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Eligible for PIP?

cristobal

@ilovecats pointed out (on another post) that 'not everyone who applies is eligible'. Fairly obvious you would think but I wonder if, in an attempt to be supportive and offer advice, we all realise that?

Some posters on here, having being knocked back but DWP, post 'I applied for PIP and got 0 points'. Very few say how many they were expecting to score.

Did they expect to be awarded 4 points and get 0? (in which case the result would be the same i.e. no award)

Or were they expecting 14 points and get 0? (in which case they should, if they were correct have been given 'enhanced' and in fact got nothing)

I've had my issues with the assessors - mine was done badly and i won't bore you again with the detail - but I wonder if it's worthwhile bearing in mind that some people just don't qualify, and it's not bent. lies, or lack of evidence from their GP/ consultant?

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Comments

wilko

Reading posts as we all do we must wonder why did they apply for PIP in the first instant. Was or is it to top up their income. Or the thoughts of a free car. How many times have we seen I need 2 points to get a car. To many go to an assessment and for what ever the reason get refused PIP when they fit all the boxes is it their fault or the assor or the preparation for the assessment we only see the negative posts not enough of the positive good results.

Fetlock

I think a lot of people don't understand the descriptors, of even look at/consider the descriptors in the first place so in some cases are set up to fail before they start.

I've done this myself - not for PIP but for ESA. It never crossed my mind to do any research or prep beforehand. I just asked for the form, and off I went.

Some-or perhaps I should say many- don't understand the basics of PIP - that it is about how a condition or disability affects a person and not about diagnosis.

I think many are unsuccessful because they genuinely don't realise that the onus is on them to provide the evidence and think that because the form asks for GP/consultant (etc) details that they don't need to. I do think on this one this needs to be made much clearer on the appication form, especially considering the applicants may in many cases lack the understanding.

CockneyRebel

Many people with long term conditions have learnt to live with what they have. Frequently, the impact is played down as coping mechanisms come into place and so they appear to be more able than they really are. Not wanting to be seen as being disabled can lead to an inaccurate assesment of their condition.

On the other hand, some people play up their condition to a point where they believe they are impacted more than their condition would suggest. To these people the HCP can often deliver a reality check.

There are of course chancers, scammers, layabouts and downright dishonest people that will try their luck for a few extra quid

Not everything on the internet is always as it seems. We are not here to judge but we do have to take what is written at face value and try to offer help and advice in the best way we can even if this is not what the claimant wants to hear.

bigglesworth

I think part of it is because of how inaccurate the reports tend to be.

If you had a well written report that clearly took all the issues into account and then provided a detailed breakdown of why you have not been able to score then it would be hard to argue against it.

But when you have a report which is full of made up stuff that could not be observed during an assessment, assumptions and then more assumptions based on these assumptions and then decisions made because of these assumptions then it just makes it look like the decision was made based on a story rather than what was discussed in the assessment.

I don't think it should be left to the claimants to write applications that fit the PIP descriptors, it should be the assessors jobs to understand how a claimants difficulties fit with the descriptors instead.

The HCP persistently fail to take into account all material provided to them, they also fail to contact GPs or specialists if they need further information and instead just make decisions based on the lack of information.

I get the impression that some of the assessors think that only the severely disabled should be getting PIP, if this was the case then there would not be upper and lower awards.

The amount of reports of lies from assessors is quite staggering, I do not feel all these assessors are dishonest, it's probably more a case of Hanlon's razor "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence.". In this case either the assessors are not provided enough time or have not received enough training to provide accurate reports and so the mistakes are seen as being lies. It could also be the case that after seeing so many claimants, the assessors just become indifferent and choose to spend as little time as possible writing up reports.

My own report contained fabricated employment history which was used against me as evidence to say I was not as bad as I say. I have been unable to correct this issue as when contacting the DWP, I get told to complain to the report provider regarding any report errors. If I contact the report provider, I get told that whoever told me that is completely wrong and once the reports are issued, they are out of their hands. I tried to bring up this finger pointing with the DWP but I was then told that complaints about reports are only valid if the assessor had acted inappropriately during the assessment.

My complaint to the report provider was also shot down because apparently the assessors are too highly trained to ever make a mistake and everything they state in the report is purely factual, whereas the claimants and their specialists views on the difficulties they encounter are only opinions or hearsay.

So from my point of view, the assessors are free to make reports as inaccurate as they like as the claimant has no grounds to go against them and get the assessment reports corrected.

twonker

bigglesworth said:

I don't think it should be left to the claimants to write applications that fit the PIP descriptors, it should be the assessors jobs to understand how a claimants difficulties fit with the descriptors instead.

The HCP persistently fail to take into account all material provided to them, they also fail to contact GPs or specialists if they need further information and instead just make decisions based on the lack of information.

I get the impression that some of the assessors think that only the severely disabled should be getting PIP, if this was the case then there would not be upper and lower awards.

I made that same comment earlier. Given what the claim form is used for and how it is used leads me to the conclusion that claimants should just tick the boxes that apply to them and send the form back. They have never read my claim forms when you look at the assessors reports. Surely it is their job to elicit information from the claimant and based on what they hear write the report based on it.

Ironically when PIP first came out it was supposed to be that the DWP/assessor was responsible for collating evidence from various sources. If you look at the PIP1 form it asks who they should they contact to get this evidence This is well before you make the actual claim PIP2 where they ask the same question. In fact in the first review carried out to look at PIP and how it was working it is clear who should be gathering evidence. Over time this has gradually changed to a point now that the claimant is being made to supply the evidence.

It is not just the assessor that thinks like that, both the DWP and the government have that opinion. Not long ago there was an official comment regarding who should be getting PIP. It was said that "PIP should only be awarded to the most seriously disabled and deserving amongst us". To put it bluntly the government and the DWP both think that it is wrong for claimants with piddling excuses of so called disabilities being awarded any PIP. They even tried to stop people getting an award just by having 4 simple aids at 2 points each. They wanted to reduce all aids to be given 1 point each.

tcellmutation

I got a great award!

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