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Assessor lied.

InShock
InShock Member Posts: 15 Connected
My partner recently had their pip assessment and a not long ago got their letter through saying they were awarding them 0 points. This floored us. To start with, my partner has multiple physical conditions that prevent them from doing tasks without help like cooking, dressing themselves fully, walking more than a few paces causes difficulty ect ect (I could go on but won't bore you)
Today we had the report through and in it the assessor has told multiple lies. One was about grip, she never asked my partner to grip her fingers but in the report it says she had and that they had done so without issue. She mentions my partner can walk to the garden gate (we don't have one) nor could they if we did. The whole report is scattered with lies.

I'm just wondering if anyone else has had this problem? My partner has put through the MR but we know because of the lies on the report that it probably won't change anything so are fully aware that it will probably end up going to appeal. I am worried that they will now take the mobility car that my partner relies on as they would be housebound with it. :(

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Comments

  • Ami2301
    Ami2301 Community Co-Production Group Posts: 7,946 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @InShock welcome to the community! Sorry to hear this has happened. Unfortunately, many of our community members have experienced this too, so you're not alone. Keep us updated and let us know if you have any further questions :)
    Disability Gamechanger - 2019
  • cristobal
    cristobal Member Posts: 987 Disability Gamechanger

    @inshock - my assessment had a number of ‘mistakes’ in it. I recorded mine so these were easily identified but I was surprised to find that some of the answers that I was convinced that given weren’t actually what I'd said as well!!

    It’s very hard to do when you’re angry and aggrieved but I’d advise that you try not to concentrate too much on the lies/ errors/ mistakes. For MR tell them where you think you should have scored points and didn’t - the descriptors are available on line.

    I can’t remember now whether you’re allowed to send in additional evidence but someone on this forum will know…


  • InShock
    InShock Member Posts: 15 Connected
    Thank you both. We have the report so will be sending it off with the additional evidence and hope they will consider it with the MR, doubtful by the sounds of it but we can but only hope at this stage, regardless we will have no choice but to take it all the way to appeal. I just hope my partner doesn't end up in hospital because of the stress involved.

    We will also be drafting a letter of complaint to Capita tonight along with a letter of complaint to the Nursing and Midwifery Board. I have read a lot on forums to not concentrate on the lies//errors/untruths in a report, but why should these be allowed to be dismissed? I do get that it helps not to focus too much on them when putting your case forward but it's hard not too when it's obvious the lies from the asssessor are what ultimately made DWP come to their decision.



  • twonker
    twonker Posts: 617 Connected
    InShock said:
    Thank you both. We have the report so will be sending it off with the additional evidence and hope they will consider it with the MR, doubtful by the sounds of it but we can but only hope at this stage, regardless we will have no choice but to take it all the way to appeal. I just hope my partner doesn't end up in hospital because of the stress involved.

    We will also be drafting a letter of complaint to Capita tonight along with a letter of complaint to the Nursing and Midwifery Board. I have read a lot on forums to not concentrate on the lies//errors/untruths in a report, but why should these be allowed to be dismissed? I do get that it helps not to focus too much on them when putting your case forward but it's hard not too when it's obvious the lies from the asssessor are what ultimately made DWP come to their decision. 
    The DWP are supposed to weigh all of the evidence and not just rely on the assessor's report
  • cristobal
    cristobal Member Posts: 987 Disability Gamechanger
    InShock said:
    We will also be drafting a letter of complaint to Capita tonight along with a letter of complaint to the Nursing and Midwifery Board. I have read a lot on forums to not concentrate on the lies//errors/untruths in a report, but why should these be allowed to be dismissed? I do get that it helps not to focus too much on them when putting your case forward but it's hard not too when it's obvious the lies from the asssessor are what ultimately made DWP come to their decision.
    @inshock - you must do what you think best. The reason I suggested not to concentrate too much on the assessors behaviour is that is exactly what I did, and looking back I think that I should have used my time more positively.

    I made a complaint to Capita and was fobbed off at every stage. Their initial response was essentially several pages of what their procedures were, and when they did address my specific complaint they said that the assessor "couldn't remember". 

    Good luck with you MR - I hope that things go well for you...


  • braca
    braca Member Posts: 102 Connected
    I do not believe assessor's actually lie in their reports to DWP regarding PIP claim, they themselves are under time restraints and probably just had quick glance at your doctor/consultant reports ( yes wrong ) the F2F is your chance to put your view across about the difficulty you have with daily activities, A lot of claimants let assessor take the lead and they in turn apply their own opinion to drop down box answers, good luck with MR
  • InShock
    InShock Member Posts: 15 Connected
    "I do not believe assessor's actually lie in their reports to DWP regarding PIP claim, they themselves are under time restraints and probably just had quick glance at your doctor/consultant reports"

    We don't have a front garden gate. My partners numerous pills are not all for a heart condition. Some medication wasn't even listed on the form even though they had the information before the appointment and was given it again at the appointment. I could go on but i feel my time would be more useful on the complaint forms at present.

    "The DWP are supposed to weigh all of the evidence and not just rely on the assessor's report"

    Yes I do hear that is what they are supposed to do.

    I do appreciate the responses given. .

  • Antonia_Alumni
    Antonia_Alumni Scope alumni Posts: 1,781 Pioneering
    Welcome to the community @InShock I am sorry to hear the outcome of the PIP assessment. Please keep us updated on how it all goes. We have some videos on our YouTube channel on appealing, that you may find useful. Also, you can get some support from your local CAB.
  • twonker
    twonker Posts: 617 Connected
    braca said:
    ........the F2F is your chance to put your view across about the difficulty you have with daily activities, A lot of claimants let assessor take the lead and they in turn apply their own opinion to drop down box answers, good luck with MR
    That is correct, that is how an assessment should be carried out. 
    Unfortunately many assessors are not really that interested in what you say unless it agrees with what they think. Many will put pressure on the claimant to give the answer they want. Also they do have a habit of moving to the next question without allowing the claimant to give further information/explanation. It is supposed to be a two way conversation but in many cases it isn't.

    You could say that it is a battle as the assessor wants to regain and retain the lead in the assessment process despite it being the claimant's assessment. 
  • madquasimodo
    madquasimodo Member Posts: 127 Courageous
    I think in all fairness all assessment should be recorded, then both parties are covered, its so easy to have a script prepared in your head, thinking you have covered everything, only to be put off guard by a random question and lose track of what was said. been there and done it, I think most people know the F2F assessment is hit or miss, 

    "The DWP are supposed to weigh all of the evidence and not just rely on the assessor's report"

    We all know this should but doesn't happen, I and my partner have had detailed medical evidence totally disregarded, the assessor report on the day can overrule any paperwork you supply, it shouldn't happen but does, in my partner case the DWP own Disability Analyst Doctors report was tossed aside and ignored, the assessment on the day overruled the doctors report, all because a ex Nurse/physio decided she knew better, still waiting for a day in court to test this out and see who's right. 
  • InShock
    InShock Member Posts: 15 Connected
    "I think in all fairness all assessment should be recorded, then both parties are covered"

    I agree 100% with this.
  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 587 Listener
    I actually recorded my home assessment on the 4th because of all the stories I've been seeing about assessors. I'm not saying it's going to help but at least I have some sort of proof as to what I said, although the assessor did recap/read out a lot of the things he's typed out.

    Very sorry that this has happened to your partner :(
  • twonker
    twonker Posts: 617 Connected
    edited April 2019
    InShock said:
    "I think in all fairness all assessment should be recorded, then both parties are covered"

    I agree 100% with this.
    I can understand where you are coming from, but there are many people who would 'freeze' at the thought of being recorded be it audio, video or both. Besides which do we really want to be heading towards police type interviews? The answer I believe it that everyone should be given a choice. You should not force people to undergo a recorded assessment if it would upset them. I would strongly refuse to have any form of recorded interview/assessment for the reason I have mentioned above - I am not a criminal and as such I don't expect to be treated like one.
  • InShock
    InShock Member Posts: 15 Connected
    twonker said:
    InShock said:
    "I think in all fairness all assessment should be recorded, then both parties are covered"

    I agree 100% with this.
    I can understand where you are coming from, but there are many people who would 'freeze' at the thought of being recorded be it audio, video or both. Besides which do we really want to be heading towards police type interviews? The answer I believe it that everyone should be given a choice. You should not force people to undergo a recorded assessment if it would upset them. I would strongly refuse to have any form of recorded interview/assessment for the reason I have mentioned above - I am not a criminal and as such I don't expect to be treated like one.


    I get your point. Really I do , and yes a choice should be given so those who don't want it recorded can opt out but my partner would of preferred to have had it recorded. As it's the errors made by the assessor which have caused them to go from higher rate mobility to 0 points.
  • justg72
    justg72 Member Posts: 173 Pioneering
    Hi Inshock
    The same happened to myself when i read the report and my friend who came with me, both of us thought there must have been a mix up or we must have been in a different assessment. I just can't believe that they are still getting away with it. If we did it we would be done for fraud!
    I am currently waiting for my tribunal next month. I put a complaint in and I.C.E. are now investigating as DWP did nothing!
    I hope you all the luck with the MR and hope points are changed. I went from enhanced for both to 0 points.
    I know most are winning their tribunals, however its the length of time you have to wait which is too long.
    Good Luck

  • InShock
    InShock Member Posts: 15 Connected
    justg72 said:
    Hi Inshock
    The same happened to myself when i read the report and my friend who came with me, both of us thought there must have been a mix up or we must have been in a different assessment. I just can't believe that they are still getting away with it. If we did it we would be done for fraud!
    I am currently waiting for my tribunal next month. I put a complaint in and I.C.E. are now investigating as DWP did nothing!
    I hope you all the luck with the MR and hope points are changed. I went from enhanced for both to 0 points.
    I know most are winning their tribunals, however its the length of time you have to wait which is too long.
    Good Luck



    I really hope you win your tribunal. I am surprised that they are allowed to get away with this. Reading through the form does make it look like the assessor is typing about somebody else 75% of the time. My partner is in their 60's. The wait (as I'm sure it is for everyone in the same situation) is going to be really hard.
  • Heket
    Heket Member Posts: 2 Connected
    It is possible to find online the training manual for the assessors.
    Write requesting Mandatory Reconsideration, detailing where and how the assessor failed to act in accordance with their own training protocols.

    KEEP COPIES 

    Head every letter and email Without Prejudice

    Conclude by stating that you intend to continue on to Independent Tribunal.
  • wildlife
    wildlife Member Posts: 1,308 Pioneering
    edited April 2019
    @braca Sorry haven't read the whole discussion but some ASSESSORS most definitely DO lie !!!!!   Mine saw me place a water bottle between my legs to do a 2 handed exercise. On my report under informal observations she wrote that I was handed a water bottle by my husband and using my right and left hand I peeled off the plastic label whilst holding it between my legs. 1. I've tried this and it's almost impossible to do as the label round the middle is inaccessible. 2. It's the top you open to get a drink. 3. I was assessed as having no cognitive impairment. 4. She got the idea from the brief time I put the bottle between my legs. 5. It was written to give a reason why I had no problem using both hands to do something fiddly. THIS NEVER HAPPENED. What more can I say...
    @InShock you are perfectly right to separate the MR with DWP and the lies by complaining to Capita. Anyone reading this can also bring a case against their assessor to ICO who regulate the Data Protection Act. I did this and the outcome was a rejection for the individual case but they said if they got enough complaints about any organization they would investigate their way of handling personal data. When assessors lie like this they are contravening the Act which clearly states that information collected and used about any person should be correct and if not they will be forced to change it. 
  • Heket
    Heket Member Posts: 2 Connected
    They also allow you to record the assessment, except they only store their copy for 14 months, knowing it takes at least 18 months to get to Tribunal.
    Sneaky.
  • madquasimodo
    madquasimodo Member Posts: 127 Courageous
    I keep seeing this "cognitive impairment" being mentioned a fair bit and its a trap, the argument seems to be "you can argue your case and understand the question" "you manage to drive, that requires a high level of mental and physical coordination" "you filled in the form and managed to appeal it, therefore you have full mental ability"
    I just had a massive row with my other half, she didn't understand we had to wait for a banking pass to access the account online, its long and complicated but since her operation anything to do with money or forms she cannot cope with at all.
    She no longer could do a stocktake or get the best interest rate, or work the best deal on a credit card, I have to explain some letters, if she trys and reads it first off she panics and think its saying something other than it really does say.

    F2F she passes as no cognitive problems fully alert, truth is different since her operation she has no concentration, get angry when she knows something is not right and wont take any explanation.
    Snapshots don't tell the whole story. 

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