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sweet said: now we have assessments for benifits and are told to supply medical evidence?which we do? we then have a hcp check us over by asking us a few questions and do a medical although it is claimed not medical such as touch your toes put arms above head bend your nexck left to right pic up a bit of paper not a medical mind exsplain how you are day to day then it is over ?? you did exsplain how you are day to day as you know how you are ?now you sit and wait in time you get your report if you asked for it but find no mention of evidence and misleading information such as you can walk with ease 500yards can mix with people can cook can count cash or use a phone??the report is fiction it is not what you or evidence stated do you say the assessment was a lie or a mistake BUT the decision maker goes on the hcp report and seldom ignors it so you are refused WHY because the hcp lied or ignored facts they can see it is not rocket science is it ??now you must prove the report was wrong who cares hcp no decision maker no ??so you are aNGRY AND STATE ASSESSER LIED NO SHE WAS MISTAKEN AS NOT accountable to anyone not even the company who employs them unless mass complaints WHAT CAN YOU DO???????????????
Yadnad said: sweet said: now we have assessments for benifits and are told to supply medical evidence?which we do? we then have a hcp check us over by asking us a few questions and do a medical although it is claimed not medical such as touch your toes put arms above head bend your nexck left to right pic up a bit of paper not a medical mind exsplain how you are day to day then it is over ?? you did exsplain how you are day to day as you know how you are ?now you sit and wait in time you get your report if you asked for it but find no mention of evidence and misleading information such as you can walk with ease 500yards can mix with people can cook can count cash or use a phone??the report is fiction it is not what you or evidence stated do you say the assessment was a lie or a mistake BUT the decision maker goes on the hcp report and seldom ignors it so you are refused WHY because the hcp lied or ignored facts they can see it is not rocket science is it ??now you must prove the report was wrong who cares hcp no decision maker no ??so you are aNGRY AND STATE ASSESSER LIED NO SHE WAS MISTAKEN AS NOT accountable to anyone not even the company who employs them unless mass complaints WHAT CAN YOU DO??????????????? And don't forget that in the space of a few minutes they can assess your mental health. Shame that the NHS can't work to that speed, it would increase through put of patients thus increasing the number of patients that can be seen in one 12 hour shift.
Username_removed said: There are a number of incorrect statements/assumptions in the original post. Claimants are not told to supply medical evidence at all. Claimants are asked to supply supporting evidence. It can be whatever you want it to be. It does not have to be medical at all and it’s often better if it’s not given that diagnosis, prognosis and symptoms are rarely in dispute. The face to face is not a medical because the person doing it is not medically qualified and it is only functional testing and observation. A medical usually involves taking clinical readings and is done by a medically qualified person. Also not all face to face consultations involve functional testing.A decision maker cannot ignore evidence. They have to weigh all evidence. There is undoubtedly a cultural issue within DWP as preference is clearly given to the contents of HCP reports even when the contents are patently ludicrous bit it’s worth noting that it’s a system that does work fine for the majority of claimants. The numbers for whom it doesn’t work are significant and far too high but it does work for the majority. I agree with the OP that the instinct to conclude that a HCP has lied is understandable but the other side of that coin is that PIP is not that hard to understand and yet most people claiming it, especially DLA conversions, don’t take the time to get to grips with the basics, and thus present their case badly in the first place. I wrote the following on a thread yesterday and I stand by it.HCPs basically have their own professional qualification and then 5 to 7 days training as a HCP which is largely generic disability awareness and learning enough about the HCP process. After that it’s all speculation as to what happens but I suspect we know enough to be able to say that some strive to do an excellent job and some are influenced by others to find shortcuts to survival. Few do the job full time as they are in quasi-medical professions where full time work is hard to come by. Many are therefore either very young and lacking life experience or struggling to get by just as much as claimants. Unless the younger ones have ill family or friends their actual life experience may not have involved impairment at all. It amuses me and makes me sad that the very empathy claimants with disabilities would want for themselves is something they rarely extend to HCPs. It is of course entirely understandable that that’s the case but it doesn’t make it right. Walking a mile in anyone else’s shoes is always an eye opener. HCPs have a difficult job made harder by poor training which inevitably means poor practice and subjectivity come into play.Forum posters love to think they’re in the majority but that’s most unlikely as we know that forums are generally full of negative stuff whether it’s like here, football, money or whatever. No-one will find a forum full of positivity on any subject. If you want that you need a blog. That’s why I despair a little when people call HCPs “liars” without a thought for the other side of the story. Careless, pressured, badly expressed and factually incorrect yes of course but out and out provable lies are rare and in any case impossible to prove without a transcription. I have also observed many times that proving someone else wrong does not make you right and doesn’t make a case for qualifying for benefit. The single strongest things you can do to sway a decision maker is to have strong anecdotal evidence of the consequences of your attempts to perform the activities in question and have absolute consistency between your claim pack and what you say at a HCP assessment. It’s interesting how many people think their claim pack was perfect when there are often huge gaps and obvious inconsistencies. There are many things which contribute to negative outcomes and the HCP is often a far smaller part of that than claimants think. They just happen to be the most visible.In terms of accountability then yes one of the flaws of the process is that the accountability of private companies is inevitably poor but a well done complaint can be very effective and reverse a HCP recommendation to a DM. However, in order to do that the complainant has to focus on arguments they can win. As above, there’s no argument to win on lies unless you have a transcription. There are arguments to win if you know whether they breached their own guidance and when there is clear factual evidence which shows they must be wrong. For example a wholly blind claimant for whom a HCP gave a Snellen reading was one I came across recently. The short answer is that you do an MR if needed and lodge a complaint if it can be evidenced but you stick to demonstrable facts not emotive unprovable assertions.
poppy123456 said: The assessment is not a medical, it's an assessment and nothing more.
sweet said: we know that that is impossible and hcp are not able to decide if you have mental problems unless you demonstrate it on the day of medical
we know that that is impossible and hcp are not able to decide if you have mental problems unless you demonstrate it on the day of medical
Username_removed said: Er, it IS the DM who decides. A HCP can only make a recommendation.
Username_removed said: None of those things were anything other than a functional assessment. A Physio or OT could ask you to do the same.
Username_removed said: I suspect part of the answer lies in the fact the OT assessment was a couple of years ago.
Username_removed said: The intent of PIP was for almost everyone to get a HCP assessment and for that to be repeated on review/renewal so... that’s why.In terms of depression you stand your ground and insist they listen to you explain it in detail and especially the bit about his you look not being who you are. There are several threads on here talking about how you look as though it has some influence. If a HCP is going to err and take a snapshot they’re going to do that regardless of what you look like and the only person who can stop them in their tracks is you, by talking.
Username_removed said: No one can do the taking for you albeit that you can take someone with you. Sad to say it may be best to let them see you triggered. A sad indictment of the process.
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