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Hi, my name is stacey1991! How do I report someone who receives PIP?

stacey1991
stacey1991 Member Posts: 1 Listener
edited November 2021 in PIP, DLA, and AA
Hi how do I report someone on pip that is capable to do everything 

Comments

  • janer1967
    janer1967 Member Posts: 13,424 Disability Gamechanger
    As above unless you know everything about this person and how they are against the pip descriptors they may well be entitled 

    People go through a very rigorous process to be awarded pip that unless you have been through you wouldn't be aware of 

    You should research pip fraud if you truly believe this is the case but they will only investigate if they think it is a valid case 
  • lili8719
    lili8719 Member Posts: 16 Connected
    edited November 2021
    (Removed by moderator, personal attack towards another member)
  • DuffersMum
    DuffersMum Member Posts: 196 Pioneering
    I think it’s an horrible thing to do to someone...someone reported a friend of mine and it caused them so much stress and anxiety...thankfully the DWP are usually aware when it just someone acting maliciously due to an argument/jealousy etc but they have to look into every single person who is reported.

    I would never dream of doing something like that because as mentioned in the replies above, unless you live with that person on a 24/7 basis you really don’t know the ins and outs of how their condition affects them. 
  • woodbine
    woodbine Community Co-Production Group Posts: 6,145 Disability Gamechanger
    edited November 2021
    (Removed by moderator, personal attack towards another member)
    Please be nice to new members 
  • Ross_Scope
    Ross_Scope Posts: 5,790

    Scope community team

    edited November 2021
    Hello and welcome to the community @stacey1991

    As mentioned by others, many disabled people have "invisible impairments" which means that their condition is not immediately apparent, and you might not visibly be able to see how it impacts them on a daily basis. Often, this can lead to incorrect assumptions that a person is lying about or exaggerating their condition, which is not the case at all. You may have seen this recent campaign that Scope ran alongside ITV, which shines a light on invisible impairments, see the below YouTube video:



    I'm not sure how well you know the person you are considering reporting, but if it is somebody you perhaps aren't familiar with I would encourage you to consider that you may not be seeing the full picture of how their condition or conditions impact them. That may even be the case if you know the person well.

    If you do believe that somebody is committing benefit fraud, you can view details on this page about reporting it.

    Also, I just wanted to let you know @woodbine and @lili8719 that I have removed comments of yours from this thread for being personal attacks towards another member. I can understand the sensitivity of the subject for everybody who has commented, but that is no reason to make inappropriate remarks towards anybody, let alone a new member.
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  • mikehughescq
    mikehughescq Member Posts: 8,389 Disability Gamechanger
    All of us have invisible impairments. Every one of us has some aspect of even the most obvious visible health condition which is largely or entirely invisible to others. 

    That said, whilst I wholly concur with the reactions of others here, I’m not sure I’d react so viscerally so I’m glad to see @Ross_Scope has posted the link. 

    It’s important to remember that almost no-one who reports fraud can ever be 100% certain that fraud has taken place but if we needed to be 100% certain then lots of actual fraud would go unreported. I’m also not so sure I’d be so quick to slaughter new posters who may actually have a case for reporting. I’d perhaps first engage in a discussion about what it is they think they know.
  • Sillymoo007
    Sillymoo007 Member Posts: 26 Connected
    I reported someone a few years ago. Now,I knew for certain there was nothing wrong with her. She had her finger in every pie,knew every trick in the book. She was also a prolific high end dog breeder and shower. So much so that she had a lavish lifestyle that we could only dream of. She claimed for so many different illnesses and her attic was full of binbags stuffed with unused medication. Do you know what happened...nothing. She continues to run rings around HMRC and DWP. I didn't do it maliciously. This woman is draining the tax payers purse. 
    I knew the woman on a familiar personal level. I knew she wasn't ill,disabled,single and not earning.I would not advocate reporting due to a grudge etc. Invisible illnesses are real,but so are benefit cheats.  I wouldn't hesitate to do it again. 
  • woodbine
    woodbine Community Co-Production Group Posts: 6,145 Disability Gamechanger
    edited November 2021
    If I was out of order I apologise , but it is a subject that makes my blood boil, thankfully not something we see very often on here. Although it's odd that the OP has only been back to read two replies.

    I'm out of this one  B)
    Please be nice to new members 
  • Sandy_123
    Sandy_123 Member Posts: 2,510 Pioneering
    That reminds me of when I was at work 1 day, a colleague who worked in a different area, one day demanded to know what was wrong with me as she had been refused pip. I mean, literally looking me all over. From head to toe. Of course I didn't tell her, yet she didn't realise the adaptions put in place, or that other colleagues did the things I struggled with.  She also wasn't at home with me when I could only manage a few  Steps to get to the loo. But she figured I looked OK.
  • mikehughescq
    mikehughescq Member Posts: 8,389 Disability Gamechanger
    edited November 2021
    I reported someone a few years ago. Now,I knew for certain there was nothing wrong with her. She had her finger in every pie,knew every trick in the book. She was also a prolific high end dog breeder and shower. So much so that she had a lavish lifestyle that we could only dream of. She claimed for so many different illnesses and her attic was full of binbags stuffed with unused medication. Do you know what happened...nothing. She continues to run rings around HMRC and DWP. I didn't do it maliciously. This woman is draining the tax payers purse. 
    I knew the woman on a familiar personal level. I knew she wasn't ill,disabled,single and not earning.I would not advocate reporting due to a grudge etc. Invisible illnesses are real,but so are benefit cheats.  I wouldn't hesitate to do it again. 
    Here’s the thing. This is a near prefect example of where people repeatedly get this embarrassingly wrong. That thing you “knew for certain”. It turns out that you maybe didn’t. One point at a time then.

    1 - how did you “know for certain”? Did you have access to her medical records? As all conditions have an invisible element and this person allegedly had multiple conditions then access to her medical records would be the only possible way to know anything for certain. Everything else is vicious gossip and hearsay. 

    2 - judging people’s health by their level of activity is, bluntly, incredibly poorly informed. Are disabled people not allowed a public life? Crikey, best get reporting every Patalympian on benefits. Many peoples lives are profoundly changed for the better by seeing people with their health conditions leading a public life. The use of terms like “prolific high end” and “lavish” says more about being judgemental than actual knowledge. 

    3 - you cannot claim “for so many different illnesses”. You get PIP and some version of ESA/UC and that’s it. Doesn’t matter whether you have one condition or twenty. These benefits have always been based on the consequences of conditions rather than the conditions themselves. So, we can say with 100% certainty that, contrary to your assertion, she cannot possibly have been claiming “for” conditions. That is something which is impossible. It’s never existed. 

    4 - let’s say she did make claims based on the consequences of her conditions. Have you watched her toilet? Seen her bathe? Seen her do therapy or take medication at home? Prepare food? Budget? What’s her reading like? Those are some of the descriptors for PIP. If you can’t say “yes” to any aspect of my preceding question - and let’s be honest you can’t can you - then you have close to zero basis for saying she wasn’t entitled to benefits because you’ve somehow managed to not realise that you actually know a small percentage of her circumstances and a small (at best) amount about benefits. 

    5 - I absolutely love the “attic full of binbags stuffed with unused medication”. That is priceless. That’s not an indication of a fraudster. That’s a better fit with a very Iill person and one possibly with a hoarding tendency. If you were going to commit fraud then generally speaking you obviously wouldn’t take those prescription meds but nor would you store them up? Why indeed would you ever store them up unless it was a cry for help or you were so screwed up you wanted to be caught. Again, a judgement is being made. If I came across a friend with bin bags of medication in their attic my starting point would be to report that to their GP and maybe the police/social services for a welfare visit. Silly me.

    6 - how do you know who she is running rings around? As well as her medical records do you have access to her tax and claim records? Again, it’s a judgement. She’s claiming benefits and you believe she’s not entitled. Phrases like “draining the tax payer’s purse” also involve judgement. How on earth can you assert such a thing? Because you know her on a “familiar personal level”? What does that even mean? You pass her on the street? You’ve been in her home? Well, obviously you’ve clearly been in her attic? 

    7 - the piece de resistance. She’s not just frauding them by claiming to be poorly when she’s not. Now we discover that her being single is a problem. So, you also know that she’s cohabiting? Apparently working is also a problem. That’s three alleged frauds. Does that seem likely? Given that you’re citing HMRC then presumably she’s working and getting Working Tax Credits? That won’t have been based on her ill health and will most likely be entirely legitimate. Unless of course you have access to her accounts. You don’t? Oh. 

    You obviously wouldn’t advocate reporting fraud based on a grudge. Glad to hear it but do you seriously think it’s credible that this person was committing three different sorts of benefit fraud and yet when it’s reported there is no prosecution?

    There are lots of things wrong with the way DWP and HMRC address benefit fraud but failing to act on reports has never been one of them. If you report it then it will always be investigated. However, you believe not only that your judgements on this person are justified but now you want us to believe that DWP/HMRC have somehow been duped. You also want us to believe that you’d do it again. Why would you report it again if you have judged DWP/HMRC to essentially be easy to fraud and then dupe?

    Finally, how do you know this person got away with anything? Just because you don’t know about any fraud action does not mean it didn’t happen. Indeed if there were any substance to your allegation of three frauds then it most likely would have. What if on the other hand DWP pursued recoverable overpayments? How would you know about that? 

    Does it still all feel like stuff that is known? 

    By all means report fraud if you believe there has been a possible fraud but make sure you know at least one “fact” before you do.
  • Sillymoo007
    Sillymoo007 Member Posts: 26 Connected
    I'm not even going to read that passive aggressive novel @mikehughescq.i knew because I was her sister in law. She actually gloated and not only told me,but many people about how she got away with it.
    I'm not thick. She was a benefit cheat and it wasn't just one benefit it was multiple!!!
  • mikehughescq
    mikehughescq Member Posts: 8,389 Disability Gamechanger
    edited November 2021
    You’re not even going to read it? There was nothing passive aggressive about it. It was overtly anti people saying they know things they cannot. I won’t be apologising for that. On the other hand responding to something you say you’ve not read is a brilliant act of passive aggression. 

    I do wonder if people realise that when people tell others they’re frauding the system just how unlikely that is to be true. It couldn’t possibly be a defensive way to avoid dealing with the truth of embarrassing health conditions or to get in with a group of people who might otherwise not welcome you? Or indeed any one of a hundred other obvious reasons. 

    I’ve worked with benefits for 35 years now in a wide variety of contexts. Have come across benefit fraud in many forms, rarely individual, but I don’t know anyone who boasted about being a fraud who actually was a fraud or who thought the best way to hide their fraud was to be open about it and store the evidence upstairs. That suggests a MH issue more than fraud. Certainly don’t know of any real case where it was reported and didn’t turn into at minimum a recoverable overpayment. Nor do I know of anyone else across the UK who has had that experience. People who report “fraud” always either “know” or are daft enough to take everything they’re told at face value. The rest of us? We know nothing and we must be utterly naive and absolutely thick. 
  • Libby_Scope
    Libby_Scope Posts: 757

    Scope community team

    Closed - pending review. 
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