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When will they just leave him alone

melissahicking2019
melissahicking2019 Member Posts: 128 Courageous
Hi, im relatively new to this forum after a long battle with the DWP for A friends PIP .

My friend is a sever schizophrenic with Serious problems, i wont go to much into it, but at his worst i was his main carer for over 2 years because his condition was so serious that the only way to stop him being sectioned was to look after him full time. 

Unfortunately my own condition has deteriorated to the point of going onto dialysis and transplant list , and so i had to stop being his carer and he now has to fend for himself, stuck in a flat suffering with schizophrenia and severe depression along with daily (and i mean Daily) panic attacks with a severe psychotic / schizophrenic  delusional influence, Along with a clawed hand and no movement in his hand , a long term prescription  abuse problem , severe malnutrition and severe dyslexia, his dyslexia and mental health is so bad that at the age of 7 he was placed into a special needs school (residential) where he stayed over until the weekends up until he was 16yrs old. where upon he left school to be dragged down into the pit of society suffering with all his long term problems that only progressed into more serious complex issues later on in life.

More to the point..

After years of neglect and problems, he eventually got the adult help he required in the form of social workers , care workers, psychiatrist , and medication, although his mental health has never gotten any better along with his dyslexia and clawed hand , he has (WITH CARE) managed to live a slightly comfortable life. he was placed onto disability living allowance , then onto incapacity benefits, then onto ESA and then eventually onto PIP. 

After about 4 years of getting the help he needed, The system changes and along came CAPITA to destroy what foundation he had in his life. They took him off PIP and he struggled on by on ESA for over 18 month while I MYSELF went through an Appeal with the DWP that was rejected and so we went to a tribunal. The tribunal took 1 look at his history and evidence and gave him back his PIP and Even gave him mobility lower rate.

Well That made my life alot easier as i no longer had to do all the paperwork and fight his corner for him, He got alot of backpay that just gets filtered away Daily by his brothers who take full advantage of him and his benefits by turning upto his flat Making out they are therer to look after him while at the same time Robbing him of what money he has to support their Drink and drug addictions, Whilst at the same time Doing everything they can to get him on The same drugs and destroy his life further more.

Iv done everything i can about his brothers but theirs nothing little old me can really do. Apart from Sectioning my friend for his own sake.

So. As i say, he was award his PIP back after a lengthy Battle with DWP.

Now the reason why im back on this forum.

Just when i thought i could leave my friend alone to live his life, along comes another letter. only 2 months after winning his PIP. for an ESA (HEALTH ASSESSMENT ADVISORY SERVICE APPOINTMENT) 

They now want to robb him of what little hope he has left and probably take his ESA away from him (Unless something is done to help him approach this Appointment correctly) And if they take his ESA away he will no doubt loose his PIP and be back to square one ..

THANKS DWP.. THANKS FOR HELPING THOSE WHO REALLY NEED YOUR LONG TERM HELP.

Im sure if the PIP system is anything to judge by , that this ESA appointment will yet again Throw his life back into the Creek and I WILL HAVE TO AGAIN fight in his corner for the next god known how long, with My own illness to worry about.

WHY THE HELL CANT THEY JUST ACCEPT THAT A COURT OF LAW HAS DEEMED HIM UNABLE TO WORK AND AWARDED HIM FULL PIP

is that not enough proof in itself .

Well  obviously not, the system is HELL BENT on getting all the really ill people back into work no doubt.

Anyway. im here for advice.

Does my friend have to attend.

Can we get a home visit or a phone appointment , As i cannot take him myself due to my own ill health. Therefore He would have to attend himself, Well that's a really bad idea. Hes a complete recluse and goes nowhere without at least one of his brothers for Mental re-assurance and protection from His Paranoia and The Bullies that pick on him and take advantage of him because he's VERY DIFFERENT

He shouldn't have to be going through this so early , right after winning a PIP tribunal, Its disgusting.

This system is not helping. its doing everything it can to rob really ill people of the help they need.

Im sick of it.. 

But i cant just give up on my friend..

What can i do.

How should we approach this.

Will his PIP and recent EVIDENCE from doctors psychiatrists ect help, Can we submit them.

Can we refuse the Appointment and request that he have a PHONE INTERVIEW or a HOME VISIT.

What if they do the unthinkable and take him off ESA

will he loose his PIP

I really need advice and help.

Otherwise, im going tro have to go through the whole process again. And i just cant do it anymore.

I need Help. He Needs help, and this System needs to back of those who have been JUDGED BY A COURT FOR PIP.

When will it end..

Thank you for any advice.





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Comments

  • michfinch
    michfinch Member Posts: 173 Pioneering
    You poor thing and your poor friend. There are people on here better placed than myself to help, although I’m in a mental health situation myself.
    I’m arguing with Govt re CAPITA being able to overrule my Dr’s FIT notes and my Specialist’s Reports. I now receive PIP. Poppy seems to be the person here with all the info... Good Luck :-)
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 29,631 Disability Gamechanger
    HI,

    That's a lot to go through and i remember your previous threads about his PIP Tribunal.

    Firstly, PIP and ESA are completely different benefits. For PIP it's not about not being able to work, the Tribunal wouldn't have made their decision based on this. People claim PIP and work.

    ESA is about your ability to do any type of work and this is what they will assess him on. Sadly, most people have to go through assessments regularly for ESA and they can assess you anytime from 3 months.

    The form will need to be filled out and returned with all his evidence by the date stated in the letter. As he has mental health problems then DWP may have a note on the computer stating this, if they do then the rules for returning the form are slightly relaxed BUT it will still need to be returned. If it's not then he won't be assessed correctly.

    He can use the same evidence he used for the PIP claim. He can send his PIP award but it may or may not be used because as advised, they are different benefits with different criteria.

    You can request a home assessment but he'll need a letter from his GP stating the reasons why he can't attend the assessment centre. If he attends other appointments then this can go against him. They don't do telephone assessments.

    If a face to face assessment is needed and it's not suitable then please be aware that you can only cancel an appointment once. I'd advise you to request the home assessment when filling out the form and send the letter from his GP with it.

    If the worst happens and he's found fit for work then his PIP will not be affected because they are different benefits.

    When filling out the work capability assessment form i'd advise you to put as much information as possible but try to be as straight to the point as much as you can. You want them to read it, if there's too many pages of writing it's possible it may not be read. Less is often more, so bare that in mind too.

    It's totally possible to have a paper based assessment because it does happen, in my opinion it happens more with ESA than it does with PIP but others may disagree. If a paper based assessment is done then remember, you can't be found fit work without a face to face assessment.

    Good luck and hopefully it will be nothing to worry about.


  • Dithreabhach
    Dithreabhach Member Posts: 7 Connected
    The system is evil! There's are a few good support and advice groups on Facebook. If you like I can give you links to them in a message. They are Closed groups to protect members confidentiality and details. Best wishes Cal Dithreabhach. 
  • melissahicking2019
    melissahicking2019 Member Posts: 128 Courageous
    edited August 2019
    Yes Poppy is a great help, if it was not for her i would not of known what to do and how to go about it. luckly i found this forum and i got the advice i needed. However the system just does not care how much suffering it puts us all through, as long as they are getting as many people off benefits to fulfill their obligations to the government so they can fund their Bogus War for a NWO.
    It really does make me sick to think my grandfather and my forefathers all died and fought battles for our freedom, only for the millenniums to robb us all of it again and then put our kids through the same war. Supposedly for "OUR FREEDOM"

    Yet at the same time they create s system hell bent on taking really ill people off their benefits and putting them through a life changing shift of benefits just to support thier wars...

    Well im sick of it.. My Kids aint Going to fight their war... and neither am i.

    They can fight it on their own if they cant look after us correctly.

    Iv got my own war to fight....

    Unfortunately its against the DWP at the moment for my own Freedom and my friends.

    They Soon tell us its a fight for freedom , yet they know little about our struggle we have to go through for their freedom.




  • melissahicking2019
    melissahicking2019 Member Posts: 128 Courageous
    edited August 2019
    Im ready for giving up... And my friend, well. If they take him off it again, Hes going to have to go into Hospital. there really is no other option anymore... This is going to kill either me or him in the long run eitherway.

    They really dont understand that no matter what way you look at it. we are fighting for our freedom and our lives.



  • melissahicking2019
    melissahicking2019 Member Posts: 128 Courageous
    edited August 2019
    Can anybody answer me this, 

    If they take him off ESA (which in all honesty i doubt, But you never know with this system)

    Will they take him off his PIP because of not receiving ESA


    Also , WHY THE HELL ARE THEY DOING THIS ONLY 2 MONTH AFTER WINNING A PIP TRIBUNAL.

    IT MAKES NO SENSE, OTHER THAN THEY JUST WANT TO TAKE HIM OFF ESA AND PIP AGAIN.

    AND WHAT HAS PROMPTED THEM TO DO THIS, JUST AFTER WINNING A PIP TRIBUNAL.

    THE EVIDENCE WON HIS TRIBUNAL FFS.
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 29,631 Disability Gamechanger
    As previously advised, if the worst happens and he's found fit for work then his ESA stopping will not affect his PIP, that will continue. They are completely different benefits, with different criteria.

    The reason why he's being assessed for ESA so soon after the PIP Tribunal is because they are different benefits and they can re-assess you anytime from 3 months.

    Do be aware that if his mental health causes him to be violent and there's evidence of this then they may refuse a home assessment because of their safety.
  • melissahicking2019
    melissahicking2019 Member Posts: 128 Courageous
    Yes he does get violent when pushed into a corner or deliberately threatened, but most of the time he is very placid and dormant and wouldn't hurt a fly.,

    Literally, he makes friends with all the flies that end up in his flat, and the spiders lol. wont let me clean them for him either.. But yes he can be violent but only when  being pushed about ect, otherwise hes  a simple innocent kinda guy.

    Thank you for  your help poppy, we both appreciate it.

  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 29,631 Disability Gamechanger
    You're both very welcome. I know exactly what it feels like to have these constant re-assessments and yes they are a worry for everyone.

    Best thing you can do is take a deep breath and try to relax just a little (very difficult i know) but stress doesn't help anyone and the form won't go away. I'm assuming you're going to be filling out the form for him? If so then do a little at a time, don't get carried away writing things that aren't relevant and try to keep it as straight to the point as possible. Add some real life examples too will also help and just do a couple of questions a day, then put it away until the next day. Do this until the form is complete.

    The gather all of his evidence but read through it first to make sure nothing contradicts each other. Grab a highlighter pen if you need to, to highlight the areas in the evidence that are the most relevant. This way the evidence will stand out more and they won't have any option but to read it (hopefully)

    Hopefully it will be a straight forward process and there will be nothing to worry about. Do let us know the outcome and  if you need further advice, i'm here somewhere. :)
  • Chloe_Scope
    Chloe_Scope Scope Posts: 10,555 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @melissahicking2019, I'm so sorry you are having to go through it again with your friend. I imagine it's very frustrating! Like Poppy has said, unfortunately they are two different benefits and can be assessed at different times. I hope the process goes a smooth as possible and please do let us know if you need any help. :)
    Scope

  • melissahicking2019
    melissahicking2019 Member Posts: 128 Courageous
    Thank you all so much, without your help i would loose sleep.

    Poppy,my friend did not receive a form to fill in, should he have been sent a form along with the application.
    where do we get this form, and can we provide evidence with it.

    thank you poppy

    Quote " I'm assuming you're going to be filling out the form for him? If so then do a little at a time"
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 29,631 Disability Gamechanger
    Are you 100% sure that no form has been received? Are you sure that he didn't "hide" it somewhere because he was scared? You need to ask him if he definitely hasn't received the form. Unless the forms have been returned months ago and you can't remember, i've heard of this happening before.

    As he's claiming for mental health then this would be noted on the computer with DWP so not returning the form will not have gone against him, which is why he's received the appointment date, even though no form's been returned.  For those with mental health if no form is returned then they will go ahead and send an appointment out.

    It really does help to have the form to fill in and return with all the evidence to support the claim. Otherwise they will go on the form that was filled out the last time.

    For work capability assessments it's the health assessment advisory that send out the forms, not DWP. If nothing's been received then ring them first thing tomorrow morning. Telephone number is with this link. https://www.chdauk.co.uk/contact-us

  • melissahicking2019
    melissahicking2019 Member Posts: 128 Courageous
    He has definitely not hidden it because he brought me the unopened mail to read for him, Also this is not a claim for the benefit, he has been in the support group for years now, and we where told that he would not have to ever again attend any further assessments ect. But now this letter came telling him to attend . Im not even sure why hes having to do this. its not a new claim or anything.
  • melissahicking2019
    melissahicking2019 Member Posts: 128 Courageous
    edited August 2019
    the letter is for a HEALTH AND DISABILITY ASSESSMENT



    The only recent claim made was for his SDP

    There are no other claims, and like i said he is in Support group for ESA and has been for years and now this came out of the blue.

    Im going to ring with him tomorrow and im going to send all the evidence that Won his PIP appeal ect.

    They will see from that his LONG TERM illness from Childhood until Present day.

    They can think about that for a while and take his Severe Mental Health into consideration before arranging a Home visit or a telephone appointment.

    Other than that i dont know what else i can do for him. He will yet again have to do the appointment by himself, and hopefully his evidence will speak volumes for him as he looks fine until you take a deeper look into his history and if you catch him at home or on the street in a state of delusion / panic / anxiety / any of his many states of mental illness.

    Its not fair on him really to judge him by his appearance, but that is exactly what CAPITA did last time, and so we went through an appeal and WON because of the evidence proving beyond any doubt that he has had serious problems since childhood.

    anyway, yet again the DWP threaten his life and relative freedom again.  Not to mention my own personal time and attention.

    He should be a permanent PIP ESA SDP claimant until his condition either miraculously Changes for the better or he Ends up Sectioned.

    But no, the DWP would rather just ruin his life for him over and over again and give him no peace of mind or sense of security for the future.

    Even after proving Long Term Illnesses with Severe Recent Problems.

    When will this Attack on him end.

    All he wants is Peace of mind. But the DWP are not helping him this way at all.

    In fact they make his condition And my own 10 times worse as we get no Peace of mind and have to continuously worry about financial stability, his flat, his health and his future benefits.

    On his own he would not stand a chance and the DWP would walk all over him, Just like they have done so many times in the past until We all got together and helped him in what we thought would be the last time, But no...DWP want it to be a life long struggle for us all...

    Thanks DWP for making our lives a continuous Struggle for peace of mind and freedom.



  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 29,631 Disability Gamechanger
    Please take a deep breath.

    Yes, it's ESA. Everyone being re-assessed for ESA should receive the work capability assessment form (ESA50) i know it's not a new claim. The ESA50 form isn't a new claim form.

    The only ones that will never be re-assessed for ESA as those that are placed into the severe conditions group after their next assessment. They added this rule in October 2017 but very few people are placed into this group and i've only ever heard of 3 people.

    Please be aware that they don't do assessments via phone call, that's why it's called a face to face assessment.

    When you ring this morning its the assessment providers you need to ring not DWP. The number is on the top of the letter he received.


  • melissahicking2019
    melissahicking2019 Member Posts: 128 Courageous
    So can i ask why are you asking if we have a form to complete, and where is it. we got no form.. Thanks poppy.
  • thespiceman
    thespiceman Member Posts: 6,389 Disability Gamechanger
    Hello @melissahicking2019   Pleased to meet you.

    Sorry to hear about your friend.

    Please can I ask is he receiving any help and support with his mental health.?

    Have the support teams been notified about the situation he is going through.

    They should be helping with this situation of your friend.  Benefits and everything around it you need to talk to his support team.

    If he is not or does not have any one who is supporting him.

    Then please have a look at this mental health charity.

    https://www.richmondfellowship.org.uk.

    I used them. My self.

    Having and gone through the same as your friend.  Know the system of benefits.  Been doing this a long time.

    See what they can do this charity. Often useful to get guidance, advice and wellbeing on your friends mental health . Plus any floating support or outreach workers.

    Help with assessments and any benefits.

    Might not be in all areas.

    I hope this helps you.

    Please take care.

    @thespiceman
    Community Champion
    SCOPE Volunteer Award Engaging Communities 2019
    Mental Health advice, guidance and information to all members
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  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 29,631 Disability Gamechanger
    Because the usual procedure is to send out a work capability assessment form for the re-assessment to take place. It's not an application form for a new claim.

    The reason i asked if you're sure it wasn't received and returned is that you'll be very surprised the amount of people that receive a form, fill it in and return it but they don't know what it for. It's also possible to forget you did this, especially if it's been several months that it was returned. It's very easy to forget what you do everyday, i know i forget lots of things, especially when i have lots going on in my life.

    Ring the health assessment advisory service and ask if a work capability assessment was received. If it wasn't tell them that no form was received.
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 29,631 Disability Gamechanger

    If they tell you it wasn't received you can print that one, fill it in and take it to the assessment with all the evidence. Or, cancel the appointment while you fill it in and return it but you'll need to ask them what the address is because all areas are different.

    Remember you can only cancel an appointment once.

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