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PIP tribunal process?

nabster1973 Member Posts: 3 Listener
edited August 2018 in PIP, DLA, and AA
Hi everyone I’ve been helping my mum with her PIP appeal paperwork and Appeal to the Tribunal Service after her claim was systematically rejected and she was given a score of 0 in every single category for both independent living and mobility. Once my mums Disability Living and Mobility Allowance was withdrawn all her income stopped and she has only survived from financial support from her children and some savings she has had. I’ve drafted the Appeal and sent it in and I’m nervous and anxious as to how the Tribunal Service operates and considers these Appeals? 


  • o5jessica
    o5jessica Member Posts: 42 Connected
    Oh my, so sorry to hear this, I'm going through process pip plus care act trying to seek support I lost my mum resently all family members not available to support me ,how one to live , ?
    You so good for your mum, 
  • Chloe_Scope
    Chloe_Scope Scope Posts: 10,557 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @nabster1973 and a warm welcome to the community! Thank you for sharing this with us all! I am sorry to hear that your mum didn't get PIP. I do wish you and your mum the best of luck. A lot of community members have gone through this process so I hope they are able to offer some advice. If you need anything else then please do not hesitate to ask!

  • Matilda
    Matilda Member Posts: 2,610 Disability Gamechanger

    Try to get some f2f advice from CAB or similar, or welfare rights.

    Disability Rights UK site (DR) has a good guide to PIP appeals.  And they publish a Disability Rights Handbook that gives a detailed outline of PIP Hearings procedure.  £18.50 from DR site or probably available in your local reference library.

    The main thing to consider about hearings is that they are inquisitorial - the panel ask a lot of questions to find out what the person can and can't do.

    PIP is awarded not for conditions themselves but how those conditions affect the person's daily living and/or mobility at least 50% of the time.

    You will need medical evidence to show that your mum has conditions that can cause disabilities.  Though, depending on the conditions, this evidence need not necessarily be recent - such as if she has degenerative conditions that will never improve. 

    71% of appeals succeed.  People have gone from 0 points to enhanced both components after appeal.
  • mikehughescq
    mikehughescq Posts: 8,847 Connected
    HMCTS will now send the appeal to DWP and they will put together appeal papers consisting of the claim pack; the HCP report etc.; anything you put in and a formal submission summarising their case. Look out for the PIP 1 form. If it’s not there it should be. It’s the form which is a record of the conversion phone call and in particular whether a request was made for DLA evidence into account. If a request was made for DLA evidence to be taken into account then that should be in there too. 

    You will get an enquiry form asking wherever you’re carrying on; whether you want an oral hearing (you do); whether you have representation; and reasonsble adjustments etc. You must return it immediately (despite the fact it gives you 14 days) else you’ll be listed as a paper hearing and be done and dusted before you’ve taken a breath. 

    If the diagnosis, prognosis and symptoms are not in dispute then medical evidence will be of limited use in most circumstances. It’s better to focus on the anecdotal examples of how you score points and what happened last time you tried those points scoring activities. 

    Whilst tribunals are inquisitorial most people don’t understand the difference between appellant; witness; observer and representative and can often maje a mess of things using well meaning relatives. Check out your local Citizens Advice, independent advice centre, law centre or local authority welfare rights for free representation. Your chances of success on a winnable case are highest with a representative.
  • Yadnad
    Yadnad Posts: 2,856 Connected
    Matilda said:
    71% of appeals succeed. 
    ......only if they are legally represented. Go it alone with no representation the success rate drops to below 50%
  • nabster1973
    nabster1973 Member Posts: 3 Listener
    Hi everyone and thank you so much for your kind words and advise. I posted the Appeal to the Tribunal yesterday and the next thing for me to do is to try and find a reputable Occupational Therapist that can help me with a favourable report in respect of my mums living and mobility needs. To put u all in the loop my mum suffers from a rare blood disorder and has an operation for this and now takes blood thinning medication for the rest of her life. Her health problems are further exacerbated by the fact that she has very high blood pressure, type 2 diabetes, acute kidney disease (stage 4), hypertensive disease, angioplasty of femerol artery. Taking the medication for so many illnesses has resulted in her weight getting out o control and she is now morbidly obese with severe respiratory problems, breathlessness, fatigue, chronic pain and cramps, poor balance. She suffers from anxiety, low self esteem and depression. Notwithstanding, all these problems she was given a 0 in every assessed category regardless of the fact that the Assessor was provided all the correct medical notes and documentation wen she was in receipt of DLA. I’m absolutely shocked, disgusted and angry at the way she has been treated and left on the scrap heap. Always conservative austerity measures that effect the most vulnerable in society..
  • mikehughescq
    mikehughescq Posts: 8,847 Connected
    An OT assessment now will not help at all unless it is explicitly directed to how she was at the date of claim/date of decision. Are you going for both components? I can see the beginnings of a case for mobility but nothing you have posted would make a clear case for daily living apart from maybe points for communicating, engaging, dressing and bathing. Those are the basic areas to focus in on and describe what she can and cannot do. Give examples from as recently as you can and provide as much detail as you can. 
  • nabster1973
    nabster1973 Member Posts: 3 Listener
    Thank you MarkHughes for your advise. I have Appealed to the Tribunal for both living and mobility and I sincerely believe that we have a very strong case for both categories.

    The assessment for Personal Independent Payment (PIP) was very quick, including cursory enquiries about my mums health and an alleged observation was made regarding my mums mobility as she entered the premises.

    The Assessor showed no sincerity or humility to the Applicant or a genuine interest in her application for PIP.  The Applicant felt that the process was quick, dis-genuine, cold and calculated. The fact that my mum cannot speak or understand English, everything said by the Assessor was alien to her and the communication blurred, possibly distorted, not understood or lost in translation.

    The Applicant was accompanied by her Carer Translator but the Health Care Professional discouraged the Carer from talking or trying to help with her enquiries. The Assessor showed a complete disregard to the diversity and equality needs of the Applicant and the Carer/Translator noted that the Assessor was very matter of fact and arrogant towards my mum. 

    The Mandatory Reconsideration letter has stated by implication that the Applicant will qualify for PIP if they have a cognitive impairment that is so severe that they are effectively bed bound, registered blind or suffer from a registered mental health condition. However, what the health care professional hasn’t considered is the fact that, if my mum’s multiple health problems, symptoms and medication are collectively considered she requires that every aspect of her care is managed  and this has a severe impact on her daily living and mobility requirements.  

    The Health Care Professional considered 10 activities for the Daily Living Part And 2 for Mobility. 

    PREPARING FOOD (scored out of 8), my mum was scored a 0.                          

    All meals are prepared for my mum by her career notwithstanding, the complexity of the meal, the time or length of the meal. No risks are taken regarding my mum’s health. 

    Specifically because of the physical size of the applicant, very poor respiratory and severe breathlessness, poor balance and severe fatigue means that even the simplest of meals become impossible and a potential health risk. 

    Strength, grip and dexterity is severely impaired esp in the morning because of chronic pain and this impacts critically on mobility and motivation to do anything.  These symptoms are further exacerbated by poor blood circulation during the night which results in, "lifeless legs and arms" syndrome. Normal feeling does return with severe pins and needles and these symptoms can last up to 1-2hrs first thing in the morning. In the mornings my mum does not have the energy or motivation to get out of bed and get dressed. Everyday the carer lets herself in and physically helps my mum out of bed and helps to wash and dress her. 

    Because of these symptoms, the easiest of tasks first thing in the morning for example picking up a kettle of hot water or using the toaster are impossible to do and are in fact a serious health hazard. 

    My mum has a serious blood disorder and because of the blood thinning medication she is using blood clotting is seriously compromised.  Therefore, if she cuts herself using a knife and the bleeding cannot be controlled there is a high probability that she will be hospitalised. 

    One cannot understand why the Assessor would score 0 unless they are seriously ignorant, dishonest or if there has been a complete breakdown in communication during assessment. If the appropriate questions were asked and a proper impartial and objective assessment carried out including a proper review of the Applicants medical notes and a sincere interview with the Applicants carer it is impossible that a score of 0 could be achieved. For this category alone my mum should have scored 4+ points..

    And that is just the 1st category of the living component. 



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