PIP, DLA and AA
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Pip review form evidence

shaziershazier Member Posts: 82 Courageous
edited July 2018 in PIP, DLA and AA
Hi all, Can I please ask for further advice on my pip form. The review for is the tick box easier-the same or harder. With still grieving very badly over my sons death i really cant find the strengh to concentrate on filling forms out. Im in a really bad place and im suffering with my anxiety and depression really bad. I believe that the  DWP look at your previous form for evidence on how your conditions affect you. I was awarded the enhanced rate in 2015 on both my physical and mental health. the care i receive has not changed nor has my condiotion apart from the new diagnoses last yr  of ischaemic heart disease. I still have a copy of all the evidence that was sent in by my care who i my daaughter and gp letter which states my conditons. could i make another copy of these and send them in with this new form? if my daughter writes new notes there going to same the same anyway. also, would my medical assesment from atos  be useful as evidence?
thank you for any advise in advance 

Replies

  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,856 Member
    shazier said:
    Hi all, Can I please ask for further advice on my pip form. The review for is the tick box easier-the same or harder. With still grieving very badly over my sons death i really cant find the strengh to concentrate on filling forms out. Im in a really bad place and im suffering with my anxiety and depression really bad. I believe that the  DWP look at your previous form for evidence on how your conditions affect you. I was awarded the enhanced rate in 2015 on both my physical and mental health. the care i receive has not changed nor has my condiotion apart from the new diagnoses last yr  of ischaemic heart disease. I still have a copy of all the evidence that was sent in by my care who i my daaughter and gp letter which states my conditons. could i make another copy of these and send them in with this new form? if my daughter writes new notes there going to same the same anyway. also, would my medical assesment from atos  be useful as evidence?
    thank you for any advise in advance 
    So sorry to hear that.

    I doubt very much that the DWP will help you out by going back to your earlier form and the evidence you sent in that gave rise to your current award.
    I would suggest that you treat this review as a complete new claim and send any evidence in that you think might help.

  • susan48susan48 Member Posts: 2,229 Disability Gamechanger
    @shazier,
    i understand how anxious and depressed you are after everything that’s happened recently.
    Whatever letters , evidence you have I’d copy and send it with your review form, no matter how old.

    Good luck and try to stay strong
  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,856 Member
    susan48 said:.
    Whatever letters , evidence you have I’d copy and send it with your review form, no matter how old.
    Given that the DWP state that no letter/evidence/report etc which is over 2 years old should be sent in, there is nothing stopping you in doing so. It then depends if the DWP want to dismiss it/them as to old and irrelevant with the passage of time.
  • littleruthie123littleruthie123 Member Posts: 490 Pioneering
    When I spoke too p.I. P amount my review .one adviser said send everything in no matter how old .then another said keep it short and just bullet proof answers so I can't advise .I woukd ring them I see what they say .good luck x
  • susan48susan48 Member Posts: 2,229 Disability Gamechanger
    Yadnad said:
    susan48 said:.
    Whatever letters , evidence you have I’d copy and send it with your review form, no matter how old.
    Given that the DWP state that no letter/evidence/report etc which is over 2 years old should be sent in, there is nothing stopping you in doing so. It then depends if the DWP want to dismiss it/them as to old and irrelevant with the passage of time.
    Some people have no new evidence, I didn’t so sent everything I had regradless of how old.
    I doubt very much that the DWP has the time to work out how old, within reason, your evidence is when looking at your review form.

    If they do then it’s their  call whether they take it into account. What I was actually trying to do was to help @[email protected] not add to their already anxious state
  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,856 Member
    When I spoke too p.I. P amount my review .one adviser said send everything in no matter how old .then another said keep it short and just bullet proof answers so I can't advise .I woukd ring them I see what they say .good luck x
    I was quoting from the DWP's own advice which actually appears on the claim form itself.
    To be brutally honest I don't believe that anybody in the DWP offices knows very much about anything - they seem to make their answers up.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,996 Disability Gamechanger
    Is this a review, asking whether anything has changed, or a renewal because the award has expired. I ask because each requires a slightly different approach. More on that when you answer. To be clear though. Whilst the DWP advice on evidence is absolute bobbins it’s also true to say that the more recent a piece of evidence is the more it’s lileiy to be treated as reliable.

    As ever though, PIP is not about the medical evidence. It’s about the anecdotes which accompany each claim of points scoring. So, if you got 2 points last time for prepping food that would have been based on anecdotal evidence of the need for an aid perhaps or help from another person. You’ll have been able to describe several incidents of what happened when you didn’t have the aid or other person. Since that claim, if your needs remain unchanged, you will have newer anecdotes. You need to tell those. Your most recent falls rather than the ones you described three or four years ago. That kind of thing.

     
  • shaziershazier Member Posts: 82 Courageous
    @mikehughescq. and thank you.  the form i have received is a renewal. Its asking me to tick a box, easier the same or harder. I have ticked the same as this is true. the only thing that is different to my last claim is the new diagnoses of ischemic heart this affects me if i try to get upstairs which is not very often and also affects  me when i get extremely anxious and stressed, it causes pains in my chest and i have to take a spray. its not change in circumstances i dont think  as my care needs are still the the same. Im sorry i dont want to sound stupid  but i dont know what you mean by anecdotes. The evidence i have is the ame evidence that i have already sent them, will they stil have a copy or should i send them again. my gp has given me a brief letter staing my conditions, she said if they need any information the will write to her, shes not as helpful as my gp that retired and alo doesnt know me very well.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,996 Disability Gamechanger
    You don’t sound stupid. Anecdotes are the stories which suppprt your assertions you score specific points. So, saying you fall is not evidence. It’s an assertion. Describing every last detail of the last couple of times you fell. That’s evidence. 

    A renewal is where your award has run out. So, this is effectively a new claim. Did you keep a copy of your original claim as that’s the perfect starting point (assuming it succeeded first go). They will not use the evidence from your previous claim for this one even though there’s a strong public law argument that they should. One of the reasons they don’t is because it’s a new claim abd therefore the burden of proof is on you to show entitlement. 

    What you send in terms of evidence, medical or otherwise, depends on whether it helps with a dispute. So, medical evidence helps if your diagnosis, treatment or prognosis is in dispute. It’s unlikeky to be of use on the main thing - which points should you score and why. I’d concentrate on a couple of examples for each descriptor before I worried what other evidence should go in.
  • WaterLilyWaterLily Member Posts: 55 Courageous
    I didn’t have any evidence whatsoever at my assessment. All I took with me was the medication I take. 
    I asked at the end of the assessment whether it made a difference because I didn’t bring any evidence and she told me that they ask your GP and look at your previous DLA form. 
    I was awarded standard rate mobility and standard rate care. (Previously high rate mobility and no care DLA).
    Did a MR (and still never sent any evidence with my letter) and was awarded high rate mobility and standard care. 
    🙂
  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,856 Member
    WaterLily said:
    I didn’t have any evidence whatsoever at my assessment. All I took with me was the medication I take. 
    I asked at the end of the assessment whether it made a difference because I didn’t bring any evidence and she told me that they ask your GP and look at your previous DLA form. 
    I was awarded standard rate mobility and standard rate care. (Previously high rate mobility and no care DLA).
    Did a MR (and still never sent any evidence with my letter) and was awarded high rate mobility and standard care. 
    🙂
    I have no idea why the assessor said that as it is common knowledge that very few if anybody will contact your GP.
    As for getting your DLA file out of storage to look at the evidence it may hold and what if any previous assessment had said I really do doubt that they will bother.
    The only time that you will be asked if you wanted to give the DWP permission to get hold of the DLA file is during the transition from DLA to PIP. Also, if you made a telephone call to start the PIP process off the DWP generally does not give you that option. It is only when you complete the PIP1 form instead of making the telephone call does it actually offer you that opportunity.



  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,996 Disability Gamechanger
    It depends on who you make the phone call to. DWP have conceded to stakeholders that the question should be asked every time but it probably doesn’t happen when the calls are outsourced. The problem with doing a paper PIP 1 is that you lose money as your date of claim runs from when it’s tegistered on their system rather than from when you make the phone call.
  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,856 Member
    edited July 2018
    It depends on who you make the phone call to. DWP have conceded to stakeholders that the question should be asked every time but it probably doesn’t happen when the calls are outsourced. The problem with doing a paper PIP 1 is that you lose money as your date of claim runs from when it’s tegistered on their system rather than from when you make the phone call.
    I've just read your latest submission on this topic on Rightsnet. Seems that the DWP are suggesting that the claimant should be proactive in applying for a copy of their DLA file (if it hasn't been shredded in the meantime) and submitting what relevant evidence there may be in it when sending in the PIP2 form AND not expecting the DWP to do their job for them. Failure to be proactive will only allow the DWP to argue at a Tribunal that the claimant is lazy and not really interested in putting forward a comprehensive PIP claim.

    I can't see how money could be lost unless you are suggesting that they would get a higher PIP award than their current DLA one or that we are actually talking about a new PIP claim.

    I know that I was never asked about my DLA file nor were there any questions regarding vulnerability. I only found out when I down loaded the example of a  PIP1 from the net but by then it was too late.


  • ToffeeToffee Member Posts: 250 Pioneering
    I have just been diagnosed with fibermergila anybody give advise would it be worth me applying for review I now get pip but I get 224 a month do you think it could change anythink. Am scared I might loose what I have with the way the system works 
  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,856 Member
    Toffee said:
    I have just been diagnosed with fibermergila anybody give advise would it be worth me applying for review I now get pip but I get 224 a month do you think it could change anythink. Am scared I might loose what I have with the way the system works 
    It all depends if you genuinely believe that you could achieve more points AND have the evidence to back it up.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,996 Disability Gamechanger
    Yadnad said:
    It depends on who you make the phone call to. DWP have conceded to stakeholders that the question should be asked every time but it probably doesn’t happen when the calls are outsourced. The problem with doing a paper PIP 1 is that you lose money as your date of claim runs from when it’s tegistered on their system rather than from when you make the phone call.
    I've just read your latest submission on this topic on Rightsnet. Seems that the DWP are suggesting that the claimant should be proactive in applying for a copy of their DLA file (if it hasn't been shredded in the meantime) and submitting what relevant evidence there may be in it when sending in the PIP2 form AND not expecting the DWP to do their job for them. Failure to be proactive will only allow the DWP to argue at a Tribunal that the claimant is lazy and not really interested in putting forward a comprehensive PIP claim.

    I can't see how money could be lost unless you are suggesting that they would get a higher PIP award than their current DLA one or that we are actually talking about a new PIP claim.

    I know that I was never asked about my DLA file nor were there any questions regarding vulnerability. I only found out when I down loaded the example of a  PIP1 from the net but by then it was too late.


    It’s a line being peddled in appeal subs by DWP. Appeal subs are a mix of templated paragraphs, where the author selects the nearest fit, and the compiler writing their own stuff. It’s a heady mix but also easy enough to refute by referring to DWPs own claimant journey documents to which they have also recently referred in stakeholders meetings. 

    As far as monetary losses are concerned, you download a PIP 1 on the 1st of January; get it completed by the 31st; post it on the 1st of February; DWP get it registered by say the 15th then your date of claim is the 15th of February. That is the earliest date you can get payment from.

    Alternatively, if you make a phone call to start the process on the 1st of January; get it completed by the 31st; post it on the 1st of February; DWP get it registered by say the 15th... your date of claim is the 1st of January. That is the earliest date you can get payment from.

    Spot the difference. If you were to be awarded standard rate of only 1 component that’s still a 3 figure sum you’ve missed out on.
  • shaziershazier Member Posts: 82 Courageous
    You don’t sound stupid. Anecdotes are the stories which suppprt your assertions you score specific points. So, saying you fall is not evidence. It’s an assertion. Describing every last detail of the last couple of times you fell. That’s evidence. 

    A renewal is where your award has run out. So, this is effectively a new claim. Did you keep a copy of your original claim as that’s the perfect starting point (assuming it succeeded first go). They will not use the evidence from your previous claim for this one even though there’s a strong public law argument that they should. One of the reasons they don’t is because it’s a new claim abd therefore the burden of proof is on you to show entitlement. 

    What you send in terms of evidence, medical or otherwise, depends on whether it helps with a dispute. So, medical evidence helps if your diagnosis, treatment or prognosis is in dispute. It’s unlikeky to be of use on the main thing - which points should you score and why. I’d concentrate on a couple of examples for each descriptor before I worried what other evidence should go in.
    Hi, sorry my form is a review, not a renewal.
    I have to tick boxes ( easier.. Harde... No change. Does this make a differance in how or what i write
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,996 Disability Gamechanger
    No, exactly the same.
  • shaziershazier Member Posts: 82 Courageous
    @mikehughescq thank ou so much for your advise. yes . I do have the original copy.
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