PIP, DLA and AA
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Hearing Aid and PIP

AFBAFB Member Posts: 64 Courageous
Hi I've had applied for pip in sept of last and when I attended the interview and awaited the decision I was awarded 8 points but when I applied to the tribunal the decision maker write in the report that you must be deaf in two ears and have a hearing aid both ears to qualify for communicating aid points but I'm only deaf from the right ear and wear a hearing aid and without the hearing aid I cannot hear properly so is the DWP being discriminating towards my condition. 

Replies

  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,258 Disability Gamechanger
    If your hearing in your left ear is unimpaired then I would be suprised if you scored points, usually two hearing aids are needed to meet the PIP descriptor

    CR
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • AFBAFB Member Posts: 64 Courageous
    Thanks for the advice. @CockneyRebel
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    AFB said:
    Hi I've had applied for pip in sept of last and when I attended the interview and awaited the decision I was awarded 8 points but when I applied to the tribunal the decision maker write in the report that you must be deaf in two ears and have a hearing aid both ears to qualify for communicating aid points but I'm only deaf from the right ear and wear a hearing aid and without the hearing aid I cannot hear properly so is the DWP being discriminating towards my condition. 

    For PIP that is how they see it. I went to an assessment a couple of years ago and because I had forgotten to buy some new batteries I only had one hearing aid in place. The assessor wanted to check that I had the two in place as per the evidence that they had been prescribed by the hospital. Because I only had one in she said that the hearing in the other ear was fine and awarded me 0 points for just using one.
  • pigeon55pigeon55 Member Posts: 116 Courageous
    I have earing aids to both ears and have been diagnosed with tinnitus yet I recived no points in my pip assessment or in reconsideration report. Is this correct.
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    I have always believed that telling the truth is the way forward.
    Telling the assessor that you drive a Motability car -  https://www.motability.co.uk/cars-scooters-and-powerchairs/search/bmw-2-series-218i-sport convertible -715930?
    And you only have one hearing aid.

    On the other hand there will be some that deny driving telling the assessor that the wife does it all. Not needing any hearing aids, but buy a pair off ebay - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UK-2x-Mini-Digital-Invisible-Hearing-Aids-in-the-Ear-Best-Sound-Voice-Amplifier/223067508157?hash=item33efdc0dbd:g:lBcAAOSw7P5bUGD~:rk:2:pf:0

    along with a walking frame to get you into the assessment centre - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Walking-Frame-Zimmer-frame-Mobility-aid/273519002492?hash=item3faf00c37c:g:3R4AAOSwJp1bfBW8:rk:5:pf:0&LH_ItemCondition=3000

    All for less that £18!!!
  • pigeon55pigeon55 Member Posts: 116 Courageous
    So have i always believed in retelling the truth. I didn't ask for my disability and certainly didn't ask for earing aids. These were prescribed after being sent for hearing tests at my local hospital. Wasn't expecting a reply like that. Correct me if I'm wrong.
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    pigeon55 said:
    So have i always believed in retelling the truth. I didn't ask for my disability and certainly didn't ask for earing aids. These were prescribed after being sent for hearing tests at my local hospital. Wasn't expecting a reply like that. Correct me if I'm wrong.
    It was a tongue in cheek comment that was not directed at you. Mind you it does go to show that if a claimant was so inclined he/she could buy this type of equipment off Ebay for a few £.
    We will never know if this actually happens although because I only had one aid in (battery failed on the other one so took it out) I didn't get any points. If I had a 'spare' off Ebay to put in I would have got the points.

  • TardisTardis Member Posts: 214 Pioneering
    Are you trying to work out a way to make a fraudulent claim yadnad?  It is surely to late for that now?
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    Tardis said:
    Are you trying to work out a way to make a fraudulent claim yadnad?  It is surely to late for that now?
    No way!! Never! 
    I was just doing a bit of blue sky thinking of the ways that you could easily cheat the system and the assessor in a claim for PIP.
    Obviously you would have to have some level of disability for it to work in the main - they were thoughts of how to make things appear different to what they really are.

    Never mind let's get back to my 'Home & Gardens'.
  • deano5278deano5278 Member Posts: 38 Listener
    I've had hearing aids in both ears and tintuitus for past 7/8 years can't live with out the  at all never got pip points at all 
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    deano5278 said:
    I've had hearing aids in both ears and tintuitus for past 7/8 years can't live with out the  at all never got pip points at all 
    Did the assessor/DWP deem them to be a choice or a need?
  • pigeon55pigeon55 Member Posts: 116 Courageous
    It was pointed out to me when I was at cab meeting that it was a discriptor on there conditions list. And was putting it in my reconsideration appeal saying it should stand for at least 2 pts.
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    edited October 2018
    pigeon55 said:
    It was pointed out to me when I was at cab meeting that it was a discriptor on there conditions list. And was putting it in my reconsideration appeal saying it should stand for at least 2 pts.
    Absolutely, the same goes for any aid - you get 2 points.
    But if it is deemed not a need but a choice that you use the aids, then you get no points.
    It's like trundling up in a wheel chair to the assessment. The assessor has to decide if you actually need the chair or you are using it as a choice. They generally do this by looking for evidence that the NHS have assessed your needs and have prescribed a chair for you. Otherwise they are cheap as chips on Ebay!

    In my case I had evidence of my hearing aids being provided (both ears) by the NHS after they had tested my hearing. unfortunately I turned up at the assessment with only one in - you only get points if you have two in!
  • pigeon55pigeon55 Member Posts: 116 Courageous
    Mine were given after hearing tests at my local NHS hospital due to tintinus and hearing lose with the medical report present at my assessment.
  • deano5278deano5278 Member Posts: 38 Listener
    @Yadnad no the asser new I needed them he did a simple test with out them in I really couldn't hear him I just left it at that n just for id get no were n it was just the system lol 
  • wilkowilko Member Posts: 2,184 Disability Gamechanger
    @yadnad, you have started something now, claimants will be arriving with walking frames, hearing aids and any other Aids they can buy off eBay or their local charity shop, to improve their chances at their PIP acessment. Imaginenation runs wild of what some people may try or do.
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    edited January 2019
    wilko said:
    @yadnad, you have started something now, claimants will be arriving with walking frames, hearing aids and any other Aids they can buy off eBay or their local charity shop, to improve their chances at their PIP acessment. Imaginenation runs wild of what some people may try or do.
    Something new? It's more than possible that it is already happening. It certainly is with the wheelchair claim.

    A guy I know doesn't get about all that well, but can still walk easily at least a quarter of a mile twice a day with his dog. Yet last year told me that he had bought a chair off Ebay and used it to get from the car to the assessment room and back for his PIP assessment.
     He claimed that he couldn't walk 20 metres and the reason for the chair was down to the waiting times to be assessed by the NHS.
     The assessor accepted this and awarded him the enhanced rate for mobility. He is now over the moon as he has recently taken possession of a mobility estate car that he uses to go further afield with his dog. 

    All of those aids aside I was wondering that if you have a full centre of dentures (upper and lower) would they be classed as an aid because without them eating would be impossible.
  • ATHOMPSON13ATHOMPSON13 Member Posts: 5 Listener

    I have just applied for PIP for my hearing loss and awaiting an assessment. I was made redundant after working for an employer for 11 years. After seeking new employment it made me realise the severity of my hearing loss and it effects me, when you nolonger work with people who support your deafness. I have two phonak hearing aids and use a Rodger Pen system supplied through Access to Work. Am I wasting my time, as I will need to take holiday from work to go the assessment? 


  • Ami2301Ami2301 Community champion Posts: 7,147 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @ATHOMPSON13 welcome to the community! Have you tried the online PIP self-test? This is only a guideline however it will give you an idea of what you may or may not be entitled to. Let us know if you have any further questions :)
    Community Champion
    Disability Gamechanger - 2019
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger

    I have just applied for PIP for my hearing loss and awaiting an assessment. I was made redundant after working for an employer for 11 years. After seeking new employment it made me realise the severity of my hearing loss and it effects me, when you nolonger work with people who support your deafness. I have two phonak hearing aids and use a Rodger Pen system supplied through Access to Work. Am I wasting my time, as I will need to take holiday from work to go the assessment? 


    Hi,

    PIP isn't about a diagnosis, it's how those conditions affect your ability to carry out daily activity based on the PIP descriptors. No one on an internet forum can tell you whether you'll be successful or not because we don't know how your conditions affect you. Did you send evidence to support your claim? They very rarely contact anyone for this.

    This link may help you understand the descriptors and what they mean. It's well worth having a read.


    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • KG100KG100 Member Posts: 178 Pioneering
    When I applied for my disabled bus pass I was told that only NHS hearing aids count, and not privately bought ones.
    I would think that perhaps this is the same for claiming PIP and getting 2 points.
    I sent PIP my hearing aid letters from my hospital consultant. 

  • KG100KG100 Member Posts: 178 Pioneering
    Buying hearing aids now is so easy and cheap, especially with Ebay and things, but it's having proof that you need them that counts for the 2 points. 
  • ATHOMPSON13ATHOMPSON13 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Hi my hearing aids are NHS as my hearing is borderline for cochlear implants. I put together a letter describing how it effects me daily. Just wondered if anyone gets PIP for hearing loss, that was all. 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    Possibly not for hearing loss itself but how it affects your functional ability then you may yes. People are affected differently by these conditions are you can't compare 2 people.  PIP isn't about a diagnosis. Have you read the link i posted above?
    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • ATHOMPSON13ATHOMPSON13 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Yes, I have already this before thank you. 
  • yanniyanni Member Posts: 42 Courageous
    @ATHOMPSON13

    I have severe - profound hearing loss and was awarded PIP  but had to go to tribunal to get it.  

    Assessors and the DWP both seem to think that hearing aids magically restore our level of hearing loss to normal hearing. Fortunately the tribunal understood that it doesn’t work like that.

    At the assessment bear in mind that the assessor will know that you can’t hear very well, they may ask if you lipread and they will speak clearly.  Also the assessment room will be quiet. If you appear to hear the assessor in this environment they seem to assume you can hear everyone in real life!

    We tend to bluff our way through communicating and pretend to understand more than we do but at the assessment you need to be very clear if you can’t understand the assessor – say ‘Can you say that again?’, ‘ What did you say?’ etc  as many times as you need to rather than trying to work out what was said. That way it should be obvious that you can’t understand what they are saying.

    Do you rely on lipreading when wearing your hearing aids? If you do it is really important to state this as lipreading is not considered a reliable way to understand verbal communication.

    Before the assessment think about what happens when people don’t know that you have hearing loss, don’t get your attention before speaking, don’t look at you when speaking, don't speak clearly, speak too fast, there is background noise etc and be prepared to explain these difficulties with some examples.

    Think about how far away you can understand people speak from – can you hear someone across a room?

    Do you ignore people because you don’t realise they have spoken to you?

     Do you have particular difficulty hearing men, women, children, the elderly?

    How do you cope when there is background noise such as other people talking, TV, music, road noise etc?

     

    Aside from the obvious problems with understanding verbal communication you could also be awarded points for:

    Activity 9 Engaging with other people

    How well you can engage with people you don’t know and in small groups? You can’t be awarded points for not being able to hear in social situations but you can be awarded points if you need prompting or social support to in order to behave in a “socially appropriate manner” and to “establish relationships”.

     I explained that I appear to ignore people because I don’t realise they are talking to me, I shout at them as I am speaking as loudly as I would need them to speak because of the background noise, I stand too close and seem to be staring at them as I need to lipread, I talk over people as I don’t realise they are speaking, I can’t join in the conversation or I get the wrong end of the stick and say the wrong thing etc none of which are “socially appropriate” and none of which help “establish relationships” so (I think) I look stupid, rude, bored or uninterested. Because of this I am reluctant to try to engage with people I don’t know and so need social support from someone I know to do so.

    Activity 4 Washing and bathing

    Points can also be awarded for washing and bathing if you would not hear a smoke alarm or someone entering your home because you have taken out your hearing aids to wash / bathe / shower. This was established by a Upper Tribunal decision but my assessor seemed not to know about this decision and wrongly tried to tell me points could only be scored if I had physical problems washing and bathing.

    Mobility activity 1

    Points can also be awarded for needing someone with you when following a familiar or unfamiliar journey. 

    Can you hear traffic approaching or do you need to see the vehicles to know they are there? 

    How do you cope crossing a road when there are obstructions such as parked cars or there is a junction, corner, hill, bend in the road, concealed exit etc?

    Do you hear bikes or mobility scooters approaching you from behind on pavements?

    Have you had near misses as you have not realised a vehicle is nearby?

    If you need to see vehicles you can argue that you can’t do this activity safely without someone else with you.

    If you got lost would you be able to ask and understand someone giving you directions?

    If the bus / train was diverted, terminated etc would you know what you needed to do to resolve the situation and carry on with your journey?


    You mention that you had support at your previous job. Would anyone there be willing to provide a statement saying the difficulties they saw you have and how they supported you? My former boss was happy to do this for me when I explained why I needed it.

    I also wrote to my NHS audiology department explaining the problems I have with understanding verbal communication and asking if they would confirm that these difficulties are reasonable with my degree of hearing loss and they sent a letter saying they were. 

    Good luck.


  • ATHOMPSON13ATHOMPSON13 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    That sounds exactly like me. I can't follow a conversation without liip reading, I can't hear from behind  so crossing the road can be tricky. I ignore people and have to do the whole I'm hearing impaired with everyone I meet. I can't tell what the satnav says so have to watch the arrows, so get lost everyday, as I drive 1800 miles a month for my job. I live in Sheffield but my employer is in Birmingham, I can't sleep in a hotel room because I don't hear a fire alarm. I can't use a telephone without the Rodger Pen system. The list goes on...... Thank you , this was very helpful. I get by, but It's not easy and costly when you can't even hear the driver on a bus or ask for directions in a train station, go swimming without a partner or even hear the cashier in the supermarket. 
  • ATHOMPSON13ATHOMPSON13 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    I have to use the government Access to Work scheme who provided me with the Rodger Pen, Rodger Pen Clip in Mic and deaf awareness training for the team. Maybe I should take along my assessment paperwork. Thank you
  • twonkertwonker Member - under moderation Posts: 617 Pioneering
    Me too!!!
    Having been deaf for a number of years it becomes second nature to finish off something that you have part heard using lip reading.
    I never thought of telling the assessor any of that and to be totally frank never thought how those descriptors could be used for being unable to hear. 
    You have identified everything that a deaf person has problems with even appearing to be ignorant towards people who I dismiss when they are trying to talk to me. Well done it ticks all of the boxes for me.
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