to go to appeal you have to do the MR and send in a copy of the decision letter with your appeal.  From memory I think once you have registered an appeal you will be paid the ESA appeal rate.  So the sooner that is done you will at least have some payment although it may not be the same as you had previously.

    Have you asked DWP for a copy of the report from the Maximus assessor as this will help you with the MR to point out anything you disagree with.  Also ask for the decision makers report which should identify what evidence they have considered and their reasons for stopping your claim.  It may be worth calling and asking to speak to the DM to clarify that they have actually received all the information you provided and tell them about all the other problems since your claim.  You will be told that you will get a call back in the next 24 hours.

    Hope some of that helps and if I am wrong someone with more experience will soon correct me.

    X Rosie


  • janice_in_wonderlandjanice_in_wonderland Member Posts: 265 Pioneering
    Hi @Lost

    After reading your post I'm surprised and confused why your assessor was unable to score you points - did you attend alone? 

    I am sorry you are experiencing this 

    It's really worrying what some people are going through re benefit entitlements 

    How are you doing atm?
    Are you coping? 

    JiW 
  • LostLost Member Posts: 50 Courageous
    Hi @Lost

    After reading your post I'm surprised and confused why your assessor was unable to score you points - did you attend alone? 

    I am sorry you are experiencing this 

    It's really worrying what some people are going through re benefit entitlements 

    How are you doing atm?
    Are you coping? 

    JiW 
    First of all thank you to both of you for reply. Yes I attended Face to Face alone I always have and I always passed due to so much problem so I did not think I would need to go with anyone. 

    Regards to how I am Not that great JiW I can barley move my back is killing me even with medication it still hurts really bad During the day it does get bit easy but never stops I have constant back pain day to day bases. 

    I'm just very disappointed that system is trying to screw me like this excuse my language. 

    I have been working all my life from age 12 till 2007 when I had accident I really don't need assessor to tell me I'm fit for work as money I'm getting is just helping me to survive if I was fit fot wotk I would of gone out and would of looked for job myself. 

    Im guessing they will also stop housing benefit and all this is causing me severe depressing and stress  which I really don't need. 

    What job they think I can do. If there is a job out there which involves me sitting on the couch with pillows stuffed around me to support my back and not doing much movements I will gladly do that job just make sure they will be happy some days I can't attend work  at all as I can't even get out of the bed till around lunch time due to severe pains I'm getting. 

    It is disgusting how they treat people who are really ill. 

    The funny thing is from assessor to DWP worker they can't work because they catch a cold!!! so how they exactly expect some one with severe mobility and disability to work ? 

    Thank you both for your reply. I should get my letter today and see what's been said and then do MR.
    Lost
  • janice_in_wonderlandjanice_in_wonderland Member Posts: 265 Pioneering
    @Lost

    Yes I agree re the injustice of situations 

    Do you live alone? 

    Have you got any friends/family/support worker to help you at all? Even text or tel help 

    It will eventually be resolved but no idea how long it may take 

    I hope things are resolved asap 

    Too many are affected 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    Lost said:
    Hi guys to cut long story short I just had Maximus assessment this Wednesday ESA advisor called me and said I did not score enough points they paid me my w weeks payment in Wednesday and told me I would get letter by end of this week I'm assuming tomorrow I will get this letter. He'd said I can ask for
    MR ( Mandatory Reconsideration ) 

    Small background about me. 2007 I fell off 3 story building I smashed my right ankle to peaces and snapped my left ankle in multiple places now I have pins inside and suffer from severe mobility because of it. Then in 2014 I was in severe RTC ( Road Trafic Colision ) where I was hit hard by large Lorry and I was sandwiched between 2 lorrys I had to go to 2 different hospital and I fractured my back in multiple places. On top of this I suffer from Severe Anxity and Depression. I'm taking around 25+ tablets on daily bases 

    I have a letter from doctor which mentions all this I sent this off to DWP and was told I need to attend F2F assessment. I did and to my surprise I was told by ESA advisor I did not score enough points. He said I can ask for MR once I get the letter from them and I would get reply with in 10 days. Last year I had my PIP assessment and I passed, year before that I had my ESA and passed that also infact from 2007 till now I always passed my PIP and ESA.

    Here are my questions. ( sorry for long post ) 

    1. When asking for MR do many people actually win this as if decision maker already failed you dye to lie on the report from Maximus why would they change their mind now. 

    2. When asking for MR what should I include in that letter?

    3. If I fail MR I was told I can apeal that decision also and I would get my ESA reinstated till appeal is going on I would like to know if this is true first of all and if it is how much me and my wife would get as joint claim ? Shes my carer. 

    4. Is it actually worth appealing MR if I fail to tribunal ? Can I just reapply for ESA instead of wasting time reason I say this I have been  getting chest pains nd it's been getting worse as well as black outs at times which is not on original ESA claim nor this was told to DWP or maximus. Or do you think it's better just to apeal to tribunal first and then if I'm not successful the reapply to ESA. Can people actually reapply for ESA if they fail at MR and tribunal ? 

    Sorry for long post  it I really could use your help and advice on this please.

    Thank you.
    Lost

    Only 20% of MR decisions are successful, you have more chance at Tribunal if you appear in person.

    Ring DWP and ask them to send you a copy of the assessment report, this will help you write the MR letter. In the letter you need to state what you disagree with and what group you think you should be in and why.

    Your ESA money will now stop and you have 1 month from the date of the decision to request the MR. If that fails it Tribunal, once the Tribunal accept your appeal you can then go back onto assessment rate for ESA. Joint money for this is £114 ish per week.

    Yes it's 100% worth taking it to Tribunal. If you re-apply you can only do this for a new condition, or a worsening of an existing condition. Also by re-applying if your eventually placed into the WRAG the new rules will apply to you. This means that your joint ESA money will be £114ish per week and will stay at that rate even when placed into the WRAG. Since April 2017 they changed and all new claimants that are placed in the WRAG will not be paid any extra money.

    If you fail at MR and Tribunal you can only re-apply for a worsening of an existing condition or for a new condition.

    If you now apply for JSA while you wait for the MR decision be careful because if your area is a full Universal Credit area then you won't be able to apply for JSA it will have to be UC. If you apply for UC then you'll never be able to go back onto ESA. You can check what's in your area by popping your post code into this link here. https://ucpostcode.entitledto.co.uk/ucdate

    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • LostLost Member Posts: 50 Courageous
    Hi Poppy 
    I can't apply for JSA as they keep telling me I'm entitled to ESA so looks like I will have to wait for MR and hope they will be dissent human being and see the problems I have and reinstate my ESA. 

    IF not I will be asking for full report to appeal with tribunal. 

    Hi Janice 
    I have a wife who is my carer and I hsve 3 year old son and 2 year old son. They are the only family I have. 

    Once I get letter today I will send it back and cross my fingers they will reinstate my ESA as this us just causing me more stress that I don't need  :/ 
  • janice_in_wonderlandjanice_in_wonderland Member Posts: 265 Pioneering
    I'm pleased you have a family @lost - many on their own really do suffer and it is too much for people to cope with 

    I feel worse bc I have been struggling alone for far too long - nobody sees ppl when hiding away with invisible symptoms 

    I wish you the best of luck getting it sorted it out 
  • LostLost Member Posts: 50 Courageous
    Ok guys I just received my ESA65 they scored me 0 points on everything which is ridicules. I don't even see point face to face as everything I told her was mot even put there. How can someone move around 200 meters in interview room with severe mobility issues ? How can I pick things up with fractured back in multiple places now can they score me 0 points for sitting for 1 hour where whole interview was about 45 minutes. 



    I also included picture of medication I had to pick up yesterday. 

    This people who do assessment should be prosecuted and they are lowest if the low for not even writing remotely truth about things that was said. 

    How can someone be this disgusting? 

    How can she score me 0 points with severe mobility issue and fractured back in multiple places doctor and PIP assessor both said I hzvemobility issues and fractured back 

    But Maximus assessor thinks she can lie this much. 



    Ok guys can I please get help for template I can use to ask for MR please ?

    Thank you.
  • janice_in_wonderlandjanice_in_wonderland Member Posts: 265 Pioneering
    @Lost

    The majority of people are experiencing the same so none of this surprises me and I'm sure others will agree 

    I suggest asking a benefits advisor who will probably have more up to date knowledge and experience or your nearest law centre  

    Re 200 meters its probably the distance in/out of the room & venue that's been taken into consideration 

    Assessors are known for their misconstrued answers and notes 

    If you follow posts you'll realise how others are going through the same stressful journey 

    I call it virtual manslaughter particular for those suffering from invisible illnesses 

    I hope you get the answers you expect... best of luck 
  • LostLost Member Posts: 50 Courageous
    @Lost

    The majority of people are experiencing the same so none of this surprises me and I'm sure others will agree 

    I suggest asking a benefits advisor who will probably have more up to date knowledge and experience or your nearest law centre  

    Re 200 meters its probably the distance in/out of the room & venue that's been taken into consideration 

    Assessors are known for their misconstrued answers and notes 

    If you follow posts you'll realise how others are going through the same stressful journey 

    I call it virtual manslaughter particular for those suffering from invisible illnesses 

    I hope you get the answers you expect... best of luck 
    Do you have link or ruff guid to Template I should use when asking for MR? Please.
  • LostLost Member Posts: 50 Courageous
    Does anyone have a link or Template I can use to ask for MR please ? 

    Thank you 
  • sleepy1sleepy1 Member Posts: 299 Pioneering
    Hi @Lost hope you are okay after reading that shocking assessment.  I have been having a hunt for a template as I am sure there will be one somewhere, the main site I found that had one listed is down for the weekend due to maintenance.  And I think the Scope benefit advisers will be harder to get hold of atm than during the week.

    During my search I did happen to come across (see link below) which seems to be a guide to how they do the assessing and may be of some help.  If I were you I would call and ask to speak to the DM on Monday to ask what information they have used and as Poppy said be careful before putting in a new claim.

    file:///C:/Users/user/Downloads/WCA_outcomes_v0.1.pdf

    There has been a recent debate in the house of commons about the way assessments are being carried out and the changes that need to be made, I have posted this on another thread but will dig it out and post the details on here for you to have a look at.

    Chin up, hugs Rosie
  • sleepy1sleepy1 Member Posts: 299 Pioneering
    file:///C:/Users/user/Downloads/WCA_outcomes_v0.1.pdf
  • LostLost Member Posts: 50 Courageous
    edited April 2018
    sleepy1 said:
    file:///C:/Users/user/Downloads/WCA_outcomes_v0.1.pdf
    Link still not working can  you please upload it to Google drive or any free file hosting site please -( 
    .Thank you for your help.
  • sleepy1sleepy1 Member Posts: 299 Pioneering
    Sorry dont know how to do that but just came across this site ........right hand 4th down
  • janice_in_wonderlandjanice_in_wonderland Member Posts: 265 Pioneering
    OK but what happens if @lost's MR is accepted? 

    This is beginning to become increasingly common since investigations have been made following so many complaints against assessors 

    If someone on ESA is put into a support group then what happens after that? 

    Will they receive a letter stating how long for or? 
  • tommtomm Member Posts: 231 Pioneering
    edited April 2018
    The Form what Lost has been sent is the DWP decision makers score sheet, esa65 following an FFW decision,  You need the  ESA85 HCP's report they send to the DWP
    @Lost can i ask you how far from your home was the venue for the maxi farce F2F wca, and how did you get there, public transport or private car /taxi,? Also what was the total journey time in either direction door to door including and time spent waiting for trains/buses also was the Maxifarce venue on the ground floor or an upper floor?
    These are  or can be used against you by the Maxifarce goon conducting the interrogation  assessment especially where you are claiming to have poor mobility (you can be unwittingly scoring an own goal) 

    1, Always insist on the WCA being Audio Recorded (all cases)
    2, If the venue isn't on a ground floor then request they offer a different venue on the ground  floor, (if you suffer from poor mobility) they have a duty of care, also fire regs come into play
    3, if the venue is more than 90mins journey time in outward or inward direction using public transport ( door to door ) and different times of day have to be considered too, or would take more then 60mins by private car/taxi , Then they by their own rules say that they are supposed to offer a pre-booked taxi each way, or a home visit,
    but a letter from the GP or other HCP explaining why for instance you could not use public transport  to travel to the WCA  or why a home visit is required  can be more persuasive Hv'S can also be audio recorded
    Remember to treat them with the same contempt they will treat us with given half a chance
    Does your local  CAB  or welfare rights service offer an outreach service,? some still do,  i would be seeking their advice  once you have requested the MR and maybe even started the Tribunal process,depending how soon you can see a benefits adviser ,  Also your GP should have all the reports from the hospital consultants  that treated you ,asking for copies of these and, sending in a copy of each retaining a copy for your self always
  • LostLost Member Posts: 50 Courageous
    edited April 2018
    Hi Tomm 
      Venue was on ground floor I made sure of that venue was 30 mins in  total about 15 mi it's to get there and 15 mins to get back I was taken there by my wife. Her report does not make sense in description she does put I have poor mobility but on scoring sheet she scored me 0 on everything she also lied most way trough it and said things which are simply untrue. I'm currently writing out letter for MR and will post that letter for advice from members here to see if I should change anything in my request for MR. My PIP assessment letter which was done last year was never mentioned as well as my doctors letter which clearly states my issues they never mentioned any if the medications I'm taking which is almost impossible for me to even function normally.

    Once I finish this letter I will post it on forums for members opinion if I should change anything or if it's good enough for me to send it on Monday signed for. 
  • sleepy1sleepy1 Member Posts: 299 Pioneering
    Tell them your experience.

    https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201719/cmselect/cmworpen/829/829.pdf 

    All correspondence should be addressed to the Clerk of the Work and Pensions Committee, House of Commons, London SW1A 0AA. The telephone number for general enquiries is 020 7219 8976; the Committee’s email address is [email protected]

  • LostLost Member Posts: 50 Courageous
    sleepy1 said:
    Tell them your experience.

    https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201719/cmselect/cmworpen/829/829.pdf 

    All correspondence should be addressed to the Clerk of the Work and Pensions Committee, House of Commons, London SW1A 0AA. The telephone number for general enquiries is 020 7219 8976; the Committee’s email address is [email protected]

    Thank you this will come really handy. I have already started to read this. :-) 
  • Aj1234Aj1234 Member Posts: 3 Listener
    I am new to this site,

    Just to let everyone know I had problem with  dwp esa. I went over everything in the report and wrote next to them what was wrong . They made up all figures on the report , they did not do any  examination

    on the day in question and made up figures  which I  reported to them they faked the report , I recived a letter from them medical centre saying they did in error, and they where sorry this happened  2 times . They tried to send me to the job centre I said no got a doctor certificate said it was no good I caused them so much pain. 

    They did me another medical which says long term in march. Im still fighting them this time with a judge they have contacted the judge trying to stop him reading it, lol

    I was told by dwp staff they are getting everyone of ill or not .


    I wrote to dwp complaint getting them yo investigate there staff

    A judge has all the proof and is looking at them know I wrote to the CEO of dwp Richard West I have his private email and Marko pierleoni CEO of the medical centre. 

    The medical people did final give me a another medical and listen to everything I said and made sure it was a high standard. 
    I have telephone number if you want to get your report checked
    Don't take there answer fight for your self
    We are here to help you. Don't give up go to court .

    I have been signed of for life with my company barclays  and industrial injury, for life  and also dla . Yet they do what they want because people are letting them , I know everyone feels ill but why let these people  win they are going to put us in hospital or in the grounds fight stand up for your life.

    I have just been told I'm being transferred to pip .it al, start again. I will never give up .my life is very important to me and also my health.



  • Aj1234Aj1234 Member Posts: 3 Listener
    Reading the points scheme get all your reports from every benefit you have been on this is free  ,

    Some people have been put in the support group with no points on esa
    Check all reports if nothing  has changed proof it get copy and Mark your report if you require address or telephone number  let me know 
  • LostLost Member Posts: 50 Courageous
    edited April 2018
     Can you please PM me DWP Richer West emal address please ? This will be very handy and is he any good to soeak to ? Im in sommilar situation None of the physical activity was carried out and I was scored 0 points because it says I .can walk 200 meters with or with out crutches. Yeat I have PIP assessors report which said I can walk no more than 20 meters aided or unaided to go with that I have doctors letter which said I have severe mobility issue as well as fractured back in multiple places suffering from severe anxiety and depression. 

    It also said I have had no black outs past 1 month this is also un true I told examiner I have been suffering from blackouts and doctor has refered me to cardiologist due to this and severe chest pains. Which I have letter for yeat in report it says I don't suffer from this. 

    And last one which I taught was funny fact that it says I can behave in such  manner which will be acceptable at work. How can they score me any points for this. 1. This test was never conducted. 2. I have not worked since 2007 so how can they score anything on this ? 


    I have written 5 pages with what I disagree with as well as explanation why I disagree with it. Just waiting for Deb to go over it for me before I send it to ESA MR team.

  • Aj1234Aj1234 Member Posts: 3 Listener
    You have a great case contact 0113 232 7025 and tell them  to investigate, your report this is medical services customer relations tell them you are also writing to Marko pierleoni the CEO. I have pit the address on  my post 
    Inform the M r team you are willing to go to court.
    And you are going to contact Richard West CEO of dwp if you don't get a respectable answer
    .
  • sleepy1sleepy1 Member Posts: 299 Pioneering
    Tell them your experience.

    https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201719/cmselect/cmworpen/829/829.pdf 

    All correspondence should be addressed to the Clerk of the Work and Pensions Committee, House of Commons, London SW1A 0AA. The telephone number for general enquiries is 020 7219 8976; the Committee’s email address is [email protected]
  • LostLost Member Posts: 50 Courageous
    Aj1234 said:
    You have a great case contact 0113 232 7025 and tell them  to investigate, your report this is medical services customer relations tell them you are also writing to Marko pierleoni the CEO. I have pit the address on  my post 
    Inform the M r team you are willing to go to court.
    And you are going to contact Richard West CEO of dwp if you don't get a respectable answer
    .
    Thank you AJ please check your PM.
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