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I didn’t loose everything.
yanhow1
Member Posts: 22 Connected
Three yrs ago when I was assessed for PIP for the first time after being on the highest rate of DLA for 20yrs, I got 8 points for la and 10 points for mobility which was awarded for 3yrs, even after a valiant attempt from the assessor to totally discredit me.
Now I’m up for a review which is pretty much going through the whole thing again.
I’m now worried that even though my condition has deteriorated significantly I will get less points this time because of perhaps a bad assessor/assessment.
Has anyone had this happen to them?
Do the DWP look at their last award before making a decision and if they don’t, is it worth pointing out for the MR that they award more last time for a lesser condition?
Does anybody think a tribunal would at leased uphold the last award points with the same if not better medical evidence?
thanks
Now I’m up for a review which is pretty much going through the whole thing again.
I’m now worried that even though my condition has deteriorated significantly I will get less points this time because of perhaps a bad assessor/assessment.
Has anyone had this happen to them?
Do the DWP look at their last award before making a decision and if they don’t, is it worth pointing out for the MR that they award more last time for a lesser condition?
Does anybody think a tribunal would at leased uphold the last award points with the same if not better medical evidence?
thanks
Replies
If your case was one that was changed at MR stage or at a Tribunal they would not see that information. So say that the original assessment advised 0 points and at a Tribunal hearing you were awarded enhanced for both, none of that would be available to the assessor.
Many claimants on this site have reported exactly that happening - 'how can I go from enhanced care & mobility to nothing even though my health and impact has deteriorated so much?'
From what you say the AR1 is compared to what the eventual award was, do they also consider the original assessor's report?
Many cases happen where the assessor does not award any points and consequently the DWP go along with that recommendation. With the MR the claimant then convinces the DWP that the report is both factually and suggestingly wrong on many aspects. The revised award now gives enhanced care & mobility.
Does the assessor also consider why this change happened?
I am also concerned that you are viewing the claimant on that day and at that time. Are you suggesting that if they look to have no problems in that 30 mins assessment then they should have no problems at all?
Personally I wouldn't like the job of an assessor. You have the assessor looking for traits and signals whilst you have the claimant doing their damned best to appear as normal as they can be. I know I would. The last thing I would want is to appear a bumbling idiot in front of a stranger.
I have been told by psychiatrists, psychologists, CPN's and OT's that in psychiatric terms deception and avoidance are some of the tools you quickly learn when dealing with the mental health system.
Unfortunately it doesn't really help the patient. I spent the best part of 10 years learning the art of deception and avoidance when talking to the many mental health professionals I have been involved with. The best place to hone those skills is when you are under section (why am I in here? Everyone's gone mad and I am the only sane one!)
The assessor would have one hell of a job trying to look for the traits and signals from how I speak, how I act and what I say. Even on this site what you see from my posts is not me, not the real me, I build up a persona totally the opposite to the real me. In a way it is self protection.
I have every sympathy for most assessors when faced with people who have deep seated mental health issues.
Lastly you put so much emphasis on written evidence yet there are people who've been given the enhanced rate of both with no evidence whatsoever.
I do like your comment about how people should view PIP. No doubt it would help everyone if the DWP put that comment 'PIP is not supposed to be a long term benefit for those with mental health issues' on the PIP 2. It might just deter those that do see it as one and expect a lifetime award.
However I do believe that what you meant to say was that whilst a mental health issue may well be a lifetime issue, the impact of it is more than likely to be short lived. In other words people find a way around the difficulties they face in time.
I genuinely believed that if you didn't make a claim for a deemed impact (descriptor) the assessor is under no obligation to consider that area of need. Much like you don't claim you don't get even if the need/impact is pretty obvious. Put it another way and if we go with how you used to assess there is no real need to complete the PIP2 at all. Just turn up at the assessment and let the assessor decide what they should be awarding.
I don't see the need to ask my very busy GP for a letter as you mentioned when other evidence I've submitted says the same thing. You may be interested to know I could not ask my GP for a letter for PIP because back in 2017 she told me that DWP had been told by Gov. not to expect letters from GPs,and that they had to believe what people were telling them (her words not mine). There should be enough information on anyone's medical records along with other evidence to make GP letters specifically for benefit unnecessary.
There are some amongst us who are not that honest.
Obviously to weed them out, everyone is treated the same way - prove that you should be believed.
As an example the guy two doors up put in a claim (he actually asked if I would help him!) setting out that he can't walk beyond 10 metres, so he said. Yet every Saturday morning in go the golf clubs and off he goes for a round of 18 holes.
Thankfully he failed simply because he had no evidence to back it up - he just assumed that he would be believed.
It stands to logic that if no award is recommended it just isn't possible to recommend that they review years later. The assessors report should just leave that part blank. Who on earth dreamt up that barmy situation?
I still would like to know what evidence will be accepted as per regulations to be able to avoid doing the exercises? How often do we hear of assessor's saying the claimant refused even when a good reason was given backed up by medical evidence. How do we avoid this happening @ilovecats
To me this makes a lot of sense - the effect of one condition will be different, dependent on the individual.
It may not be ideal but I think that it's better than just saying "if you've got x then you get PIP"
Functional evidence - I used a report from an OH specialist as to why my loss of functionality meant I couldn't remain in employment. Also a diary, which I used to evidence how I couldn't carry out tasks due to tiredness.
I agree that a letter from a wife/husband must rank at the bottom of the pile: of course they are going to agree with what you have put on the claim form.
Same goes for a diary. I could dream up various scenarios on a daily basis that over a period of time would show me to almost be a vegetable.
As an ex assessor, what independent evidence and where may it be found that would satisfy your requirements at the assessment, or indeed at the stage of reviewing the PIP2 prior to a face to face assessment being called for?
I have already mentioned letters from friends and family that are obviously supporting of what is claimed as well as a diary maintained by the claimant over a couple of weeks which may or may not be a figment of their imagination?
It could, of course, but I think that most people are still honest. As well as supporting my application my diary helped me in the F2F as I knew for a fact how often I did x,y,z...
Lots of the posts on this forum start with "I've got x,y,z and got 0 points!!"
I've never seen one that says "I thought that I should have got x points, and I only got y", which would be very helpful to know..
I take co-codamol issued by the GP so I must be disabled.
Realistic expectation? I have none when it comes to the DWP. I doubt that the assessment report will be realistic given that past experiences tells me so - expectations, it is best not to expect anything, that way if you do get something it is a bonus.
I do always take the easy way especially where the DWP are involved. I have more going on in my life than worrying about benefit awards or even preparing for an appeal hearing. I get what I am given and am thankful for whatever it is.
I guess you have to put them over your head and wriggle them down into position? I know that sounds ridiculous but then so does assuming you can dress the lower part of your body because you can touch your knees sitting down.
No points were given for the bath due to the same justification
Fortunately for most there is no requirement to spend any of the PIP award on aids etc. The claimant can spend it on anything they like. Some use it to top up their housing benefit, some use it to buy IT equipment for their kids, some use it for more holidays, whilst some use it to pay for a more expensive car. Consequently they would/should still qualify for aids as they would need them and they have not been provided.
3yrs ago I got 10 points for mobility for various reasons, one of them being I said I could walk 50mtrs, ( 20mtrs was not an option on the form ),
I said that at the time because I could walk about 30mtrs before the pain was simply too much to bare and I had to stop putting weight through my left side,
in reality though I could not walk 1mtr without really quite bad pain surging through my left side,
Is pain on the first step and every step after that enough to fit the 12 point descriptor ? Obviously with a consultant’s report for evidence.
what I mean is, should I have to push through the pain to the absolute limit or is the first painful step the limit?
Is long term pain a good reason not to be able to walk 20mtrs?
I too have often wondered where pain comes into walking which also depends what surface you're walking on. An uneven pavement would be more difficult than an even, flat surface for example.
I still ticked 50mtrs because I thought it meant: how far can I walk to the absolute limit of my pain threshold.
nevertheless the question remains: short of paralysis or double amputation what is a sufficient reason to not be able to walk 20mtrs?
if pain is not a valid reason then I am at a total loss as to what other possible explanation could there be?
It's the level of pain I would consider. Many people can walk with the odd twinge or ache which is different to when pain is so overwhelming that you physically cannot carry on. I explained to the assessor that when I reached that point I had to take some Morphine that I always carry around along with my 'Diabetic kit' and inhaler to break through that pain. In reality my pain starts after a few seconds, maybe 5 or 6 steps but I measured it to the point that I could not move any further.
The result of which I was told that I could walk between 50 and 200 metres which is true.
At the end of the day it really doesn't matter what you say, the proof is in the pudding so to speak.
You will have to show with evidence and on the balance of probabilities that you cannot walk the particular distance you have claimed because of the pain factor.
I put it down to my clumsiness and not looking where I am walking.