PIP, DLA and AA
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Should I appeal the PIP decision?

blueboy87blueboy87 Member Posts: 69 Courageous
edited August 2018 in PIP, DLA and AA
Hi my brother in law was on high mobility and middle care he applied for pip they have put him on standard for both his health is really deteriorating he had an operation on his spine he’s in more pain now than before he has heart failure osteoarthritis depression and syncope syndrome I asked for mandatory came back the same do you think he should appeal

Replies

  • Ami2301Ami2301 Community Co-Production Group Posts: 7,492 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @blueboy87
    Welcome to the community! Sorry to hear about your brother-in-laws situation. From reading other members experiences with appeals it can cause so much stress and frustration yet some win their appeals. I personally think he should get the higher rate.
    Ami :)
    Disability Gamechanger - 2019
  • Chloe_ScopeChloe_Scope Scope Posts: 10,652 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @blueboy87 and a warm welcome to the community! I hope the community is able to support you and help you make this decision :)
    Community Partner
    Scope

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  • Liam_AlumniLiam_Alumni Scope alumni Posts: 1,113 Pioneering
    Hi @blueboy87,

    Sorry to hear about the issues you've been having with PIP. We have lots of information about appealing a DWP benefits decision on our website, which might be of interest to you.

    I hope this helps. Do let us know if you have any further questions! :) 
    Liam
  • blueboy87blueboy87 Member Posts: 69 Courageous
    Hi @LiamO_Dell thanks I’m slowly finding my way round the forum 😊
  • Peasmold_01Peasmold_01 Member Posts: 144 Pioneering
    Appeal, the more people who appeal the greater the chance this benighted Government may change the criteria and their approach to the least able in society. It is costing the DWP more to fight and lose appeals than they are saving! Average ultimate cost to the Government of a successful PIP appeal, £20,000. C'est la vie 
    (Humans are the only animals that blush, or need to!) 
  • blueboy87blueboy87 Member Posts: 69 Courageous
    [email protected]_01 he is appealing but I think we are looking at next year for a date which is so frustrating 
  • YadnadYadnad Posts: 2,856 Member
     Average ultimate cost to the Government of a successful PIP appeal, £20,000. C'est la vie 
    It's not the government that is paying that it's the likes of me and the 1,000's of others in this country who are footing that bill through the direct and indirect taxes that we pay.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 6,010 Disability Gamechanger
    edited August 2018
    @Peasmold_01 your figure is way off beam. As if 2014/2015 the average cost of a social security appeal tribunal was £579 as reported in Hansard. 
  • Peasmold_01Peasmold_01 Member Posts: 144 Pioneering
    The figure I quoted came from the pro bono legal representative who represented me and helped to win my appeal on the 16th of August. His breakdown included the assessment, i.e the salaries, cost of training the assessors, their vehicles, their support team etc. The DWP staff and their systems charges. HMCTS and their system charges. The Tribunals, the three members of the tribunal, the building costs. (Our was in a dedicated Tribunal Building, nothing but tribunals) The security, the ancillary staff. The cost of the DWP Higher Officer reading through the Tribunals findings to see if they wriggle out of it. The analysis was, as far as I am aware, undertaken by students at our local University School of Law. The figures quoted relate to 2017/18. 
                        (Man is the only animals that blushes, or needs to!)
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 6,010 Disability Gamechanger
    Would be interested in a link to the published article if you have one as it’s a fine example of what happens when people with little real world experience tackle an issue.

    DWP contract the assessment companies so the cost of that contract needs to be divided by the number of assessments and then further divided by the specific number from that assessment centre which proceeded to appeal. Counting the salaries and training etc. is immediately double counting. You would presumably only count the appeals which fell out of that assessment centre. That data isn’t available. 

    A number of PIP appeals are heard by one person not three and I doubt there are figures for that breakdown. Similarly the cost of a tribunal with a salaried judge is different to the cost with a fee paid judge. You’d also hsve to divide by the number of appeals in a day or half day and that varies hugely. Add in the cost of additional hearings etc. 

    Whilst there a few dedicated tribunal buildings left the costs vary hugely. Few are owned, Most are leased. Security is not paid for by HMCTS.

    Then you have the thorny issue of “successful” appeals. Successful appeals can be a failure for the appellant and appealed further to UT. For example someone who goes from nothing to standard rate at appeal but who actually wants enhanced rate. So, define “successful”. I don’t think you can. Furthermore, the individual cost of a PIP appeal will vary with the amount of the award and the amount of the arrears. Absolutely no way of calculating any of that.

    So, at best, I’d say it’s 50% too high and at worst it’s even further out. As a unit cost the DWP figure is much closer to the mark. 
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