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OCD PIP award - short term again?

griff11

Brief summary. Adult daughter had 2 year award ending Feb 2022 of enhanced for both due to OCD. No review was new application (previous thread here https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/comment/464851#Comment_464851). Just had two letters - I am here appointee. First letter enhanced DL & standard mobility from Dec to Feb 2022, so reduced current award,
Then enhanced DL & standard mobility till Nov 2024, should I challenge period of award as she's had OCD since young teens so over 10 years. Only claimed PIP in last 2 years as it's got much worse since late teens but despite having a disabled student award at 19 no one told us that she may be entitled to PIP - she's mid twenties now, and we just supported her. I know it was our responsibility to find out entitlement but I thought it was just for physical disabilities.

Anyway do I appeal as last time I was told I should have continued appeal as length of award too short.

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Comments

calcotti

You can appeal if you wish to. The first stage is to request a Mandatory Reconsideration.

If you do not wish to have any other aspect of the award looked at again make clear that you are only challenging the length of the award and do not refer to any other aspect of it (to do so would be to invite it being looked at again).

Of course, if you do wish to challenge the level of award as well as the length you can do both. However I note that the reduction is on the mobility section as a result of dropping from 12 to 10 points. If these points were scored based on whether or not she can leave the house or needs to be accompanied that may be correct. This is because if she could previously leave the house but needed to be accompanied she would have got 12 points whereas if now she cannot leave the house at all (on the majority of days) then she would only get 10 points.

griff11

GP has changed /added to her meds so she will now go out in car with her hubby driving but still won't get out of car. This aspect we are hoping will improve as they've added a anti anxiety pill to help especially with transition to new anti depressant. Previous ones she's coming off caused insomnia when they upped does 6 months ago and never improved .

calcotti

If there is a suggestion in the information you provided that her ability to do things may change that could be a justification for a short award.

poppy123456

griff11 said:

GP has changed /added to her meds so she will now go out in car with her hubby driving but still won't get out of car. This aspect we are hoping will improve as they've added a anti anxiety pill to help especially with transition to new anti depressant. Previous ones she's coming off caused insomnia when they upped does 6 months ago and never improved .

If that change in condition was after the assessment took place then this won't be taken into consideration. If you're hoping her condition will improve, so she's able to go out with support then you need to think whether the longer award would be appropriate here.

A longer award length is only given if no change in condition is expected.

griff11

What I'm trying to avoid is the stress of repeating the process. Last time when I posted she had 2 year award I was told I was wrong to accept it on this forum. OCD is life long, it can't be cured but you have to find coping mechanisms. They are thinking the increase in her medication and side effects opposite effect so hoping the change will get her back to how she was before. Not good but at least she would let people in her house and leave it.

Shes had to terminate her online counselling due to cost - £120 a session and they said without 2 sessions a week it would be ineffective. She's had her 8 sessions on nhs a few years ago. She's seeking a new counsellor in new year that she can afford. She's more wary now as discovered that a counsellor she saw for a week intensive therapy in February 2020 and paid almost £3000 misrepresented her qualifications & experience and is being investigated. She only found out a few weeks ago and told me she thought all this time there was something wrong with her as she didn't benefit from the week. She's been blaming herself all this time . She's still using the APP from the expensive counselling for exposure therapy but currently it's telling her that her anxiety too high to do them . She doesn't have low level issues to start with ! It's all high level . Hopefully with her husband home for Xmas break he can support her as she tackles it.

I've spoken at length with her today and she's happy with level of award and pleased she's avoided the upset of last time when she had zero points before MR & appeal as she gets upset with lack of understanding of OCD and the original decision was so brutal in dismissing her health issues .

poppy123456

griff11 said:

What I'm trying to avoid is the stress of repeating the process.

I understand that but a longer award is usually only given if conditions are not expected to change. You've already said that you're hoping her condition will improve and hopefully she will be able to go out with support, which could mean Enhanced mobility next review.

griff11

Thought it easier to add to this thread. It's been suggested to me that I do a change of circumstances for my daughter as things have changed. Her OCD has been so debilitating that her psychiatrist has changed her medication twice and has recently added an antipsychotic to try to help. Her previous change in meds January this year has helped her engage with a private OCD coach - video sessions and since about May has been leaving the house with only her husband after work or at weekends. Generally just for a drive but built up to going for food but can't be local - she cannot return to a place shes previously visited as she feels she's contaminated. Still no one allowed in her house and all her medical appointments are via phone but she will have to attend a medical for ecg now she's started these new meds. Her husband has exhausted his annual leave so she's agreed I can take her (not sure this will happen as panic attacks still frequent). She has tried a day out with us - we all went by train over an hour away to outdoor concert. We booked 1st class but she had to leave early and couldn't return by train so they booked an Uber . She's struggling holding down her job, she works from home, but her employer been good. Her psychiatrist had told her to reduce her hours drastically but she's trying not to. CMHT worker had a chat with me about applying for PIP but as per per above until Nov 2024 she's on enhanced care and std. mobility. They said she should be entitled to enhanced mobility. I'm loathed to do a COC in case she loses the lot as this money been essential to pay for therapy, extra high utility bills - still very long, multiple showers each day, excessive hand washing, laundry etc. plus taxis as she struggles to really struggles using public transport. She's has a few attempts on train, none on bus. She will only travel with her husband.

So question. As she had a second short award will I get a review form before Nov 2024 or will it be another new application? Am I right to just sit tight with what her current award is?

Hannah_Alumni

Hello @griff11

With it being such a complex situation I would encourage you to reach out to Citizen's Advice for clarity. They may be able to support with a change of circumstances too.

Can I ask, have you got support?

griff11

Her support system is her husband and myself. She is now under care of psychiatrist again even though a bit of a gap as original retired and not reallocated so GP referred again, Then new one went on extended maternity and replacement had zero understanding of OCD so we requested a change. She's only had 1 appointment with new one so far but she showed more understanding of condition. I try to support her husband on a practical level by doing things like shopping, cooking a meal now & then organising prescriptions- used to be easier before pharmacy stopped doing repeats. Main support to her though is being on the end of the phone daily though my husband is really good at this too. My hubby disabled too so I'm his carer. I make time for myself doing adult education craft classes. The new company the best part of it as we all have our issues be it tired carers, mentally drained, or anxiety sufferers. I find it hard to burden my family & friends but my new buddies it's like we need & understand each other and what got us yogrthrt. Even through summer we've been meeting for lunch, theatre etc.

I'm quite good at fighting others corners as I worked public sector for 40 years before retirement. I just found claiming PIP a very stressful process as while I understand they need to ensure claims are genuine its quite a brutal process as you have to focus on the negatives where in real life we try to focus on positives.

nasturtium

Hello griff11

I am going to post a few links that you might find useful

This link is information about Descriptor 6 (Dressing and undressing I think) but it would apply to all of the physical daily living activities https://www.a1benefitsupport.com/group-file-28-ocd-can-get-points

PIP Info website that includes case law for OCD and PIP https://pipinfo.net/conditions/obsessive-compulsive-disorder

Hope that helps

Nasturtium

griff11

Nasturtium

Thank you for those links. I had seen the bit about timely manner for things like bathing and dressing before and ensured on her application form (second time) I fully explained how she tackled these activities by literally asking them through the hesitation to shower, items she took in, how many times she washed her hair /body, what happened if she made a "mistake " in her routine. Until 2 years ago she lived with us so I observed how long she takes it shower, how much shampoo et she uses etc. plus then the clean clothes put in laundry because there was something wrong with item so for me it was easy to write form based on her typical day. My daughter is very intelligent so she has a good understanding of her disorder so I typed up my answers to each descriptor & emailed to her to see if I'd covered correctly, if there was anything she wanted to add or take out. This was our second time applying . First time 2 year award at enhanced on both but only after I submitted appeal ( original 0 points, then 4 after MR). DWP changed their decision before appeal. Second time as things worse and no longer living together, her husband working full time plus studying DWP suggested I become her appointee. I did telephone assessment and found the assessor understanding of condition and she had her award after assessment but her mobility reduced to standard because at the time she refused to leave house at all.

chiarieds

griff11 said:

So question. As she had a second short award will I get a review form before Nov 2024 or will it be another new application? Am I right to just sit tight with what her current award is?

If the end date of your daughter's current award is Nov 2024, then currently I believe review forms are being sent out about 8 months beforehand. You should, however treat this review as if it were a new claim form detailing her problems. On the other hand you could do a 'Change of circumstances,' where a new claim form would be sent out.....so both needing a similar response, & either could leave her award similar, or not.

The advice of both poppy & calcotti is still relevant. On the one hand having to go through PIP claims is stressful at the best of times, but it does make sense that your daughter got a short award last time. On the other she 'could' be better off financially if you did a CoC.

My question would be 'can she go out with the support of her husband or yourself the 'majority' of days?'

The best I can suggest is to try & find some expert local advice from here: https://advicelocal.uk/welfare-benefits if there's a Welfare Rights Office near you, or whom you could contact, all to the better, before considering a CoC.

Please don't think I don't appreciate that your daughter's OCD is debilitating, & ongoing, but it's whether she still fits into descriptor e or if it would change to f; the difference between 10 & 12 points & between the standard & enhanced rates, as you'll know.