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ESA3(IBR) + Savings/Proof and What happens afterwards?

Chaoticmess
Chaoticmess Member Posts: 4 Listener
I've just received an ESA3(IBR) form and a ton of stress because of it. I've spent the last couple of days trying to understand the ins and outs of it and i think I've grasped some of it like how it's to see if I'm owed some money rather than the start of making a whole new claim which was my main stressor when i first got it.

Now however i find myself left with some specific questions about it. A lot of them revolve around my savings and the time period their now looking into.

The claim is from 2012 which is when i got transferred over from incapacity benefit and put in the support group for contribution based ESA. However I should have been put on income related ESA and received the enhanced premium benefit thing because I'm in the support group which i believe is what this whole back payment thing revolves around.

For some of this time period though I had savings over £5500, generally by about £1000-2000. This is where things start to get confusing.

The way i understand it is that the enhanced benefit payment I should have received as extra would have been around £15 but thanks to my savings of, let's say we take the highest point, £8000 I would have had that extra £15 reduced by £2500 / £250 = £10 a week leaving me with a remaining £5 a week not being paid me over this time period.

Is this correct and more importantly what this owed back payment will be calculated using resulting in me getting a lump sum payment in the region of around £1500?

Or is it more a case of the gov deciding to fork me completely by simply saying if i have/had over £5500 now or then I'm not allowed to get back what I'm owed? This is something I'm finding hard to pin down and understand.

My assumption is that, like I calculated above, I'd simply have the amount my savings would have  reduced the enhanced benefit by at the time i should have received it knocked off the full amount I'd have been owed otherwise (around £4600). Is this right?

I don't want to have to fill out the form and deal with the stress doing so comes with it only to find out afterwards that because i have savings over £5500 they automatically disqualify me.

Separate to this but also related, assuming I'm not automatically disqualified for having over £5500 in savings, the form asks for proof of my savings and gave an example of sending them a recent bank statement. This has confused me a little.

Can i just send them a recent bank and ISA statement showing them what my current savings are and that their over £5500? Or do i somehow need to prove/send them all of my finances since 2012?

It didn't seem very clear to me given how their example was to send them a recent bank statement. If all i do is that how do they work out how much I'm owed back from 2012?

And if I am meant to send them every statement since 2012 what do i do if i don't have them anymore? They  ask for original documents but everything's gone paperless these days and  I can't figure out if that simply means no photocopies or nothing that isn't generated by my bank?

Do they accept statements printed out via my online bank account? IF not how do i send them original documents unless i print them off?

My last question has to do with the final outcome. Obviously there are only 2 possible end results either they assess me and pay back what I'm owed or they say I'm not owed anything for some stupid reason.

I'm very confident however that I'm meant to be in the income related group and should be getting the enhanced benefit premium. I assume they must know/suspect this too otherwise they wouldn't have bothered sending me this form in the first place?

What i want to know though is regardless of what the outcome is, in terms of whether i get paid back what I'm owed or not, will I finally get switched from contribution based ESA to income related automatically and start receiving the enhanced premium benefit after this reassessment or will i need to do something else for that to happen?

Any help/guidance about any of these questions would highly appreciated.


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Comments

  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 28,628 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi,

    Firstly you have the savings figure incorrect. The bottom figure before it starts affect any means tested benefits you claim is £6,000, so £1 for every £250 over this amount. Living with a partner that works and other household income will also affect any income related top up you can claim.

    Bank statements will be needed. I'm not sure if they will accept them printed from online banking but i'm sure that won't be a problem. You'll have to prove the amount of savings/ capital and household income you have had/still have since 2012, they won't just take your word for it.

    If you're owed the money you'll receive it.

    You'll always remain on contributions based ESA for as long as you're in the Support Group. It will just mean you'll have an income related top up, if successful after you've been assessed.Savings/capital doesn't affect contributions based ESA only income related because it's means tested.

    The income related top up will mean you'll have free prescriptions, dental etc. It can take anything up to 12 weeks in some cases to assess you.
  • Chaoticmess
    Chaoticmess Member Posts: 4 Listener
    Hey, Thanks for the reply!

    The form states £5500 though. From everything I've read my assumption is that this is because during my claim period the lower threshold was £5500 and was changed to £6000 at some point so some of the time would still come under £5500?

    Ok, good. I think my bank lets me print off from as far back as 7 years ago. I bet they don't reimburse for the ink and paper used though! :)

    And just to clarify, having savings over £5500/6000 doesn't disqualify me and separate to the correct numbers being used the principle of my calculations are correct in regards to the way this back payment is worked out?

    So if successful I'll automatically be given the income related top up with future payments as part of this whole process? I won't need to do anything else?

    Nice to know the time frame, thanks, 12 weeks almost sounds fast considering its the DWP!


  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 28,628 Disability Gamechanger
    edited November 2018
    The upper limit cut off for savings is £16,000 what it was previously to this, i have no idea. Savings/capital over that amount and you won't be entitled to any means tested benefits. Under that amount and my reply above still stands.

    If they owe you anything then you'll be backdated what you're owed.
  • leannem85
    leannem85 Member Posts: 6 Listener
    Hi . Received an ESA3 form from DWP. Do they require bank statements if I have no savings ? Thanks Leanne 
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 28,628 Disability Gamechanger
    leannem85 said:
    Hi . Received an ESA3 form from DWP. Do they require bank statements if I have no savings ? Thanks Leanne 
    Yes, bank statements are to prove you don't have any and they will also be used to check if you have any other income. Bank statements will be needed for all banks accounts.
  • worried33
    worried33 Member Posts: 411 Pioneering
    edited December 2018
    First you submit the form.

    If you do it over the phone you will immediately be told what you need to send, if you send it by post you will need to wait for the form to arrive (the dwp are slow it can take weeks), then for someone to read it, and write back to you on what you need, I highly recommend doing it over the phone with them.

    I was over the £5500 limit for just 6 weeks out of 4 years and they told me to send in statements for the entire 4 year period however the tone in the guys voice suggested if some was missing they would let it go as he said "send what you can".

    Also I had a lot of issues getting my statements to arrive (I ended up sending twice).

    I would do it over the phone, and whilst you in that conversation try to ask for an email address to send it to, because doing it over the phone lets you speak to someone at the processing centre directly, not the basic call centre.  I discovered afterwards its very hard to get put through to someone in the processing centre the only time I spoke to someone there was when they did my form for me.

    Also I got told multiple times the 12 week countdown targets starts from when it goes to processing, so if it lingers waiting for you to send evidence then it could well be longer as that will slow it down, hence me suggesting to do over the phone.
  • leannem85
    leannem85 Member Posts: 6 Listener
    Hi Poppy123456 . Thanks for the reply . The ESA 3 form that iv received only asks for bank statements if I have/had any savings over £6000 ,I do not  have any savings. iv written that information on the form that  iv now completed . I’m confused as it says on the form bank statements needed for savings over £6000. ? It doesn’t say that I need to provide bank statements unless I have over the £6000 in any savings . Do I send bank statements along with the form ? Thanks Leanne 
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 28,628 Disability Gamechanger
    I'm not why you asked the question if the form tells you not to send them if you don't have over that amount.
  • leannem85
    leannem85 Member Posts: 6 Listener
    I asked because I didn’t know if they require bank statements For less than £6000. I’ll send my bank statements in with the ESA3 form anyway . Thanks 
  • wild_one
    wild_one Member Posts: 95 Connected
    Hi, I'm new here. I received an ESA3QR form back in November due to being migrated from IB to ESA. I've heard nothing, and I've contacted them just to confirm they had received it Nov 22nd. The form requested information for the dates between April 2012 and May 2016. During that period I had no savings (actually overdrawn) and no partner, just a dependant child at school.

    Would I be right in thinking that if I'm not due anything I'd find out quicker than if I am due something?

  • wild_one
    wild_one Member Posts: 95 Connected
    leannem85 said:
    Hi Poppy123456 . Thanks for the reply . The ESA 3 form that iv received only asks for bank statements if I have/had any savings over £6000 ,I do not  have any savings. iv written that information on the form that  iv now completed . I’m confused as it says on the form bank statements needed for savings over £6000. ? It doesn’t say that I need to provide bank statements unless I have over the £6000 in any savings . Do I send bank statements along with the form ? Thanks Leanne 
    I'm not an expert by any means, but I was always under the impression that the savings threshhold takes into account the total of all residents in the household, not just the claimant? Could be wrong?
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 28,628 Disability Gamechanger
    wild_one said:

    I'm not an expert by any means, but I was always under the impression that the savings threshhold takes into account the total of all residents in the household, not just the claimant? Could be wrong?
    Yes, you're wrong here. Savings are only counted if they are yours or your partners.
  • juneyred
    juneyred Member Posts: 2 Listener
    I am in the process of doing the esa3 form. I had a telephone call from them yesterday to say they had my forms but I had forgotten to tick 2 boxes. I had filled the form in correctly and used the page at the back to give them any other relevant details, I actually told them everything I could think of going back to 2012! I was not required to send any bank statements in as I had no savings. My forms are now been sent off for processing and it will take between 10 to 12 weeks to here from the assessors. I may be asked for more proof but it is unlikely, I was also told that the lowest payout was £1.47 and the highest was £40,000 but the average is £5000. I hope this clarifies things and if any body wants to know anything else please ask me as the gentleman I spoke to was very nice and helpful and gave me a lot of information.
  • belgiumbun
    belgiumbun Member Posts: 12 Listener
    Do you know if after receiving a payment say for an amount that takes your savings over the £6000 limit if this is disregarded in any way ? I heard this was only for  year at one point seems ridiculous as the money is an underpayment of their error ?
  • wild_one
    wild_one Member Posts: 95 Connected
    wild_one said:

    I'm not an expert by any means, but I was always under the impression that the savings threshhold takes into account the total of all residents in the household, not just the claimant? Could be wrong?
    Yes, you're wrong here. Savings are only counted if they are yours or your partners.
    So two individuals both on out of work benefits, on the same housing benefit claim, can each have up to £5,900 in savings?
  • wild_one
    wild_one Member Posts: 95 Connected
    Do you know if after receiving a payment say for an amount that takes your savings over the £6000 limit if this is disregarded in any way ? I heard this was only for  year at one point seems ridiculous as the money is an underpayment of their error ?

    I think it's another win for DWP. Let's be honest, if it was any other organisation they would 'proactively' assess the underpayment and send you a cheque with some flowers and chocolates. But DWP always look for ways around paying out, so they send a form because they know some claimants wont fill it in. They generate inertia, but taking 3 months to process the underpayments. Ask for meaningless information like bank statements, which they know claimants would have difficulty obtaining, even though DWP know exactly what they've paid you form there own records. Then, the last straw, when you do receive an underpayment it takes you over the savings threshold!
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 28,628 Disability Gamechanger
    wild_one said:
    wild_one said:

    I'm not an expert by any means, but I was always under the impression that the savings threshhold takes into account the total of all residents in the household, not just the claimant? Could be wrong?
    Yes, you're wrong here. Savings are only counted if they are yours or your partners.
    So two individuals both on out of work benefits, on the same housing benefit claim, can each have up to £5,900 in savings?
    No, that's not what i said. When claiming a means tested benefit savings are only counted for yourself and your partner...minimum being £6,000 per couple max being £16,000 whether you're a couple or single person. Different for those claiming pension credit.

    Savings from other people in your household aren't counted.
  • wild_one
    wild_one Member Posts: 95 Connected
    wild_one said:
    wild_one said:

    I'm not an expert by any means, but I was always under the impression that the savings threshhold takes into account the total of all residents in the household, not just the claimant? Could be wrong?
    Yes, you're wrong here. Savings are only counted if they are yours or your partners.
    So two individuals both on out of work benefits, on the same housing benefit claim, can each have up to £5,900 in savings?
    No, that's not what i said. When claiming a means tested benefit savings are only counted for yourself and your partner...minimum being £6,000 per couple max being £16,000 whether you're a couple or single person. Different for those claiming pension credit.

    Savings from other people in your household aren't counted.
    But I'm not 100% that is correct, especially where HB CTB is concerned. If they are living in the house they are part of the claim. Declaring 'everyone' that lives in the home and their income and savings etc? I'm pretty sure if my daughter inherits £50k from her grandfather it WILL affect my HB?

    But, I'm willing to bow to your superior knowledge.
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 28,628 Disability Gamechanger
    If your daughter is a non dependent then her savings won't affect your benefits.
  • Richard60
    Richard60 Member Posts: 4 Listener
    What does the DWP class as savings / income. Would an inheritance from a family will be classed as savings ?

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